Caught on tape: 5 self-serving responses by sex offenders in the church

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Video Shoot - photo courtesy of Serge De Gracia via Flickr

Video Shoot - photo courtesy of Serge De Gracia via Flickr

I recently discovered a video of a convicted female sex offender that was posted by her church.  At first glance, some may think this is a wonderful video about God’s love and redemption. However, a closer look exposes something much different.

Video Shoot - photo courtesy of Serge De Gracia via Flickr

Video Shoot – photo courtesy of Serge De Gracia via Flickr

Though I don’t know the intended purpose of this video, its unintended result is that it provides at least five self-serving responses by sex offenders in the church. So perhaps one redeeming consequence of this highly troubling video is to teach us more about the distorted beliefs and understandings perpetrators have about the crimes they have committed.   Let’s take a quick look at these five responses:

  1. The “I’m just not that person anymore” response: This is when offenders claim that they have recently “accepted Jesus” and are not the same person that committed the sexual offense. This type of self-serving statement subtly distances the offender from involvement and responsibility in the very crime he/she committed.  The offender in the video may be a new person in Jesus, and her position before God may have changed (that is between her and God).  However, she remains the person who sexually abused a child and that must never be forgotten by her or those around her.
  2. The “I understand” response:  [tweetable]Sexual offenders often attempt to convince others that they understand the harm they have caused to the victim.[/tweetable]  In the video, the offender remarks, “I understand the pain and bitterness I have caused”.  Is this any different than a murderer telling the parents of the person he murdered that he understands their pain? Really?? This appearance of empathy for the victim is usually motivated by the desire to develop sympathy for the offender.  Such self-centered statements often achieve the desired result from church members, all the while re-traumatizing the victim.
  3. The “I was inappropriate” response:  [tweetable]Sexual offenders often label their abuse in non-abusive language in order to minimize the gravity of their offense.[/tweetable] During the video, this offender repeatedly described her acts of raping a 14-year-old boy as merely, “inappropriate” and “selfish”.  At no time does she ever even use the term “abuse” or even refer to her behavior as “criminal”.   This is a teacher who was convicted of “engaging in a sexual act or deviant sexual intercourse” with a minor student.  We must never allow offenders to get away with trying to water down the criminal reality of their actions. This offender’s behavior was light years beyond inappropriate and selfish. It was a serious felony.
  4. The “I am a victim” response:  [tweetable]Sex offenders often attempt to gain sympathy by portraying themselves as a victim of their own weaknesses and struggles.[/tweetable]  This is demonstrated clearly in the video when she says, “I had insecurities, I had pain in my own heart and a void I thought I needed to fill through attention and all kinds of other things.” Such statements victimize the perpetrator while also shifting attention away from the immeasurable damage they have caused. Perpetrators understand that a crime that has two victims, instead of one victim and one perpetrator, makes their life much easier.
  5. The “make the victim feel guilty” response:  Within the church, it is not uncommon for perpetrators (and others) to infer that the trauma victims experience as a result of the abuse is due to their own spiritual weaknesses.  At one point in the video, this offender remarks, “I pray that each of you be free of the pain, bitterness, anger, anxiety…these are not things from God.”  Going back to my murder analogy, how would parents react if the person who killed their son tells them that their anger and pain is not of God?  Such statements are self-serving attempts by the offender to cause immeasurable guilt in an already traumatized victim. Perpetrators do this in order to silence victims.

Do you notice how each response keeps the focus and attention on the offender?  These responses clearly demonstrate that most child sexual offenders are extremely self-serving and dangerously manipulative.  It is critical for faith communities to recognize these characteristics and how they influence the way offenders think, act, and respond to abuse.

A better understanding of these vital truths may have propelled this church to focus on loving and serving a 14-year-old rape victim, not posting a re-traumatizing video it tragically celebrates as being the work of God.

  • Thank you so much for shining a light on the distorted dynamics at work in the voice of this child sex offender AND in the decision of the church to post the video as though it were demonstrative of “grace.”

  • By the time this pastor or church may ‘see’ the injustice, it will most likely have been festering under the surface as unchallenged, unchecked, and tolerated for years.

    Thank you, Boz, for being the person who the sake of preventing future survivors and for past survivors of these crimes who not only ‘see’s’ but takes these crimes seriously by challenging the crimes before, during, and after these crimes have manifested.

  • Thank you.

  • Rachel

    Oh, yes. We who have been wounded by abusers in a Christian setting have heard all five of these before. Thank you Boz, for shining the light of truth on these five self-serving responses. They bring no healing to the victims or their families. Ugh.

  • Shary Hauber

    Boz you are correct that video is a trigger for all who have been abused. This is not grace from God. There is no evidence that she has changed just her words. If she had really changed her talk would have been centered on the victim and what she was doing to make things right. Praying for someone is a non action, just saying words to someone invisible and asking the invisible person to make everything right. Christians wake up your God is invisible to the non believer and talking to him does not make you righteous. If you pray for someone you don’t brag about it. If you are guilty of a crime shut up and take your punishment. Don’t go make a speech to make people feel sorry for you. In this video she is doing nothing more than she admitted at the beginning drawing attention to herself that has not changed. Only difference is she has now found a acceptable way to do it. In the process she has hurt many more. Will she now make another video and apologize to all those abused who she purposefully hurt.

  • Excellent and succinct response to an appalling travesty of an apology, Boz. Thank you.

  • Mike Sloan

    Thanks Boz for you excellent insight into this damaging response by a naive church. I believe the humility of true repentance would look exactly the opposite. I would be much more likely to believe she is truly contrite if she said, “I clearly have not understood how damaging my actions have been and I believe it is going to be a long road for me to get to a point where I do understand.”
    I wish the pastor understood the damage that his public “rallying around” the offender does to victims. The phrase cheap grace comes to mind. I understand wanting to make the point that salvation is unmerited by us, which is true, but certainly this is not all the Bible says. The Bible never says God loves us no matter what we do, quite the opposite. It says without faith it is impossible to please God, and faith without works is dead. It says without holiness no one will see the Lord. It says many will claim a relationship with Jesus but Jesus will say to them depart you who practice lawlessness.

  • Learning to be a survivor

    This video has been something that has really confused me. I was so confused as I watched it. I kept wondering why I wasn’t happy that this woman “confessed”, “repented” and experienced forgiveness.
    As I have tried to sort through my confusion, I can only liken it to covering a gaping, gangrene filled sore eating away at someone’s flesh with a band-aid. It seems that the response of the pastor and woman completely ignore the magnitude of the horrific crime committed. There seems to be no understanding that she hurt this young boy in a way that seems the equivalent of murdering his soul.
    It isn’t that I don’t want this woman to find forgiveness from God, but it seems she and the pastor have completely ignored what she actually did, the damage she actually caused.
    I watch the video and realize that watching it causes me to question God. Does he care about victims? It doesn’t seem right that the perpetrators can always just say they are sorry, ask God forgiveness, then go live their lives loved by the church, forgiven, free, accepted, etc. That is NOT the experience of victims. We struggle, often alone, isolated, rejected by the church. We are seen as messy, our hurts and confusion something that the church turns away from. It seems that they have no answer or hope for the victims. They see us as lepers and turn away from our pain. Instead, they embrace the perpetrators.
    This has been something that has confused me for a long time. Why do the victims seem to pay a lifetime sentence of rejection by the church, yet the perpetrators are so eagerly embraced? I just don’t understand.
    Am very thankful for this article. It seems that not all the church has turned away. There are a few that confront these things. The hope that this brings to me encourages me to hold on. Perhaps God cares about victims??

  • Elisabeth Grace Nolan

    I think she should have started and stopped with Luke 18:13. We are living in one crazy world. Come, Lord Jesus.

  • calvin triemstra

    I believe in healing and restoration … but putting people and ministry on a pedestal is wrong and self serving… it is sad how many people get sucked in to this kind of deception and become a tool of someones “ministry”… this is victimizing the perp as well as the victims and the rest of the membership and anyone they have an impact on….

  • raswhiting

    Do I understand correctly that she was a member or attender of this church before she committed the rape(s)? I suggest that this church needs to gently and humbly encourage any other victims of this woman to contact the police. The church also needs to thoroughly investigate to see whether she has abused or attempted to abuse anyone else, especially within that church. Was she in any ministry position where she could have abused someone? What is the church doing to ensure that neither she nor anyone else has opportunity to abuse children within its congregation or its outreach ministries?

  • Laurie

    Even the pastor referred to the crime as a “relationship” which makes me question if he truly understands the concept of statutory rape and that because of Alicia Gray’s position of power and influence there was no way the 14 year old victim could consent. The magnitude of need for education in churches about this issue is staggering to me and at times overwhelming. I’m grateful for your work and advocacy, Boz!

  • RJ

    This video makes me nauseous. Christa mentioned the first thing that struck out to me: the twisted appropriation of “grace” to, in the words of the pastor, “rally around” not the victim, but the perpetrator! Tragic, despicable manipulation of the gospel.

  • Beth

    Ouch. Does this church now realize that this video is problematic?

  • Stevie

    The noises (the wailing of an animal or whatever in the background near the end) really add to the eerie vibe I get while watching this. Maybe she’s been redeemed, but any privilege of working with children should no longer be available to her under any circumstances. Children are too precious.

  • Dianne Couts

    Who can blame the perpetrator for wanting to save face if she is presented with the opporunity to do so? The real crimes here are a) that she was allowed to speak at all and b) that most Christian people think this is wonderful. Thanks for shedding light on this and calling it what it is.

  • This is so important. I have seen this before with a child sex offender/former minister at Prestonwood Baptist who molested kids there and in Mississippi. He was given the pulpit on a Sunday morning to confess. Then the pastor rallied around him and his wife and said that the church had “witnessed a biblical response” and asked for people to come down, surround the offender and his wife to pray for them. People were hugging them and crying. It was grotesque. Thankfully someone sent me the video of this “confession” and I sent it to the police and prosecutors in MS. The news aired it also which led to 5 victims coming forward in MS which led to Langworthy’s conviction. The entire sermon that day that Greg Belser preached was focused on Langworthy and grace, forgiveness and restoration. He said that with Langworthy’s confession of “inappropriate behavior with younger males while serving at a church in MS and TX” the congregation had witnessed the gospel message. Here is a portion of that video:

  • Robert Uttaro

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  • Lauren

    This is my first comment on a blog post ever – I just couldn’t keep my mouth closed on this one.

    I understand what you’re trying to say, I do. Our words have weight and we need to be mindful of what we are saying and to whom we are saying them to. I agree. When we sin against someone, as this woman did, we often must choose our words even more carefully, which is the whole point of your article. She did not speak about her past sin with the weight you would have liked. I understand. I do not condone what she did, it was a horrible act of abuse and should not be justified. She should, and likely will suffer the consequences of her sin (whether that be imprisonment, loss of privilege, loss of relationships etc) and rightly so. She should not work with kids anymore, she should not have the same responsibilities she did before, she should be monitored. Yes – all consequences of her actions. If her church is not monitoring her, not holding her accountable, then they are in the wrong.

    However, the same principle applies to you and I as well. OUR words hold weight as well, and yours were very telling. Your words were harsh and lacking in grace. Instead of condemning her for using the wrong vernacular, why don’t we PRAISE GOD for the regenerative work he has done in her? Instead of demanding her identity be eternally found in her sin, why not remind her that she has been washed as white as snow? Goodness, I am so very thankful that my identity is not found in my sin. I praise God that my friends, family, acquaintances, co workers etc. hold short accounts with me, forgive me and do NOT define me by my confessed, repented sin, continually reminding me of how horrible I am/was.

    Our great God is a God of redemption, regeneration and reconciliation, and praise Him for that. I understand what you’re trying to communicate. I just think you could speak with a little more grace instead of condemning this regenerated woman for the rest of her life. She is not defined by her sin, just as you and I are not. Again, please don’t hear me say that she should not suffer consequences. She should. But her identity is not found in her abusive behavior. Forgiveness is a very powerful thing.

  • raswhiting

    This article was not “demanding her identity be eternally found in her sin”. The author said, “The offender in the video may be a new person in Jesus, and her position before God may have changed (that is between her and God).” The major point is that this church, likely in ignorance, promoted her immature and incomplete repentance and blame-shifting as if it were a laudable statement. In fact, she minimized her sins as shown in the five points above. The pastor of this church has failed to comfort and to help the child victim and his family, the community, the school, the church, and has even even failed this woman.

  • Lauren

    Raswhiting – thanks for your reply.

    I was referring to this statement: “However, she remains the person who sexually abused a child and that must never be forgotten by her or those around her.”

    I am not a part of that particular church so I do not know how they have handled the situation other than what is shown on the video. I do think they could have used different language. I agree with the author on that note. I imagine they were not thinking about how this video would be received by a victim. Is the victim a part of that particular church? I do not know if they have “rallied around” the victim or not. I hope they have! If he is not a part of that body, I pray that his personal church has embraced him with open arms and walked with him through this. But I also praise this church for coming alongside the perpetrator. Many do not do that. Both need care.

    How do we know that she is not repentant? Yes, she could have used stronger language, but does saying she was inappropriate and selfish communicate that she isn’t repentant? The reality is, if all we have to go by is this video, we really aren’t sure if she is repentant or not. I watched it and did see repentance. Perhaps the video editors edited out portions where she describes her deep repentance for her actions? Really, we just don’t know.

    I did not read the other comments before posting. I see that many of the commentators resonated with the article because of deep wounds from past abuse. I’m so sorry for each and every one of you. I pray that you belong to a church body that comes alongside of you, loves you where you are and walks with you through the healing process. I pray the the LORD ministers to your heart and continually reminds you that He loves you and you are HIS.

    I work for a recovery ministry at a church. We have hundreds of men and women that come each week, for an array of hurts, struggles and sin patterns, including victims of past abuse AND past abusers. I have seen God literally change the lives of both victims and perpetrators, and in some cases, even seen reconciliation happen between the two. When I read this I read the author to say “there is no hope for a perpetrator.” I just wanted to communicate that there is! God is BIG and mighty to save – even those that seem hopeless.

  • Ruth

    You are so very right. I had the exact same thoughts.

  • Brandon Smith

    “She remains someone who abused a child and this must never be forgotten by her or those around her.”

    So, there is no hope for redemption or forgiveness this side of Heaven for any sex offender at all? They are to be marked with a “scarlett letter” for the rest of their lives no matter how remorseful they may be? I feel like this flies in the face of the gospel.

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  • Ruth

    I want to reply to Lauren, who I think was very right. I listened to this video and saw a repentant woman who was trying to move forward in life, rejoicing in a great Savior. As Jesus said, “He loves much who is forgiven much.”. As part of this woman’s future life, she will have 6 months in jail. I walked along side a sexual offender for 7 years. He was repentant Christian, was in counseling, was following all the steps he was advised to do. But nothing was ever enough for many people. He never seemed quite “repentant enough” to them. They didn’t want him to be happy or laugh or enjoy life. That somehow was offensive. He too prayed for healing for his victims and their freedom from bitterness. He tried to understand their hurt. This woman doesn’t claim to understand how those she hurts feels. She acknowledges the normal feelings of anger, hurt, bitterness, sadness that she knows they have. Most people have great sympathy for the victims. The problem is that they are largely unknown and don’t want a lot of attention. Thus they often don’t feel an outpouring of support for their hurt. It is a lonely kind of hurt. On the other hand, the perpetrators are regarded as the scum of the earth, the lepers of our society and their names are often widely publicized. They have committed great sins, but we have a great Savior and the blood of Jesus can cover those sins as well. We also have the power of God to change people and to help them overcome their sinful tendencies. If we don’t believe that Jesus forgives and changes sexual offenders, we have a pretty useless religion. Perpetrators need the help and support of the church, and I for one am very thankful that this church was willing to step up and help despite all the negative criticism that they likely have incurred. It is my experience that helping and ministering to sexual offenders brings mostly criticism and very little encouragement to those helping them. It is true we must help the victims, but let’s not criticize those who are helping the perpetrators. I have no doubt that this church would have ministered kindly to the victim if he had been under their care or had put himself under their care. I pray that he has another body of believers supporting him as strongly. Let’s not nit-pick through this woman’s testimony, but instead rejoice in her repentance, her joy in Jesus, and her desire to submit to his plan for her life, which right now includes jail time.

    Sexual abuse sin is such an offensive sin and stimulates in us such an emotional response that we can forget that it is forgivable. We can take the high ground here,because most of us are quite sure that we would never ever commit such a heinous crime. Most people feel quite superior to sexual offenders. Even in jail they are regarded as the lowest of the low. We forget that at the cross the ground is level and we in our natural state are as repugnant to God as a sexual offender. Maybe today we wouldn’t commit a sexual abuse offense, but given the right set of circumstances and experiences we all are capable of just such an act. I am not better than a sexual offender. It is the same blood of Jesus that covers my many sins that covers those of a repentant sexual offender.

  • Brandon & Laruen – Thank you both for your comments. I actually acknowledged in my post that this individual may in fact be redeemed – that is not our job to determine. The beauty of the Gospel is that there is nothing and nobody beyond the reach of Jesus. However, our spiritual position before God does not eliminate the earthly consequences of our human condition. Our spiritual position before God does not eliminate our sinful nature. Our spiritual position before God does not mean that our prior criminal behaviors should be forgotten. How would we respond if we learned that someone attending our church (who professed t being recently converted) had murdered a child? Though that individual may redeemed by the King, he is still a sinner capable of grave offenses (as he has already demonstrated). Thus, we demonstrate love to our little ones and grace to this redeemed offender by taking steps to make sure he never has the opportunity to reoffend. This requires that we don’t forget his past. Anything short of that would be so irresponsible to the most vulnerable among us.

    I think we would all benefit if we stop confusing one’s spiritual condition before God with earthly consequences for sexually victimizing a child, which is a violation of the God ordained law. I think the words of Jesus in Luke 17:2 support me on this. I also think that we would all benefit by focusing a bit more concern on the lives (and souls) of those eviscerated by these heinous acts.

    Again, thanks for contributing to this much necessary dialogue.

  • William Dalton

    1) The “I’m not that person anymore defense”. A 60 year old is the same person he was when he was six years old. He’s also a very different person. His thoughts, desires, fears, affections, perhaps even his self-regard, are different. All people change over time. The question is whether a sexual offender changes suddenly in his or her sexual desires and how they express them. Only those who have experienced an abrupt “conversion” by the power of God can speak to that, whether they are moved to give up drink, drugs, larceny or abusive behaviors. Christians used to believe the power of God was sufficient to transform the hearts of homosexuals and pedophiles as much as other sinners. Now they are taught to believe that neither is possible. I suspect it is more difficult to “sustain” a conversion in a cultural environment that teaches us that our “sexuality” lies at the core of human identity.

    2) “I understand” and 4) “I am a victim” responses. Most people who abuse children sexually were similarly used when they were children. So, in most cases, these responses are not a cop-out. They really do know what it means to be a victim of such behavior. The problem is that many coped with their own abuse but adopting the attitude that they were in control and willingly consented to what was done to them. When they come to adulthood they may understand, conceptually, that these behaviors were and are wrong, but it is hard to change internally the mechanisms upon which they relied as their own defense mechanism. And, as the Scriptures say, “A dog returns to its own vomit.”

    3) “I was inappropriate” response – well, this is the language we are taught from elementary school. Pulling on Susie’s pigtails is “inappropriate”, using foul language is “inappropriate”, stealing Johnny’s lunch money, cheating on a test, etc. is “inappropriate”. If you learn the lesson, if you internalize it, you don’t do it again. It doesn’t always work, but this method of correction is deemed more “appropriate” than pulling out the paddle. Don’t expect people to admit what they have done is a “crime” until the plea bargain is complete and their sentence determined. It’s the first thing we learn on every cop show. You did what you did. Whether it is a crime or not (self-defense, temporary insanity, etc.) is up for a court to determine. You don’t prejudge your own case. Plus, we know that “criminal” is a legal term, not a moral one. A lot of immoral behaviors which used to be “criminal” are not any longer.. Better seek an acknowledgment that the offender’s behavior violates God’s law. It doesn’t change.

    6) “Make the victim feel guilty” response – see 2) and 4) above. When the adult offender was himself the child victim in an incestuous relationship, he himself felt guilty, was made to feel guilty. Unless that frame of mind is changed, he will believe that the children he pursues are equally guilty if they succumb to his blandishments and will also feel that way.

  • Rachel

    “We can take the high ground here,because most of us are quite sure that we would never ever commit such a heinous crime.”

    Ruth, I think this might be at the core of our responses of absolute horror to child abuse. And truly, this sin is HIDEOUS. It is entirely abhorrent and reflects a mind and heart twisted so far beyond what we feel is right that we would not hesitate to call the perpetrator of this crime totally depraved. Thinking about child abuse sometimes makes me feel physically ill.
    I just wonder, if I had a mind like the mind of God and a heart like the heart of God, would I perceive the sin of adultery (which I am guilty of) with the same kind of utter revulsion? Right now, part of me partially understands how lovely and precious the innocence of a child is; this understanding is the cause of many of my feelings of utter revulsion at the thought of child abuse. So what if I rightly understood the tender sanctity of a marriage relationship? Wouldn’t the thought of someone cheating on their husband or wife make me convinced of the total depravity of the perpetrator in that instance? If I understood the essential beauty of something and then saw it violated, wouldn’t that also cause me to utterly abhor that violation?
    I am not suggesting that child abuse should be treated with any less gravity than is prescribed by this article. I am trying to suggest that our sins are of a depravity that we likely do not yet have the capacity to comprehend. I just think we’re all a LOT closer to the sickening criminal than we are often comfortable admitting. I find Alicia’s repentance video disturbing because of her own seemingly incomplete understanding of her own guilt and the near-levity with which she approaches the subject–I would guess in order to be able to accept herself as a person, i.e., “Jesus understands that I was confused and I admit that my sin was selfish.” I wonder how much I do that in my own life, especially after I have hurt others?

  • Lauren

    Boz – thanks for dialoguing with us on this one. I am just really struggling with the way the gospel is being handled here.

    I am by no means advocating that one should not face the consequence of their sin. By no means. There is sin that has deeper consequences than others, and abuse is certainly one of them. All child perpetrators should face the consequences of their abuse, they should not be allowed to be with children. I wholeheartedly agree. “Thus, we demonstrate love to our little ones and grace to this redeemed offender by taking steps to make sure he never has the opportunity to reoffend.” Absolutely agree with you! I don’t agree, however, that this means we perpetually remind them of their actions and forgo any opportunity for redemption. The natural consequences of their actions usually result in being put on a sex offender list that would render them unable to work with children in the future. I think that’s appropriate. But for their brothers and sisters in Christ to “not forget the past,” suggesting we forever view them through the lens of abuser goes against the gospel message and is unbiblical.

    You say, “Though that individual may be redeemed by the King, he is still a sinner capable of grave offenses (as he has already demonstrated).”

    The reality is, Boz, that you are a sinner capable of the same grave offenses. I am a sinner capable of the same grave offenses. We ALL have the same core problem and though our solutions to fixing that problem may look different (some are angry and prideful, some abuse alcohol, some abuse others) and each solution holds varying degrees of earthly consequences, our core problem all looks the same: SIN. This ME v THEM type of thinking is not beneficial to the body as a whole and perpetuates the “old-school church” way of thinking and dealing with “respectable sins” and judgement and condemnation on anything else. We are ALL sinners, capable of horrific sin.

    Again, I recognize earthly consequences for sin look different. I am not advocating for weaker consequences for perpetrators. I don’t think I’m confusing ones spiritual condition with the consequences of their sin. I understand the difference between the two. I am advocating that we, like this church in Mobile, come along side abusers (AND VICTIMS) and lead them to the foot of the cross where they will find hope, healing, forgiveness, restoration, regeneration, freedom etc. THERE IS HOPE for them. Not just spiritual hope, but hope for their earthly actions.

    I was abused as a child. I know what it feels like. I’ve been there. I have grave concern for those who have been abused because I’ve been there and know the pain associated with it. I work with children that have been abused and have much compassion and empathy for them – I get it. I’ve been there. The gospel completely transformed my life and healed me of my pain and hurt and my sin that I ran to in order to deal with that pain and hurt. The gospel took my anger and bitterness and allowed me to forgive my abuser. I am passionate about leading others to the God that can heal them. But the same God that healed me, the same God that can heal the abused children I work with, is the same God that can heal the abuser. To separate the two or perpetuate the thinking that one is more deserving of grace than the other “flies in the face of the gospel” as Brandon says.

    I appreciate the work you are doing to make the church a safer place – I really do. It is, unfortunately, a very necessary thing this day and age. But please don’t perpetuate the anti-gospel message that there is no hope for abusers. Healing can take place in their lives as well.

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  • Good stuff. I re-posted it and was surprised by the push-back!
    It inspired a blog post, “Sin Still Hurts Someone”

  • Lois

    You nailed it, Calvin. Well put. Thank you.

  • Gary

    This really hits where I live. Not for myself, but because the woman I love is a survivor.
    A survivor who herself, was subject to horrors of sexual assault and abuse as a child that rise to a level of evil few know or understand. What has hurt her the most? It wasn’t the abuse. It is the fact the church and Christian school she grew up in not only did nothing about her suffering…. Her church where she considered herself “one of them” blamed her. Told her she was partially responsible for her “relationships” with grown men and she was in elementary school when most of her abuse took place. Every single one of her abusers were professing Christians. Some were pastors. Then when the true evilness was discovered the church and school turned it all around on her. Told her she shouldn’t talk about it. Told her she’s bitter. She was the one left alone to deal with the physical and emotional scars while every perpetrator went on his merry way. Many to reoffend after they were “forgiven.”

    I’ve heard one of her abusers tell her, “I understand why your bitter, but….” to then go on and excuse himself while blaming her. I had a hard time not punching the weasel.

    The defenses this abuser used were clearly pointed out clearly by Boz.

    Sexual abuse eats away of a child’s developmental steps of which as teacher she was well aware.

    What this abuser did was use her authority as a teacher to step on this boys development, she rewrote who this boy was and the man he will be in the future .

    Without proper help this boy, the victim, is the one who will carry that scarlet “A” for years because the blame of it being a “relationship” and bitterness by the pastor and his victim puts the blame on him. If the victim doesn’t soon receive the proper help it will color all. of not most of his life from the time of his abuse well on into his adulthood.

    The video the pastor pedals the idea of Grace and simple forgiveness as a cure for sexual deviancies and that allows the perpetrator to get off with further responsibility once her sentence is completed and polish it all “clean” with a few Christian words.

    This pastor gave this woman a “EASY BUTTON” which allows her to take little to no responsibility. More importantly doing so, enables more sexual offenders to know that this church will give me an “EASY BUTTON” so I think I will to be around children at this church so I can fulfill my sexual fantasies and get another victim, be forgiven and go on to get another victim. There isn’t any easy fix through forgiveness. The fix isn’t giving the offender an opportunity to spin “I am sorry, don’t be bitter and lets heal together for the ones the person has hurt.”

    Sexual abusers tend to fantasize for a long time before they victimize their first victim. Most do not get up one morning and say “I think I will have sex with this child.” It is a this naivety of churches that allow a offender to remain to be part of your church as we speak fantasizing over having an inappropriate relationship with a child waiting to act out that fantasy.

  • Dear Boz,
    Thank you for your insight on this perpetrator’s “apology” and demonstration of cheap grace. As the former wife of a pedophile, your five “self-serving” responses of this offender resonated with me. So much so that I do not know where to start. I continue to be astounded at how easy it is for churches to blindly accept the words of master manipulators and continue to place their precious children in harm’s way.

    My ex is still awaiting sentencing on a plea deal that he reached with prosecutors–a very sweet plea deal. He recently wrote me to chastise me for using the word “molest” to describe his behavior. He acknowledged that he had “acted inappropriately” with a child but went on to give me a “precise” definition of the word “molest” and insist that what he had done did not match that definition.

    He also used the pseudo-concern for me that we see expressed in this video. He urged me to “let this go for my own mental health.” But he lacks the ability to feel empathy for another so he absolutely cannot see or understand how deeply his actions have wounded others.

    Perpetrators are incredibly dangerous people because they are master manipulators and deceivers. My ex was a highly respected man in his field and those who know him would describe him as an unassuming, kind, sensitive, quirky soul. He was the last person I ever imagined could harm a child and yet he did–more than once. Even though he is now facing the consequences of his sexual offending–a ruined career, estrangement from his own children, disgrace and a possible prison term–he still doesn’t get it. He can say all the right words to convince those around him that he is repentant but his actions and words never match, particularly to those closest to him.

    I think it is very naive for those in the religious community to take the words of a sex offender at face value. We would do well to learn from those in the recovery community and insist that if offenders are going to live and work in our circles, that they stay in accountability–gritty accountability–and in recovery. They need to be in therapy with a Certified Sex Addiction Therapist–someone with additional training and a strong BS-meter. And there needs to be non-negotiable restrictions placed on their access to children forever!

    We are too gullible, dispense cheap grace and place our children in the path of a wolf dressed in sheep’s clothing.


  • Bridget

    The passing of time and change of actions will be the proof of this woman’s repentance. I hope her repentance was expressed to the victim and his family — that is where it should be expressed with witnesses. Of course, she and God are the only ones that know her heart.

    The film itself is the problem. I don’t need to know about this woman’s repentance. What is the purpose of filming her (which she could be getting benefit from and I’m not referring to money)? Does this benefit the victim in some way? If it doesn’t then why produce it? I don’t really believe that God needs this film shown to help his purposes along either.

    I’m not sure that the use of the film here helps the victim either. It ‘may’ continue to give the perpetrator further desired attention. This being said, I can see why it can be an example. Maybe there was some other way to use the perpetrators words without putting her on the screen.

  • Patrice

    Thanks, Boz. The self-centeredness of this young woman’s statement is appalling. And what gall to be preaching to the victims about how they should be feeling! It’s humbug, start to finish, including the foolish naivete of the pastor.

    I wish this post was mandatory for all members in all congregations.

  • Lauren – thanks for your response. We can certainly agree that all of us are “capable” of committing the most heinous of offenses – I get that. However, we will have to agree to disagree on the fact that the Gospel precludes us from distinguishing between those who are “capable” and those who have actually committed the offense. I believe it is God’s kindness that in some cases He allows us to know who has actually committed such offenses. Not so we can demonstrate “hate” towards that person, but so that we can demonstrate grace to our little ones by taking steps to protect them, and grace to the offender by creating strong boundaries and holding them accountable – anything short of that has no resemblance to grace. For example, let’s assume that my children are “capable” of playing in the street. However, if one of them has a preference to play in the street and the others don’t, I demonstrate grace to that particular child by creating consequences for such behavior and developing strong boundaries to prevent her from doing so. One of those boundaries may be for me to tell my neighbors about his propensity to play in the street so that they will keep a look out and inform me if they see him doing so. I take these steps and let others know about his propensity to play in the street not because I don’t care for my child, but because I want to preserve his life.

    Also, it is unfortunate that you have somehow read into my post that “there is no hope for abusers”. That was simply never communicated. In fact, I explicitly stated the opposite.

    Lastly, I do believe that authentic hope and healing can only take place when the Church stops being naive about this dark offense and those who perpetrate – it is only then that we will be equipped to demonstrate the authentic grace that I have described above. I encourage you to read Anna Salter’s book entitled, “Predators” – this is a psychologist who has spent over 30 years studying and interviewing a wide spectrum of sexual offenders. Her data is not based upon anecdotal evidence, but upon well researched studies. She can teach the Church much about this complicated subject.

    Again, thanks for your contribution to this conversation. All the best.

  • gilhcan

    Jesus and the gospel came along very conveniently for Alicia, didn’t they. For a church leader to gloss this over this behavior as a simple and passing “sin” distorts religion as a cover for the wrongs that its members can commit against other people. That pastor totally ignored the victim who, of course,was not a member of his church.

  • gilhcan

    Dono’t blame God for any such distortions as this pastor and sex offender caused. They are still to be blamed for using religion as a cover-up. Their cheap sermonizing, all their Jesus talk, doesn’t excuse, forgive, or cover any of the very wrong past. It was all about me and God and Jesus and forgiveness of me. What about the victim?

  • gilhcan

    It isn’t the church’s position to be an investigator of any aspects of this sex offense. And it isn’t the church’s pastor’s position to be a leader in exonerating the offender in time to escape punishment while he totally ignores the victim. That pastor ignorantly preaches as if his Jesus talk is real psychological therapy.

  • Claire

    As a chaplain in a sex offender’s prison, and speaking as someone with a lot of compassion for sex offenders, I completely and wholeheartedly agree with the author.

  • Shannon

    I’m not sure that I agree with all the assumptions made by the author of this post…they sound relevant and accurate, until I listened to her own testimony. I heard her say more than what was originally reported. She mentioned numerous times the pain and hurt she caused the victims (young and old) and recognized that there was more than one victim as this boy’s family members also became her victims also. She talked about the peace that God gave her to accept responsibility and the punishment as a result of her “unwarranted actions”. The things she said about their bitterness and anger were true. God doesn’t want us to be bitter or angry even though we think we are justified in feeling that way. Satan uses those tools to bring us down and make us ineffective for Christ.

    However, I think the real offense in this video is that a pedophile is offering support and encouragement and advice and prayer for the people she victimized. And nobody wants to hear that! As human beings, we don’t want to hear how she “understands” anything. We don’t want her comforting victims when the entire situation was her doing. It goes against our moral fibers, if you will. We don’t want to hear about everything that God has taught her. After all, growth takes time and hearing how her lesson has been learned right after sentencing doesn’t hold water. If she came back into society years and years later with the story of what she’s learned, then it would be more acceptable. Right?

    I think the other thing that bothers me about this video is that she smiles way too much for a convicted sex offender. Chances are, she does not realize the volume of repulsiveness that her illegal sexual actions exhibit and she’s probably justified some (if not most) of it in her own mind. She did try to hold back tears several times but true conviction brings us to our knees and the emotions of that conviction, when remembered and discussed, will resurface – that should show in her affect and it does not.

    I hope that she truly has come to a saving knowledge of Christ through all this but I agree that she needs to just shut up and take her medicine. Give the victims time to heal from this before you offer advice, prayers and understanding.

  • Learning to be a survivor

    I typed up a long, detailed response to your concerns, but deleted it. Instead, i hope to illustrate a bit what this video feels like to me.
    Imagine being a mother of a six year old little girl. You love that child and have detailed treasured memories of every day that you have spent with her.
    Imagine a drunk driver running her over as she played in her front yard, killing her instantly. Your heart is devastated. The next day, the drunk driver, now sober, cries in “repentance” for her actions. The church surrounds her encouraging her that God still loves her, sees her as forgiven and pure. They tell her they will stand with her regardless of what she just did. They fill her days with encouragement and support.
    You spend each day facing the horror of having lost your daughter. The pain fills you. The anguish cannot be quenched by tears. You cry yourself to sleep, desperately hoping to wake up and find it was all a nightmare. Instead you wake up the next day, again having to face that your sweet daughter is gone. At some point, you begin to realize that none of your friends, relatives, church family, etc. have come by to offer comfort. It seems odd, but you are lost in your pain and don’t think too much about it. One Sunday, you venture back to church, hoping to sit through the service, hear something hopeful that you can hold onto and not fall apart in front of everyone. You go and the first person you encounter comes up and asks you if you have forgiven the driver. Are you angry? Are you bitter? Why are you still grieving – it, after all, indicates an unforgiving heart. Through your confusion, you look up and see the driver with a crowd around her loving her, comforting her, encouraging her. You realize that you are completely alone.
    The first announcement before the service is a plea to the church body, asking them to have compassion on this poor woman who is hurting so much over having killed your daughter. The speaker then mentions you. He states that he hopes you forgive this woman. That is all the hope he has to offer you.
    Then imagine this happening again. The same woman gets drunk again, drives her car and kills another child. The church responds the same way. To show her how much they forgive her, they let her drive children back and forth to church functions. Next she crashes, drunk again, with a van full of church children.
    Do you see how this feels? It isn’t that the woman shouldn’t experience forgiveness, but the video is very unbalanced. It offers incredible love and support to the perpetrator, but never addresses the seriousness of what she did and offers no hope or compassion towards the victim who lost so much more.
    This is the picture I have seen again and again and again throughout the religious community. Churches often “love” perpetrators to such a degree that they don’t even hold them accountable for their actions. That isn’t love. As for the victims, there is nothing for them.

  • Calvin! It’s so cool to see you here! How are you?

  • Larry

    Seeking divine redemption and forgiveness is much easier than actual contrite actions and making restitution to those one harmed.

    Squaring things up with God is cheap. Doing right by other people takes effort.

    God may forgive that person, but nobody else should.

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  • Larry

    How do we know she is not repentant?

    Her language, her statements and the blatant manipulation tactics employed. There is not one ounce of sincerity which can be seen in what she said.

    A person who is truly repentant would be humble enough to not to shout about their wonderful job in seeking God’s forgiveness. A repentant person would keep such things to themselves for fear of reopening wounds they inflicted. Just the act of making the video was enough to show a lack of penitent intent for me.

  • David

    It’s ironic that Boz’s ministry is called GRACE, because his judgmental and skeptical responses bear no resemblance whatsoever to the word. Who are we to judge this woman’s motives?!!

  • Perhaps, it’s wisdom from years of being a former sex-crimes prosecutor and advocate who knows how these offenders think and work in his efforts to protect children from these offenders.

    “But he who has the Spirit, though judging all things,…”

  • Patrice

    We also evaluate the pastor for his foolishness. Why didn’t he videotape the victim outside that sentencing? Who stood next to that child, if he didn’t? What does his choice tell everyone about the priorities of the church?

    It is showier and easier to stand with someone who prettily says she repents than with the person who is damaged and has a long slow road to recovery ahead of him. Yet we are told to be with the downtrodden and broken-hearted.

  • Patrice

    Exactly correct, Brenda. My abusing pastor-father, well respected in the community, told me he was sorry for “being immodest”. And the church community did nothing because he was “doing the ministry of the Lord”. Pfffft

  • K

    Thank you Boz for continuing to point out the painful truths about abuse and ignorance about it in the church. You uncover the ways the weapon of “audience attention” harms the survivors over again and feeds the fleshly needs of perpetrators. True repentance and restitution for this sin and sickness involves lifelong, unsung, selfless service to others while eschewing being used to make a church ministry look “successful.” Boz, your words reliably empower survivors. I truly thank God for you and your work.

  • Anonymous2


    Like Brenda, I too am the ex-wife of a child molester, a Christian pedophile with more than 50 victims, who honed his skill in church youth groups and playgrounds.

    I understand the question you are asking. Believe me, I asked it for many years because I lived with it.

    I hoped and prayed. I fasted and tried everything. We went to endless counselors and in-patient treatment programs.

    Finally after he went through the legal process he was sent to the County’s top court-appointed sex offender program. Eventually, he washed out and was considered a treatment failure.

    The head of that program said something that has stayed with me since that day: “There is nothing in the literature that supports the notion that pedophilia ever goes away.”

    Imagine, Brandon, that in thousands of years that we have written records of attempts to treat pedophiles, no one has come up with a surefire treatment of any kind.

    So, it is my personal opinion that my ex-husband is a danger to children as long as he lives. It is also my belief that Jesus will release him from his obsession one day, but I have no hope it will happen in this lifetime.

    In the meantime he attends a large conservative Christian church and is active in the singles group. Buyer beware.

  • .

    She plead to lesser charges than the ones she with wish she was originally charged. She was sentenced to only 6 months in the county jail for abusing a 14 year old boy. If this was a Man with a Girl. He would have received a much heavier Sentence.She was the boys Teacher. She had a ‘Duty of Trust’. She Breached that trust. The smile on her face throughout this video is most disturbing. She got off easily, and she knows it.

  • Job Law

    She is a child molester, she should apologize to her victim and stop her religious bleating it’s pathetic. She does not apologize she makes excuses for her actions, she is not sorry for her actions she is sorry for getting caught.

  • This video, post and comments has been with me all day so I wrote about it over at A Solitary Journey (

  • galacticexplorer

    But she IS the same person who abused a child. Perhaps god has forgiven her and perhaps she is truly sorry. I cannot know and would not presume to. However, for the sake of the safety of others and respect to the victim, this abuse should not be minimized and treated dismissively like it is in this video. Certainly, abusers need help too. But the victim should be the first priority. Rallying around abusers rather than victims is a common theme in church scandals and it is shameful. Jesus’ redemption is often twisted to silence victims. “She’s changed. She’s different now. She has been forgiven by god, so just shut up about your “hurt” and stop being bitter and move on. We don’t want to talk about it anymore.” That’s the message of this video. That is the message of many, many church leaders in many, many abuse situations. That is the language of perpetuating abuse. It is disgusting and needs to stop.

    I’m sorry if my language is not “grace filled” but I’m discussing a child rapist here, who is saying blatantly hurtful things to her rape victim and then being congratulated by the church for it and treated like some sort of saint for being able to say a very stilted “I’m sorry” after she was caught raping a child. Yeah, that makes me angry, and I’m not ashamed.

  • Boz: Your insights are right on. I would add one more point that should be considered. This most likely a case where a church sabotages the work of real repentance. From my experience of being deposed of my ordination and being excommunicated from the church because of adultery, repentance is a process over time. The first time I said I was sorry, what I was really sorry for is that I got caught. But after a year or so of excusing my “bad decisions” the Lord put me on a path of repentance. But I could not see the depth of my sin all at once. It had to be exposed a layer at a time. What my repentance looked and sounded like during those first couple of months was very different than what it was 2 years later. The church made sure that I took the time to go through that long process. My sense about this abuser is that either she is at the very beginning stage of real repentance or she is a master manipulator (as are abusers.) Again, only time will tell. But the fact that the church has jumped so quickly to make her a hero could very well cause her to stop short of experiencing real repentance. How sad that the church doesn’t understand what is really needed for both the victim and the abuser.

  • Steve,

    I would like to point out one thing…..this isn’t adultery between two consenting adults. This is an adult (Teacher no less) who preyed on one of her 14 year old male students.

    14 year-olds are not capable of consenting to sex with an adult. Big differences in life experiences, etc.

    Big difference between the two. Too many times (I’m not accusing you of this) Church leaders *often* accuse victims of being partakers in their own abuse.

    That smile throughout the whole video says anything I need to know. She plead to lesser charges. She got off easily with the justice system. Her church isn’t going to hold her responsible. She knows it too.

  • Oscar

    For many of us, the face of Islam is ever etched upon our minds as being those who flew the plane on September the 11th and yet if we think about it logically these were only a very fanatical element who do not represent the average Moslem.

    What the Christian Church needs to make sure of is that the face of Christianity is not the monsters who abuse children and the only way to do this is to strongly denounce them, run them through the courts and let justice prevail. For if the Christian Church does not, then it risks being tarnished in the eyes of the rest of the world.

    Like the average Moslem, the average Christian does not rape, beat or abuse children. But unless the average Christian gets off their backsides and stands firmly against the scourge of child abuse in the name of Jesus, then that is how the Christian Church will be viewed. Just ask the Catholic Church, they know only to well what damage their errant priests have done to their church.

    So why is a person of little faith mentioning this? Simple, although I may not have enough faith to get myself into any church, why should I let the reputation of the innocent good majority be dragged down by the evil few and their fanatical supporters. I may have had the faith knocked out of me, but not my conscience.

  • Oscar

    Dear Boz,

    We have something in common. Your good self being the grandson of a well respected icon of the Christian faith and myself being the son of a relatively well known missionary.
    Alas whereas I am sure you are proud of your grandfather, I am deeply ashamed by my father. So much so that I am too ashamed to call myself a “Christian”, preferring to examine my own heart and admit that the faith has been so severely dented I can but call myself a Sympathetic Agnostic and look myself in the eye.

    So how did this happen? Simple. The organisation my parents served with had many child abusers operating in it’s worldwide boarding schools. And when the evidence finally came to light, (including your own excellent GRACE report), my own father denied it all, He even denied that our neighbor who was jailed for his sexual offending ever offended. He said it was no concern of his what happened to his fellow missionaries children and he expressed no concern for his own children. And he was not alone, for many of his former co workers have done similar, going as far as explaining that the sudden absence of the convicted offender was due to a “mental breakdown”, not because he had been incarcerated.
    So Boz, that is my lot in life and the cross I must carry on my Agnostic shoulders, but when I muster enough faith to utter the occasional prayer, it is to give thanks that I survived and that I still have a voice to expose this awful saga and as I mention to whatever God it is that I am praying to with my thanks, I try and add a word for the many other victims of this shameful scandal.

    Many thanks for listening, to just the tip of the iceberg of my story.

  • Cathy: You seemed to have missed the point I was making. I was not trying to compare adultery to child sexual abuse. I was speaking to the issue of what does true repentance look like. Was what she says on the tape an indication of a true apology and understanding of what she has done? Some would hear what she said just as the church did, as a woman who was really in touch with the depth of her sin. My point is that it is too early to determine if the teacher is truly repentant or just manipulating the church. I also was making the point that the church, by its holding her up as a hero, most likely will sabotage the work of repentance in her heart and thus she might never know the depth of the pain she has caused nor how she has grieved the heart of God. She certainly doesn’t show any real remorse now (at least not from how I view her.) Nor will the church understand how their actions in supporting her and setting her up as an example see how devastating their actions are to the victim and his family. Our churches almost always take better care of the abuser than the victim. I hope this helps you see what I was saying in my post

  • Oscar:

    Well said, however, we live in a world where “religion” is a concept and one very much influenced by the power of sin and darkness. As a recovering victim who has wrestled with the impact of this crime, having been perpetrated against me by a very charismatic pastor over a period of 11 months, I know what it is to be convinced you have “Lost your religion”. Take hart man! There is help available. This, not form the wells of human encouragement nor from the snares of broken council, but, direct from above! ‘Seek ye first the Kingdom of Heaven’ that is “first” as in desire to attain. You may want to pick up a copy of the book, “Molested In God’s House” as it has been described as a ‘road-map back to faith’ even though it was written by a victim of this crime. If not, concentrate on The Scriptures. If you expose yourself to the hearing of God’s Word again, now, within the framework of adult reasoning, I am confident that nothing more than a commitment to discipline yourself to looking at Christ with purpose, intent, and resolve will renovate your thinking and return you to a stable faith and confident hope in the coming King and Kingdom! Look up and move forward.

    Best regards!

  • Kathy

    This pastor is the pastor for the offender. That is whom he has responsibility for and access to in order to help. The victim is not his church member. Hopefully he is a member of a church where he is being cared for, but this pastor has no access to him. Let’s not judge the pastor for what is not his responsibility.

  • Kathy

    Well said.

  • Kathy

    This was meant to say, Well said, Lauren.

  • Ruth:

    Good morning. Its time to wake up. As noted above, I am the author of the book, “Molested In God’s House”. I was a victim of this crime over 30 years ago. My victimization was at the hands of a very charismatic pastor who also directed the Teen Challenge Program in Philadelphia. It happened when I was in my young teens and I still wrestle with both guilt and shame to this day. The crime has impacted my entire family as I have been unable to bring myself into close and appropriate contact with my own children while my wife and I were raising them. My wife has been my helper and friend over the years, but, even she was unaware of the full reality of my experience until I felt lead to complete my endeavor and write. Needless to say, this work has had a deep and profound impact on our marriage and family. My perp?…You may ask. Well he went on to pastor a number of other churches and I am confident he went on to continue molesting. At present, he pastors a church in Az. His web-site boasts of his commitment to CHILDREN’S WORK and even states that many who have come under his tutelage go on to become full time ministers. Wow! After 32 years of heart wrangling and the completion of the book I can tell you some things that you most likely do not know. Most molesters molest between 100 and 125 children within the course of 1 lifetime (their own). The recidivism rate for this crime is over 75%. Most, if not all, of the social sciences agree that perpetrators of this crime are simply incorrigible. Almost universally, perpetrators are convinced they have been seduced by their victim somewhere along the way. Keeping these facts in mind, the reality is that “going easy” on these villains is really an aid to the loss of their souls eternally. Redemption requires contemplation and contemplation with regard to personal action is quite impossible for those who spent every waking moment plotting and stalking a ‘next’ victim. It is agreed that redemption is God’s free gift to all, however, that gift requires repentance (a change of heart and direction). Just as drunks can’t hang out at bars and addicts can’t keep a fix in their pocket…Molesters can not be in a free society and particularly a free society peopled with children. Incidentally, with respect to your thoughts regarding, ‘given the right circumstances’ I am in complete agreement, but, the ‘right’ circumstances are a deliberate choice once we attain adulthood.

    Rejoice…for His return is sure!

  • Honestly? The church did what they felt God called them to do for this young lady that is now a convicted child molester. They were going to love her though it – as they said. Sadly, they wanted to show grace – yet wisdom wasn’t used for time or content. It was premature. It lacked healing words for her victim, and those impacted by this crime.

    What we are to do is show contrite repentance in speaking of our sins, and she spent much of the time proselytizing instead. Her generic apology to those she hurt – was just that generic. The way she presented things was woe is me, and Thank the Lord I found Jesus. Her Jesus portions were the only parts that had any real emotion.

    To me that is a diversion.

    She should be more than willing to wait for others to see the fruit she claims is there, and that will take years to see the ‘turning’ as it is called in the bible. As Christians we are to look for more than the words, but the actions. Why is it so popular to place the cart before the horse when it wounds the victims?

    So far I would assume the last thing her victim wanted to hear is they are most likely bitter, angry, and haven’t forgiven her yet. I doubt very much they needed to hear she did it because of the void that she had, because Jesus wasn’t in her life properly yet either. I guess pastor’s love to hear that stuff, but victims of crimes are NOT pastors all the time.

    Sadly, this church wanted to show how they ‘loved her though this’. They naively allowed themselves to air this video to show their Christian concern, but didn’t use the wisdom of discernment with issues that surround crimes like this. Disagreement with the approach doesn’t mean others feel there is no hope, and they have doomed the perp forever. Why is it always taken that way over how others ‘receive’ the message that have been victim from those that don’t have the same experience? Can you learn nothing from us – just teach?

    Instead of judging others for hinting they feel there is no hope for the perpetrator..why not listen to what they have to say. Why they feel this is ineffective, and doesn’t address the issues properly. What victims maybe looking for so they also can feel what you felt?

    Just because this young lady threw in the right faith based keywords and phases doesn’t mean it will have the same effect on victims as it does with those that have never experienced this.

    You seem to be saying – I thought it was good, but you just don’t want to see it that way. Why is it you don’t wish to know why? Do you realize you just shut the door on something that may help your ministry? Are you seriously okay with thinking others just don’t get it?

  • Oscar

    Many thanks for the concern. To clarify, I am 50 and it was two years ago that I had confirmed for what I had suspected for many decades, in that my parents had been part of a “cult” type group that had ruined the lives of many children in their care. This group still operates, still recruits and still attempts to cover up it’s now very public shameful past. In three days time their latest sexual predator will be sentenced for rape and child pornography.
    For me to be a Sympathetic Agnostic is a way of being able to accept what my past was, for that I cannot change, but to remove myself from those who used the label of “Christian” to rape, beat, sodomise e.t.c. and a father who rants that as I speak out I “ruin the reputation of godly men”, while many of his former colleagues hide from justice.
    As a child I knew what I saw and experienced was wrong, yet when I spoke out the answer was always the same, “close your eyes to what you see, focus them on God and read The Word”. It didn’t make a lot of sense then to a child with a conscience and it makes even less sense now, because the conscience is still intact.
    What I believe remains deeply personal and private, but in what I practise I aim never to give reason to be labelled the “fake” or “hypocrite” that so many of those I endured as a child were.

  • raswhiting

    Oscar, thank you for telling us some of your story and your pain. WOuld you be comfortable to share the name of this cult group that is still operating, recruiting, and covering up? Some readers may need this warning.

  • It is better that a millstone be tied about their neck and that they be cast into the sea. Perhaps direction and not suggestion…Your thoughts?

  • Those whom He loved he suffered for and continues to be at pains with. Don’t get too caught up in the concerns of this life. Each question may be answered at His feet either in this life or in eternity. No one else has the words of eternal life.

  • Thumbs up!

  • Oscar

    There is an excellent support network called Fanda Eagles for missionary kids of this organisation (just type it into a search engine). On there you will find a link to the GRACE report, written by Boz’s organisation. There you will also find all the info you need and a warm welcome should you wish to participate on any of the threads.

    A point to note. It is my personal opinion that this is a “cult” type organisation, this is based on my own experience both as a child growing up in one of the boarding schools and my interactions with my father and other members in the past decades. Of course my personal opinion is not shared by everyone.

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  • CB

    What she did is completely unacceptable. She has no right to find a way to excuse what she did. I never could understand why a woman young and attractive like her is so willing to destroy her career over getting a dick between her legs. Her husband ain’t good enough? Come on, there are men out there that are “clean” (no STD’s) that she could bang. But instead she goes for a kid.

    Call it what you want, excuse it anyway you wish. I say it’s just downright pathetic, inexcusable and unacceptable. She got 6 months? Whatever. Guess she must have “met up” with the judge in his chambers. If the teacher was a man he’d get nailed hard.

    And how does the community view a female sex offender? They aren’t ostracized like a male SO is. I know a couple male SOs, and they have a hard life. Oh well, too bad. The women SO’s? They don’t have it as bad.

    I am very emotional about this- I was molested as a kid. Except in my case (and my sister’s case) the cops didn’t care.

  • Patrice

    But surely Christianity doesn’t draw a line at the bottom of the membership roll? And if a member does a great sin to another, focusing on the victim is a central part of the redemption process for each one involved. We can see how that didn’t work in this video.

    Plus, if the victim’s church wasn’t caring for him, or he had no church, it seems to me that a pastor would model the Good Samaritan tout de suite. Imagine if, in that story, the church leader who went around the hurt person, then set the highway robber up as a testimony to God’s love, because he said he was sorry.

    The parable also speaks to another fact: it is often those outside (not inside) the church who care for the damaged/broken. It is as true now as then, and that is very very sad!

  • Survived

    Oscar, thank you for this post. That website is amazing, it should be read in every church, by every pastor and by every victim of child abuse. Some of the posts on the thread are heart breaking and yet there is healing too.
    I struggle to understand how such a large missionary organisation is so uncaring for their own members children. Is it any wonder that some have lost their faith in a caring and loving God, when all they have experienced is this. This is a disgrace and needs to be fully exposed in full.
    And thank you Boz for the report that you did into this, it is chilling reading but a wakeup call for those of us who are so comfortable and far removed from the missionary life.
    Oscar and all the dear victims of this sickening mess, I am praying that justice will be served on the perpetrators of these crimes, so that your faith might be restored. May God truly bless you and reward you for your bravery of speaking out.

  • Oscar

    Dear John,
    When it comes time for my lifes journey to end, I shall shuffle off to whatever lies upon the other side. And if it should be that it is the Pearly Gates, I shall wait at the end of the line to be admitted. For people of much greater faith should go before me, for my nagging Agnostic doubts preclude me from being a person of great faith.

    Then when my audience with the Almighty is granted I shall, on bended knee, confess my doubts and apologise most sincerely. I will confess that I had not the strength to believe with blind faith. Then I hope that God will look at my life and see that what I did for His Children was done with the some of the courage that His own Son had in his sojourn upon earth. And I hope that in my favor will go the many many hours of writing to Pastors, Politicians, Priests and many others, begging them to join me in attempting to stop the abuse of innocent children in many lands, with the irrefutable evidence that so many “holy” eyes are to blind to see. And I will hope that God will forgive the doubts that stirred within me when far to many of those Pastors did not reply, or called into question the hard evidence (an interesting note at this point, politicians do reply and act upon evidence and at the very highest level of government, but that is not what this post is about).
    Then I hope to hear the words, “as much as one did it for one of my children, they have done it for me” followed by “o.k. Oscar go and join my good doubting friends Thomas and Peter”.

    So if I shuffle off the mortal coil before thee, when you arrive at the Pearly Gates, have a look in the “Writers Corner”, for that is where I’m likely to be and at long last free of those doubts.



    P.s. in case anyone is confused:
    An Athiest does not believe in God.
    An Agnostic does not know have enough faith to make a judgement call.
    A Sympathetic Agnostic is someone who doesn’t want to profess to believe in something because they are to scared not to, but wants to find the good in fellow humans that is the evidence of a truly loving God, but just hasn’t got there yet, due to the life they have been allotted (that’s where I am at).

  • Becky

    She gives the reason for her lack of tears and sadness as joy in the Lord and His grace. My observation would be that those who know the deepness of grace also know the deepness of His holiness. This is what brings repentant, desperate sadness and remorse: the acknowledgement of the depth of sin and its consequences. We recognize our wretchedness in this body of death as Paul says. We also seek to put others needs ahead of our own…for the rest of our lives. That may mean always being supervised around children, and telling others of our past etc. etc. in order to show Christs love the victim. Anything to instill confidence that they…and others…are safe and their deep suffering is acknowledged. The unmeasurable grace in the abusers life, then, is forgiveness from God, the joy in knowing the eternal price is no longer theirs to pay, and an earthly life submitted to the beautiful, undeserved, purposes of God…whatever that may look like. Thank you for your post.

  • Oscar

    Tomorrow another sex offender with connections to my Missionary Kid childhood will be sentenced in Florida.
    There will probably be tears, but I doubt they will be tears of repentance or for the victims. No, they will be tears for being caught and the consequences of incarceration. And the mission will probably wash their hands of him, if they haven’t already. As for his victims, little will be done. They will be left to heal by themselves, just like the many decades of victims have been.

    And the only way this will stop from happening again and again is if the Church stops making excuses for their errant “Saints” who are masters of deception. It is to easy to put on the sheeps clothing if you are a wolf. And when the sheeps clothing is on, the fields are full of lambs to be . . . .

  • Having been molested by my elementary school principle when I was in the third grade, this video just pushed all the wrong buttons. I saw a narcissist young woman who truly did not care about the victim, the young life she has ruined. I also saw the same thing in the minister who supported her. It’s all about her. She’ll do it again, given the chance. You are exactly right.

  • Patrice

    Oscar, I will be at the back of that line with you. See you there.

  • Charles R. Williams

    I do not see the woman here who bathes Jesus’ feet with her tears, wipes his feet with her hair and anoints him with precious ointment. I do not see deeds worthy of repentance. I see no effort to repair the damage. This woman may be sincere in her gratitude to God for what he has accomplished for her but it is very clear that she has only begun to face the magnitude of her sin. I am afraid the treacly sentimentality of this video will do nothing for the victim and do nothing for the cause of Christ. Christianity is not about feeling loved despite what we have done, it is about loving the God who loved us first. And this love is evidenced by actions not by words and certainly not be emoting in public. One wonders what this pastor is trying to accomplish. The message he sends is that in his church, they will try to make you feel good no matter what you have done.

  • Brandon:

    This is not to say that there is no forgiveness for child molesters here on earth. The concern is that there are depth and dimensions within the realm of sin. Although I have forgiven my molester and believe he can be forgiven through the finished work of Christ, I am also keenly aware of the statistics with regard to relapse into this behavior. Please see my comments to Ruth above for some insight. I am confident that ‘restraint’ may offer the best opportunity for redemption for those who have crossed this line in offending the little ones.

  • Anonymous2:

    Shame on the judge / legal system for their anemic and empty answer to this crime against humanity. I too have a family member (brother) who was convicted of this crime. Although it broke my heart to sit in the court room and listen during his trial I found it appropriate, though shocking, when the judge handed down his sentence… 4 times life + 125 years. And, he was convicted on only 2 victim’s testimony. There may have been more, however, NO MORE in the future. My hope is that God will find him behind bars and in chains and that my brother will yield to Him there.

  • I don’t think people who haven’t been there grasp the recovery process. My life was almost insane until I learned how to deal with it, and finally accepted what happened. My healing came via helping others deal with the same horrors. What also helped me is the fact that the son of the man who molested me is quite active working to prevent sexual abuse of children, extremely public and outspoken. From what I’ve been able to quietly ascertain, he has ended the multi-generational cycle of sexual abuse in his family. I don’t think I can ask for anything more. At least I know that the perp is dead, and his son received help. That’s a comfort. You have my prayers.

  • SJ:

    Thanks for staying in the discussion! Can you point me to the site, if one exists, you mentioned on 1/28? That is your molesters son’s site. Let’s get in contact victim to victim… the system usually brings good results (consider AA and the like). I would like to get a copy of “Molested In God’s House” off to you. I’m at:

    Hope to hear from you soon.

  • I’ve never mentioned anything other than the incident. I’ve never mentioned his name, or even his site. I have no plans to do so. I’ve chosen to speak out on the fact that pedophiles ruin lives, and will go after them when I can, but I have closed the book on my past. I have no desire to go anywhere near this person, contact him, nor expose him to the public. I have never linked to his site, nor will I ever do so, assuming he has one. My satisfaction is in the fact that he now speaks out against pedophiles and that he appears to have stopped the multi-generational abuse in his family. I will never mention anything else about this person.

  • Thanks Boz. You exposed the shallowness of the apology really well. I am disgusted by the pastor and the perpetrator. The pastor’s tone is bragging; he would probably say he is boasting only in Jesus Christ, but I don’t think Jesus would like that boast since is so Pharisaic. The perpetrator is way too slick and smooth. The video was hard to watch — all that cognitive dissonance!

    I detest it when perps and their allies say they are praying for the victims. It’s so patronizing. The perp actually said the victim ‘needs’ to do such and such (let go of anger, be healed, etc). If I were the victim I would reply to her “I did not ask you for advice about what you think I need to do! Go jump!”

  • Oscar — I’m so sorry that happened to you. Well done for speaking out and being honest. I am also sorry because my words are so inadequate as my response to you. Sometimes words just don’t cut it, do they?

  • Kathy

    If you think logically about abuse, you can come to realize that there is a method to empower children who are otherwise dependent and vulnerable, to be less and less vulnerable to abuse. Children can have a protected voice, can have manifest liberty to adjust their days till their routines and alliances are what further their best development. This can be done if the adults decide to do it.

    We would be providing safety without having to be so preoccupied with the guilt or innocence of adults. The safety of children is something that can be measured by how well they demonstrate the activities that are described as basic human rights. This creates immunity, which is a real non-susceptibility to victimization etc, and in this strength is also created spiritual health. Yes there is a such a thing as a psychopathic predator. And such a person would be repelled by a group who raises their children as strong. The predator would recognize that their crimes wouldn’t take hold in such an atmosphere, they would move on.

    If we concentrate on creating safety for children, we don’t have to concentrate on nitpicking the guilt of anybody. We all have weakness, and can fail and breakdown under stress. That is the objective reality.

    I can’t get on board with all this preoccupation with judging and judging and judging forever, when the real failing in society is that safety isn’t recognized for what it is. People pretend safety is accomplished when all of the guilty are branded or locked up. No. That isn’t the answer.

    Objective reality can be judged on whether conditions exist to maximize the active demonstration of human rights by children. I rarely see conditions where they are. Normal families and schools, especially with the emphasis on obedience as the object of childcare, degrades the immunity of children. Only through community dedicated to real practicing human rights for every member can social immunity be maximized.

    The obstacle to creating real safety for children is that few are interested in thinking about the subject in a rational and logical way. All this yadayada about guilt is really beside the point. If that 14 year old have been raised with intact human rights, he wouldn’t have been victimized by this woman. And if she were acquainted only with empowered children, she would likely not have victimized any at all.

    What do you want to do? Obsess about who to punish and how much? Or provide for the safety of children? They really are two different projects.

  • Lois

    Hi Kathy. Thank you for your comments about protecting children from abuse before it happens, and I agree with you to some degree. You say that “Normal families and schools, especially with the emphasis on obedience as the object of childcare, degrades the immunity of children.” I disagree that this is the emphasis in most families, though, and I also believe that most parents require obedience from their children so that they are able to protect them from other kinds of harm, rather than because they’re on a power kick.

    I think you misread the intent of Baz’s post and the comments that follow. Baz’s article is not a “preoccupation with judging and judging and judging forever.” Rather, it is intended to “teach us more about the distorted beliefs and understandings perpetrators have about the crimes they have committed.” There ARE pedophiles out there, looking for opportunities to abuse children. Even children who are raised with an understanding of their human rights (as much as their stage of development allows – they are not just mini-adults), are vulnerable to predators; possibly less so, but children are easily lured, especially if they are emotionally in need.

    As for the comments that follow, as you can see, many of them are from victims of pedophiles, or people linked closely to them. The tone is therefore understandable. In fact, considering the gravity of the crime, they express great restraint.

    So yes, we must empower our children as much as possible, and educate ourselves about how best to empower them, but while there are still pedophiles, no amount of empowerment will never provide full immunity.

    Baz: any chance of an article on how we can best protect our children from sexual abuse?

  • Lois

    Sorry, I meant Boz, not Baz, of course!

  • A Believer

    Romans 14:4
    4 Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand.

    John 8:15
    15 “You judge according to the flesh; I am not judging anyone. 16″But even if I do judge, My judgment is true; for I am not alone in it, but I and the Father who sent Me.…

    Acts 17:25
    25 nor is He served by human hands, as though He needed anything, since He Himself gives to all people life and breath and all things

    Acts 10:15
    15 But the voice spoke again: “Do not call something unclean if God has made it clean.”

    Luke 6:37
    37 “Do not judge, and you will not be judged; and do not condemn, and you will not be condemned; pardon, and you will be pardoned.

    1 Corinthians 1:28
    27 but God has chosen the foolish things of the world to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to shame the things which are strong, 28and the base things of the world and the despised God has chosen, the things that are not, so that He may nullify the things that are, 29so that no man may boast before God

    Mark 9:42
    42″Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe to stumble, it would be better for him if, with a heavy millstone hung around his neck, he had been cast into the sea.

    Matthew 25:40
    “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

    Romans 11:19-21
    19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either.…

  • Lois

    Hi A Believer. The Bible verses you have listed are wonderful and I doubt that there’s a reader here who isn’t glad these teachings are in the Bible. However, you offer no context, and Jesus did not teach us to be a people who do not make any judgements whatsoever.

    The intentions of most of the responses here (I’ve read them all) have the primary concern of protecting children. To do this, we MUST make sound, godly judgements. If we do not, we risk endangering our children.

  • I assume your point is to say that this teacher is being judged and that this is wrong. The prohibition to “not judge” is not universal. The bible is clear that we are to be “discerning” (pass judgement on what is right and wrong.) It’s not just what the bible says, but also what it teaches that provides a proper principle for interpreting scripture. So here are some verses I would recommend you read:
    I Cor. 2:15
    Matthew 7:15-20, 12:33-34
    Prov 22.24
    I Cor 5: 11-12
    Heb 5:14.
    Finally a quote from A.W. Tozer: “Among the gifts of the Spirit scarcely one is of greater practical usefulness than the gift of discernment. This gift should be highly valued and frankly sought as being almost indispensable in these critical times. This gift will enable us to distinguish the chaff from the wheat and to divide the manifestations of the flesh from the operations of the Spirit.”

  • PJ

    “Don’t blame God for any such distortions as this sex offender caused ”

    Where was he in all this? Too busy in another area? or asleep somewhere?

    “Don’t blame God for any such distortions as this pastor caused”

    Can’t god keep his communicators from going off the rail ?

    What a mighty go we serve……..NOT

  • Learning to be a survivor

    Hi PJ, Just wanted to say that I understand at least a bit of your frustration. I don’t know your background, but based on my own experiences, abuses always came through those who claimed to be followers of God, the leaders who preached and were well respected within Christian circles.
    Over the past few years, I have had many questions. Where was God when these things happened? Why did he allow them? Why do we, the victims, seem to pay the majority of the cost, while the offenders seem to live in freedom? Why is it that the shame seems to be ours to carry, while the offenders are so quickly forgiven and welcomed with open arms by churches? If the “church” is supposed to be a bit of a reflection of God, then why do so few in the church care? Why did the “church” actively protect offenders while silencing children and young victims? Why did they sacrifice us? Why is their seemingly no room for those of us broken by abuse, yet plenty of room for those “strong” offenders?
    I don’t have the answers. I wish I did – for you, for me and for so many others. For the most part, in my own struggles, I have been frustrated when people bring up passages from the Bible. The verses they mention often seem filled with more accusations and condemnation. They often leave me feeling like those listening can’t hear or see any part of my heart and how broken I am. One passage, however, has stuck out to me. I hope you are okay with me sharing it. It is perhaps the only one that has truly penetrated my fear and allowed me to see that perhaps God really does care.
    Isaiah 52 talks about the shepherds who were supposed to be caring for the sheep. God blasts the shepherds in this passage for their abuse and neglect of those who needed help. He accuses them harshly because they did not fulfill the role they were entrusted to fulfill. Instead, they abused and neglected those they were supposed to care for. They did not protect. They didn’t seek out the lost. They left them unprotected to be abused and destroyed.
    Then God says that he is going to come himself to fix this (I think predicting Jesus coming). He says that he, himself will come and rescue all of those who were scattered. He describes how he will strengthen and heal those who were broken and provide healing and protection.
    I can’t pretend to completely understand what this all means, but it surprised me when I read it. It still surprises me. It still makes me wonder at God’s heart in all of this. Perhaps the day will come when all will see how things really are. Perhaps the day will come when we will experience healing and hold onto hope – that hope that might seem too elusive right now.
    I struggle to hope sometimes, but yet, there is no other option. There has to be hope. For me, this passage is the beginning of that hope.

  • Kathy

    Thank you Lois for your reply. I did not reply exactly to his central point, which in fact I do value. He is observant about how people wiggle out of accountability, and about how others satisfy themselves with illusions of change that are not really true.

    Like most messages people give to another, this little rant of mine was a cloaked message to myself. I am an abuse survivor and am grappling for a way to contribute something on the subject that isn’t warlike.

    Also many years ago I tried to advocate for my little daughter who had reported sexual abuse, and I hoped for a conviction of her offender; didn’t get one. Her child-psychologist told me that the best I could expect was to make my then 4 year old child “abuse-proof,” which she felt she could do. This was her conclusion based on years of being up against the court and involved with actual cases.

    I found that absurd, and instead I wanted his head on a platter. In retrospect, I had to admit that my motives regarding the safety of my child were being overshadowed by impulses towards vengeance. Its a complicated subject, and hard to have the “right” emotions at the time.

    Probably everybody has at least one personal story that informs their thinking. This isn’t the right place for me to unravel mine. Thank you for your considered response.

  • Kathy

    The problem I experience with normal prevention programs is that there is so little “tooth” to them. There is the talk about Good Touches and Bad Touches and ‘make sure to tell an adult;’ and it just doesn’t satisfy me. Once they tell, then what? Conviction rates are so abysmal that the whole story of following up with a legal response is that the offender either goes on entirely unscathed, or gets some tiny slap on the hand. The process re-victimizes the child. All the other children learn that it truly is better to not tell at all.There is the other extreme of an offender being murdered in prison and that isn’t right either.

    Baz is certainly one of the good guys in this struggle. I really should study his whole website before I shoot my mouth off any more.

  • Kathy

    I mean Boz. sheesh

  • Don’t be too sure of that opinion. I have been trying to get a program off the ground wherein pastors aggressively seek out victims of this crime, get them much needed professional help, engage them within the Christian community, and encourage them to name their molesters. I can tell you this… Pastors do NOT have an interest in getting involved. I receive far more support from ardent Non-believers then from church leadership. This unanticipated resistance has actually given me good opportunities to witness to the lost within my circle of acquaintances. However, the protestant church has very little time with regard to this matter… Go figure.

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  • Dee Dee

    Even the pastor cannot acknowledge the real charges. He says she was charges with having a sexual relationship. Like it’s not a real crime. He is enabling. Sickening.

  • Shannon

    I read the article and in just listening to the Pastor’s words before I got to the abuser’s portion of the video I was re-traumatized. I can’t imagine a church more profoundly missing the point. It really makes me physically ill. And so sad.

  • Shannon

    Maybe we should ‘forgive’ in some form but don’t ever forget. NEVER EVER Forget, the person who did this hasn’t changed.

  • Paula

    Praying that she eventually really repents – that maybe the Lord will reveal more fully to her the horror of what she actually did. The only bright spot I can see here is that at least her sins are public and people can at least be wary. She clearly doesn’t sound repentant. Her statement sounds very clinical and chipper and rehearsed. She has not been touched by the gravity of her sin.

  • Anna

    I feel like this article is an attack on grace and judgmental toward sinners. I think our desire to see justice in this world greatly stained the author’s view of grace.

    I am not saying that she is innocent. If she was, she wouldn’t need grace. I’m not saying that she should just slough off her responsibility in the matter. She is a sinner! So is the author of the article. So am I! But who are we to say that God hasn’t changed her? Who are we to discount the cross of Christ and regard her as only carnal, if indeed, she really is now a follower of Christ? To view her in this way is to disregard Paul’s statements in 2 Cor. 5. And who are we to say whether or not she is?

    I would be careful in automatically assuming she’s still a caniving, manipulative jerk. Yes, she attacked underaged boys sexually. Yes she was manipulative. Yes, she’s guilty. Yes, she talked about her own insecurities and struggles. It’s necessary to note that if she talked about the victims’ she’d be overstepping her bounds and be even more criticized than she already is for not understanding the effects she’s had on them. What she did was wrong. And disgusting. But to say that she only furthers the problem in that all of her statements are only about her and her own defense is to say that she doesn’t have the right to process her own faults and failures. The ironic thing is that if she didn’t, she’d probably still be an abuser.

    Maybe she didn’t use such graphic words of attack and abuse because if people who were affected by her actions did see the video, it’d take them too graphically into their past with her. Maybe if you were a sex offender seeking help, you’d see her testimony differently. Maybe you’d see hope where no one else and nothing else in this world offers it (especially when you enter a nation-wide sex offender list, forever marked by even one action). Maybe this video isn’t for those who were affected by her sins. Maybe Jesus came to save people just like her – and just like you and me. Maybe she actually understands the depths and thorough reaches of God’s unconditional grace and love a lot more than we do.

    I’m just saying, maybe there’s another explanation than this one.

    “48 And he said to her, “Your sins are forgiven.” 49 Then those who were at table with him began to say among[h] themselves, “Who is this, who even forgives sins?” 50 And he said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.” – Lk. 7:48-50

  • Kristin McGuire

    Good point. Forgiven, but not trusted. Children are too precious. It would be better for a millstone to be hung around her neck, than to ever put her in a position of authority over children.

  • Kristin McGuire

    Interesting. Thank you for posting the “confession”. I would say that if he had had true Godly sorrow for his sin, he would have gotten as far from working with children as he could get!. The statement he made, “It was never my intention to dishonor God or His church” – really??

  • Mary

    What a disturbing video. I could not help sensing that the Pastor wanted this ugly sin to go away as much as the abuser. So let’s wave the Jesus flag and make it all go away. This woman is so obviously deflecting the seriousness and perversion of what’s she’s done, and the severe damage she has caused the boy, and the worse part is that the Pastor and his group are enabling her. No wonder the boy was abused. Abusers thrive in environments where people can’t handle hard truths and where the make it go away mentality thrives. They ignore the elephant in the room. I do hope this women knows Jesus, but I hope she gets some serious help. She needs it desperately. If she can manipulate gullible people like this church and Pastor, and feels she can get away with it with the right words and somehow “change” in 11 months, imagine what will happen if she’s around kids again. God help her.

  • joeythebushkangaroo

    Thank God, In my own Religion, we do not tolerate Gross sin like this–,just as the Bible provides this Counsel to the Congregation, to- ” Remove the wicked man (or woman) from among you” at 1 Corinthians 5:13. ,That is what is done!!
    These types of Criminals,(which is what they really are), are removed from among us if it should ever happen within our Church members.

    Pedophiles are wicked people, not just someone who is having a weak moment. They are cunning,conniving,deceitful,selfish,thieves of a “Childhood of Innocence”. They are removed,Shunned & their name is announced Publicly in front of the whole Congregation.
    IF(& that’s a big IF)they ever,after claiming repentance & sorrow & a turning around for what they did, are re-instated, which would be years later-I can assure you; they will NEVER allowed to be in ANY position of authority EVER again. Personally, I have never known a Pedophile(I only know of one person removed for this Gross Sin in over 28 years) to ever come back after being Publicly shamed by the Congregation.

    Evil will go where evil is ALLOWED to go.The Bible advice is there for a reason-why ignore it???. The Congregation is supposed to be kept Clean,both Spiritually & Morally. A mother can honestly feel safe allowing her young child to go to the toilet alone in our Religion. If these Filth are just smacked on the wrist & sanitized in other Churches, I feel for the poor Mothers who would be frantic knowing that a Pedophile has been so-called,”Forgiven by Jesus”, & is allowed to associate freely around their children. I am sorry, But I would have to leave any Church that CONDONES these evil persons & their actions, by allowing them to remain.

    Surely the Churches are not so desperate for parishioners that they have to keep Pedophiles in the Congregation & ignore the Bibles(God’s Word) advice to remove the wicked persons. Who is a gross sinner,if not a disgusting Pedophile?

  • Elbie

    That’s a powerful response, Joeythebushkangaroo. What religion and denomination you belong to?

  • joeythebushkangaroo

    Dear Learning to be a survivor.
    I totally understand where you are coming from. Your analogy was very good. I am a survivor too & My 3yo son(now 32yo) was molested as well. There does not seem to be any MORAL consequences for her heinous crime–that is what it is. It is as if this “poor” woman just had a “moment” of weakness. NO!!, it was selfish,deceitful,evil –just as Murder & Rape are, and certainly NOT Godly. These are Serious Sins.

    It’s as if a Production has been put on to advertise for the Church. “Look what we can do, we will welcome you Pedophiles, Rapists & Murderers.You will not be shunned here!!Look how Loving we are?” What about the victim? Where is his support & help for him to cope with something that will be with him for the rest of his life?

    It is insulting to our Creator,I feel, as if they are accusing Him of having no standards at all. He does have standards & the advice given through his Word the Bible in
    1 Corinthians 5:13, is to “Remove the wicked man from among you”.
    Why?- This is to protect the innocent people,including Children, in the Congregation from evil persons & the bad influences of such Gross sinners.

    This woman is a criminal & should be treated as such. For the sake of one Pedophile, the Church will probably lose a multitude of decent & frightened people(sheep).

    Its similar to having one of your many children, getting involved with Heroin, in your own home. For the sake of the other children & out of LOVE for them-you would REMOVE the offending child from your other children to PROTECT them. If the Drug-Abusing child later has a turn-around & is rehabilitated,then, yes you would welcome him back. But, not until you are POSITIVE that he is REFORMED, as your responsibility is to CARE for ALL your children,not just the one.

    Allowing the Heroin Addict to STAY there and endanger your other Children, is not loving at all but absolute FOOLISHNESS & NEGLECTFUL. Some Churches obviously need to rethink what caring,(Shepherding) of their Congregational Flock really means.They should be keeping the WOLF away,not welcoming the Wolf into the flock with open arms-thus, don’t be surprised if your decent sheep run away!!

  • joeythebushkangaroo

    Hi there Elbie,
    The Religion I belong to is one that does not tolerate or condone this type of wish-washy slapping on the wrists of SERIOUS wrong-doing. Ask around, at the Churches & among your friends & acquaintances, which of the Religions actually FOLLOWS the advice given in the Bible at 1 Corinthians 5:13? If I had small children again, I would not be in any church that does not follow that Scriptural advice.
    Highest regards Joey:)

  • Elbie

    Joey, now I’m trying to understand why you don’t want to tell me to which religion/denomination you belong! I’m sure you know that following your suggestion about how to receive the answer to my original question won’t be any help at all. Receiving such an evasive reply from you makes me suspect that your unwillingness to answer my enquiry is because on some level you feel insecure about your religion? If you would like to answer my question, I’d love to hear back from you. It was an innocent question, after all, because I was impressed by your certainty in the integrity of your congregation.

  • I’m assuming the church made the video at the end because it was a same-gendered rape, so it was about “converting” one of the gays to Jesus. If it had been a male teacher raping a female student, I wonder if they would have “loved on” him in the same way.

  • ken

    Totally agree with you.
    What I hear is that she did not come up with the “right” psychological response or attitude that would show remorse.

    The video is a snippet of many more events. I can’t use this tiny snippet to judge her as false and guilty. I hope the victims find peace and healing, but I also hope the lady in the video find wholeness. I dont get why everyone is suddenly trying to act like psychological experts.

  • ken

    Got to agree with you.
    Some people here sound pretty vicious with their gospel clubs.

    I’m a victim of abuse and I can smile with the perpetrator today. I have a family and i am happy.

    Why do i have no issues with the lady who abused me?
    Duh, it’s simple.
    People change – and the power of the blood is real.

    Can’t join you guys to stigmatize her and though the pastor comes across like a someone doing a commercial, it’s up to god to judge hearts

  • ken

    Spot on

  • We’er not people trying to be psychological experts. We are, however, trying to protect children. People who commit this crime commit it repeatedly. Do the research.

  • Are you convinced your position would be ‘healed now and smiling with my molester’ had your abuse been of the homosexual nature?

  • hit report abuse button by error.

  • Rachael

    A good book on this subject is The Other Side of Sin. You may find it helpful. Another one is The Crucified God by Jurgen Moltmann, but that one is a little more difficult to read.

    The Other Side of Sin addresses the woundedness of victims and the failure of the retributive justice system to fully bring justice. Just punishment is not true justice. It does not even the scales because it does not work to heal the victim. I believe in a God who desires restorative justice, healing for the abused and violated, not just punishment for perpetrators. That’s what is missing in this picture. Where is the redemption for this young boy whom this woman raped? Sure, she may find some healing in Christ, but if she really has then she needs to work for restoration in the situation as far as is appropriate. It’s not justice until he finds healing.

  • Sandy Johnson

    I stumbled on this site doing some research. Before I respond please let me say that I have never harmed a child, nor do I condone such behavior. As well I have a family of my own whom I love unconditionally. I was raised as a christian. I read the responses that many of you have posted and I must say I am surprised at your personal judgements and convictions. Were we not taught that that is not the way of God? Were we not taught that those who commit sin must seek redemption before God? This woman is not without imperfections obviously, but who is? There is no one perfect soul on this earth. To assume (and that is what was done here, a complete assumption) that this woman is incapable of recognizing her fault and is unable to change before the eyes of God is completely absurd. We should be humbled and conscience-stricken by the many sins that are committed of ourselves and others, regardless the degree, and not feel superior to those who sin in ways we don’t or in ways other than the way we have done. This pastor has done a great deed before God. He has accepted and assisted, as he should, someone who has made a tremendous effort to redeem themselves and truly change. If you only understood the dark cloud that you cast on someone who has made an honest turnaround but is not afforded the opportunity to be acknowledged for this, I guarantee you would retract your statement, and you would think twice about your personal convictions of another of God’s children. That is HIs job, and that is what she seeks, His conviction, so that she can truly understand her fault, become aware of it, and make a true change in the presence of God.

  • Kristin McGuire

    Dear friend, I’m sure the comments questioning the sincerity of the perpetrator in this case sound very judgmental to you. Perhaps it’s because you have never been the victim of such a crime. The point is not to rob the woman of her chance to be redeemed but just to acknowledge that more was being made of showing acceptance for her than of rescuing the poor victim from the abyss of lifelong struggle and shame that he will inevitably experience because of her “selfish choices”. Just the fact that she refers to her ignominy in such a way is evidence to me that she hasn’t fully embraced the magnitude of her crime. Just curious as to why you were researching in this area if you presumably have never been involved in this type of thing?

  • Judy Jones

    Thank you for this article. and you are so right on…!
    Something for us to keep in mind-
    Child predators are very cunning and manipulative. They know every trick on how to groom, threaten, lie, and put the fear of god into their victims and
    sometimes even their family members. They also appear to do a lot of goods things, they can be very charismatic and you may think they would never harm a child. They have to be this way, in order to not get caught and to continue to abuse. They devote lots of time and energy building trust with their victims by giving them money and gifts. They tend to make the child feel that they are special and loved.

    Sexual predators are often powerful and well-loved. It would be comforting if those who preyed on the vulnerable were obvious social misfits whose appearance
    would somehow set off alarm bells and give us the willies or the creeps. They rarely do. Usually, predators are among the last people we would suspect of
    sexually violating others. At a party, the predator isn’t some oddball sitting alone in a corner because others feel uncomfortable with him. Most often, the predator is the guy throwing the party.

    Sexual predators are often powerful and well-loved. We must overcome the dangerous myth that because someone is successful or warm or caring, he or she couldn’t have done that!
    And we must stop thinking that because a man is old, that somehow he’s automatically safe. It’s just irresponsible to endanger kids by assuming an adult is harmless simply because he or she may be losing hair, wearing glasses, using hearing aids or walking with a cane. These can be signs of advancing age, but they are not signs that an individual is safe around kids.
    Child sex predators need to be kept far away from kids forever…

    It takes a ton of courage to come forward and take action about being sexually abused. This is not an easy thing to do, but it is extremely rare that a child predator has only one victim. Some have many. Child predators need to be kept far away from kids forever

    Silence ia not an option anymore, it only hurts, and by speaking up there is a chance for healing, exposing the truth, and therefore protecting others.
    Judy Jones, SNAP, Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests

  • Pingback: Five common characteristics of child sexual offenders: Eliminating the edge | Rhymes with Religion()

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  • Steve

    That “pastor” is a fool and a tool. She played him like a harp. He is unfit to be a shepherd and should step down until he gets a proper education in protecting sheep and has a board of elders that will enforce it!

  • Elba

    Maybe it’s your style of approach that deters them, robert?

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  • Robert Newmlller

    To better understand my approach, I encourage you to get a copy of my book. I am hopeful you will comment again after you have completed reading it.

    Thank you.

  • ColleenInWis

    Patrice, you nailed it with these 2 points: “Imagine if, in that story, the church leader who went around the hurt person, then set the highway robber up as a testimony to God’s love, because he said he was sorry.

    The parable also speaks to another fact: it is often those outside (not inside) the church who care for the damaged/broken. It is as true now as then, and that is very very sad!”

    I pray the Body of Christ will wake up to these sins and quickly learn how to help the victims. I pray for those in the Church who are ministering to victims and oppressed around the world. I pray for our Father to reach down and touch hurting people through us.

  • ColleenInWis

    Great point, Steve–we can sabotage the work of true repentance by letting an offender, or ourselves, off too easily. I totally agree. The trials in our lives, including consequences for our sins, are there to drive us to the foot of the cross in true surrender. Taking the easy way out can mar God’s purpose and His plan to change us. See James 1:2-4. Thanks for sharing your testimony of that process.

  • Heidi

    Robert Newmiller, I looked up your book and read a portion of it. As a mother of 5 – 4 of whom were raped, molested, etc. by someone in our church – my heart aches for you. I’m sorry for your pain.

  • Robert Newmiller


    Thank you for your reply. I can’t imagine what pain you must be in as well. Don’t give up on Jesus as He has promised to set all things right. Incidentally, if any of your children are still within the statutes for prosecution, please encourage them to proceed. It will be difficult, but, it is best for the victim and the community.

  • Mary Jo Noworyta

    Elba, Robert is spot on. Churches do not want to get involved in stopping Clergy Sexual Abuse. Thousands of victims have experienced a lack of concern by the church as a whole. Read his book and also check out The Hope of Survivors and learn about the truths and dynamics of abuse within the church. It is not his approach. It is a lack of understanding the truth.

  • Mary Jo:

    It would be nice to know that your endorsement came from a source who actually read the book. Would I be correct in believing that you have? Please advise.

  • Terri

    On a related note, there’s a relatively new page on Facebook specifically for information and support for victims of clergy abuse (Adventists Stopping All Predators):

  • SurvivorNotVictim

    As a survivor of repeated abuse by a trusted and well-respected church member (and family), I can relate to this questioning of “where was God?” I was questioned and discredited by church members even after the abuser admitted what he had done (though he marginalized his actions). I was ostracized. The abuser was good-looking, social, and highly involved in our church. He wasn’t the “creep” people imagine when they think of offenders. I was so ashamed, embarrassed, and afraid of losing my social support in the church (at age 16) that I did not tell for years and the abuse continued. Also, I liked the guy (outwardly, he appeared to be such a nice person). I loved his family. I didn’t want to be the source of hurt to them.. When I did reveal the abuse, all of my fears materialized. Adults did nothing. My parents were convinced by the abuser’s family to not press charges (our families were very close and had been for generations). My friends turned their backs on me (“well, what how did she provoke it…there must be two sides…if it was so bad, then why did she wait to tell…why didn’t she scream out in her sleep and stop it…”). One friend I confided in actually said, “It’s better to let it go and not talk about it anymore.” I left the church during college and completely questioned God’s existence. After several years I realized bad things happen to good people all of the time that don’t make sense to my human mind. It isn’t right. It isn’t okay. Perpetrators of human crime should be punished in human courts. But it isn’t God’s fault. It’s man’s. God is there through it all. This world is so small–and we cannot judge God on the smallness of this world and some horrible people in it. We learn through these experiences. We are broken by man, and healed through God. The man who abused me actually wrote my mother a letter and was angry that my mother told other church members. He actually begged me to silence my mother (“I’m changed…people have done worse…I thought we were over this…I’ll be an outcast and never have a normal life if more people know…”). I have since realized that the people who covered this up were all selfish and just wrong. All of them, including the abuser, will face God at judgment time. But so will I. We each walk our own walk. I cannot harbor bitterness that grows to hatred. God will read each heart and deal accordingly. I do have a peace knowing this abuser has no power over me anymore. Scars remain, but God has taken the hurt away and given me strength. He can give us all that strength. I pray that all churches and church leaders take a firm stand to protect its members from sexual abuse. Shine a light in dark places. Give love, support, and comfort to victims broken by abuse. And I pray survivors know that there is strength and healing through God. Please don’t blame Him for the faults of men.

  • SurvivorNotVictim

    Yes. And thank you, Boz, for this discourse. The church has a responsibility to protect other “sheep” and to aid the once-abuser from being in the midst of more temptation. Shine a light on dark places. That does not equate not loving the abuser. That does not mean believing the once-abuser is beyond grace and redemption. That does not mean harboring hate for the abuser. That does mean making others aware and keeping the abuser away from other opportunities for abuse. I wouldn’t advocate an alcoholic hang out in a bar. Likewise, I wouldn’t have a known sex offender around more children. Not shining that light on what is more than a capability, it is committed action against others, is purely negligent (and it is also a crime and sin). Let’s not confuse love, grace, and redemption with acknowledgement and awareness. Recidivism rates are higher across longer spans of time (at ten years and even at twenty years).

  • joeythebushkangaroo

    I am amazed that your experience is so close to mine. All except the Perpetrator was my Uncle (Baptist) who lived in our home with us & also his twin brother did so too around the same time.

    When it came out about the one who lived with us in 2001,my family either ostracized me,doubted me,minimized it all or never discussed it ever again.My Mother even spoke to him before she spoke with me & rang me saying,”But he said he only did it once(which was not true anyway)”. I said to her that “Mum, what sort of Mother would speak to a Pedophile before her own daughter, the victim? What they did to me was actually worse than the original abuse,I was re-victimized all over again & not by just one or 2 perpetrators,but also the many members of my own family-Mother,Father,Sisters,Auntie,Cousins,Brothers.

    I became completely suicidal & now I realize why my parents reacted the way they did-
    1) it meant they were negligent parents & who wants to admit that when you are very proud & can do no wrong??
    2) They did not want to cease having contact with the criminal & his wife,my Mums Sister.
    I went to a self-help group called GROW which helped immensely for 18 months & had no contact with my parents in that time.

    Either I was a lying trouble-making little tart(6-7yo? when it was happening) or they were disgustingly inadequate & pathetic parents…its easy now to see which was the easiest route to take for my own parents.

    Only one of my Brothers showed the proper reaction to what had happened & stood up to the perpetrator & my parents. My other Brothers said absolutely nothing for fear of upsetting my parents who felt I was destroying our family by ever telling anyone. My Dad even rang me & said “What are you doing to my Family?”

    I decided that it was no use going to court as it was my word against his so I decided to protect other children from him & warned my own Siblings,& 2 of his oldest children to keep their children away from him,never leave them alone near him. I posted those letters to all these people & would you believe it, they all received the letters on 9/11. At 1st It was disappointing that the sting had been taken out of my letter to them by the tragedy of 9/11 in the USA,but my husband said,”NO,there will be an explosion also going off in each home the letters arrive at”.

    Now,13 years after it came out-If I ever mention it ,its “You’re not bringing up the past again?”, or “you should not have told his children”,etc etc. I personally think its a problem with all of our society, not just some Churches that whenever a sexual assault takes place,most blame the victim. I am not anti-Religion,but anti FALSE RELIGION. People who do this crime against Children are NOT True Christians & either are those that minimize it & blame the victims somehow.This also happens in non-religious families.

    I even told my own Mother,when I was 53yo that I had been raped by 2 different older men at different times in my early 20s & she said “well lets never mention this again,Ok”. What sort of society do we live in where a sexual assault takes place & the victim is somehow blamed? No wonder some NEVER tell anyone about what has happened to them. I have not even considered telling my Mother(my Dad is dead now) about the other One that molested me as a child. If someone has an agenda,you are taking a risk by telling them. Only GENUINE people should be spoken in person to, for your own mental healths sake—or write a letter. The power of the pen!!! The best thing I did. Very cathartic!!!

  • steve

    im sorry but this whole concept of 14 and 15 year old boys being little angels and victums when something like this happens just isn’t the case most of the time..proably in most cases hes high fiving his buddles im sure…your also talking about something that was common in biblcal times some 15 year old boys simply are not traumatized by sex with older people it goes on all the time

  • steve

    severe damage she has caused the boy? really? how do you know that..i am sure he is most likely not damged by this at all he was proably high fiving his was legally wrong ..yes but im sorry some age of consent laws are beyond stupid…16 year olds in flordia can have sex wih 23 year olds but 24 its all of a sudden rape and trauma and “victums” not to mention if this “child” took a pistol out and shot up his school he be charged as an adult th elegal system is full of these kinds of hypocritical loopsholes…these 14 and 15 and 16 year old boys are not these nnocent angels you assume them to be

  • Carl

    I know when I was 14 I was bragging about “getting some” from a woman. Back then, this stuff made a 14’er legend.

  • Learning to be a survivor

    This comment and view seems to me to be really lacking in understanding. There may be 14 and 15 year old boys who have an interest in a physical relationship with another person. When that other person is another teenager of about the same age and maturity and both with mutual agreement, that is not an issue of abuse. It could still result in a lot of regret and hurt, but it isn’t abuse.
    However, to make the assumption that the boy in this situation was somehow responsible is wrong and cruel.
    Abuse comes about when one person is significantly more mature than another or holds power of some sort over the other. Anytime one person is using some sort of power to manipulate another, that is VERY wrong and is abuse.
    This was a grown women who knew and understood that the boy was a child. Adults are supposed to protect children even when a child doesn’t know to protect himself or herself. I don’t know if this boy tried to protect himself or not, but either way, he was a child and she was an adult. She should have protected him.
    Think about what you are saying. Are you saying that any adult can freely have sexual relations with any child who could possibly be accused of showing an interest? What about children who are being sexually trafficked? If a child approaches you and offers you sexual services, what would you do? Would you not immediately step in and act to protect? Wouldn’t you immediately see that child as a child who desperately needs protection? Wouldn’t your heart break? Wouldn’t you want to very quickly establish a clear boundary that provides the child with immediate protection and security? If you had continued contact with that child, wouldn’t you consistently role model a safe and healthy adult / child relationship?
    Imagine this being your own child – a son or daughter. Do you really think it is okay for an adult to prey on the vulnerabilities of children? This is something horrifying, not something that can be justified! No matter how much an adult may struggle with whatever struggles they have, there is never an excuse for one who crosses the line to abuse another – another adult and especially a child.

    I attended a christian high school. At that school, it was fairly well known among my classmates that one of the female teachers would give certain boys in our class special privileges, test answers, etc. for favors. We were all kids and all saw the situation from the perspective of kids. As a kid who saw these boys come back with test answers that they would pass out to the rest of us, I didn’t understand. I saw her spend a great deal of time flirting with them, complimenting them, seeking them out to “help” her, talking to them as if they were peers. She was a grown women with her own children in high school. She confided in us that her husband was jealous and threatening. It seems she made the boys feel protective of her. At the time, I didn’t understand. I couldn’t understand. I didn’t know it was abuse. While I disliked what was happening, I didn’t understand it.
    As an adult, I look back and am horrified but the things that happened. She knew they were just teenage boys and she knew exactly how to manipulate them. Her choices were selfish and abusive and my peers still live with the consequences of what she did. It is sick and evil.
    I strongly object to anyone blaming a child for an adult’s sexual abuse of them.

  • joeythebushkangaroo

    I am horrified at this comment & your last one. I am the victim of sexual assault myself as a small child,by relatives,then at 16 by a 21yo man & again in my 20s was raped by 2 ‘Friends’. Sexual abuse causes the victims boundaries to be damaged,which then can put them in vulnerable positions later as well-which is what has happened to me from child sexual abuse.What u r saying is the type of propaganda that pedophiles spread all over the Internet. How dare u presume to know that this does not cause any damage. I am in my 50s & still living with the destructive behavior that all of my perpetrators inflicted upon me. They probably do not think it was damaging either-BUT IT WAS & STILL IS!
    This is what a Pedophile thinks,that he or she is ‘loving’ the child,not hurting the child. It is distressing for a victim even to hear such a comment from someone. It is already hard enough to convince others that we were abused without this insinuation that somehow we liked it & it does us no harm anyway. Your words are very hurtful to victims of sexual abuse:(

  • steve

    um first of all..if you were a child 12 or under I am not speaking about that..and I give you my sincere condoloences…second 16 and 21 in most of the world is not considered stautaory rape in the uk and most parts of the world even place in the unted states including florida(16 and 23 is legal)..depending on if you were forcibaly raped or drugged or something of that nature then that is different..and I have hard time believing in your twenties ..again..unless you were forcibly raped or drugged that you can classify in your 20s that was any form of pedophilia. that is otherwise consnetual sex not abuse..the correct term anyway would be ebophilia pedophilia s pre pubsent…

  • joeythebushkangaroo

    Well, again I find your answer offensive to anyone,whether child,teenager (16 is still a child Legally) or an adult who has been sexually assaulted. You totally lack understanding & actually in Australia where I live it is classed as Statutory rape if the age difference is enough between a child & another person. If a girl is 16 & the male is 18 & they are girlfriend & boyfriend is totally different than if the male is 21yo & the female was in a vulnerable position & had never met the person before.

    What you are not getting is that a Child’s/teenager’s sexual abuse has damaged the person,even as an adult, so that they are not aware of the danger of any person being nice to them–then they are taken advantage of & revert to how they reacted as a child if they are assaulted again-some even become mute like myself.

    As for DOUBTING that I was raped in my 20s by 2 different “friends”,how insulting! I have already gone thru enough without an ignorant jerk like yourself even doubting what I have been thru. How dare you even comment on this site. People come here for support from the trauma of sexual assault & do not need then to be doubted & to have their suffering minimized by someone who knows nothing of what is being discussed.

    God help any loved one(daughter,sister,wife,girlfriend) who comes in contact with you who opens up about a sexual assault & is looking for any empathy-as it appears you are lacking terribly. I have known marriages to break up over a very ignorant & thoughtless comment about this type of thing, by a husband to his wife,when she told him what had happened to her. She was re-victimized again by her very own Husband.

    It was a deal-breaker for her & she rightly left him. Ironically,unbeknownst to everyone, he was guilty of raping his own 8yo sister as a child for years,right up until he got married-no wonder he told his wife she “must have asked for it” when she was assaulted by an Uncle herself, as a teenager. No wonder he had no empathy for her-it would have condemned him If he had showed sympathy to her.

    Please do not reply back to me-as I find your thinking very offensive & obviously you are not capable of understanding this type of trauma. I want to forget that I ever read your ridiculous, uneducated opinion. Go troll somewhere where you know what u r talking about:(

  • steve

    I did not concretly deny you were raped at 2o I asked if you were forced held down kidnapped or drugged..cause if none of those things happened 20 years old is of consentual age you cant call that statutory as this case in the article is..i have stated a lot of these people aqre not traumatized I know people who have been 15 and 16 who have had sex with much older people even dated them that did not feel they were victums..this ofocurse does not apply to everyone I understand that

  • Carl

    I don’t know about Steve, but I certainly do not endorse adult/child sexual relationships.

  • Carl

    Joey, I do not know about Steve, but I have been molested as a child as well as forcefully raped against my will while in my late teens. I know what it is like to be physically restrained & drugged against my will while being raped.

    You miss what I feel Steve is saying. Perhaps I am incorrect (if so, Steve please correct me). There is a difference between forcefully raping someone and the alleged victim “wanting it”. Is it still right for the adult/child sexual relationship? No, not by any means. However, the willingness and voluntary interaction of the alleged victim I feel should be strongly considered if any criminal charges are brought forth.

    Joey, you are emphasizing on the involuntary nature of what your alleged friends did to you. I am not, nor do I see Steve, negating the traumatic impact that had on you. Steve is emphasizing on the voluntary actions by the young men.

    I personally find it nauseating when female teachers get literally 1/10 the sentence a male teacher gets for the very same thing. Of course it’s wrong, very wrong, for any person in an authoritative roll to take advantage of that role for sexual gratification, even though they may at the time feel that there is no authoritative roll. ANY authoritative roll, even as adult/adult sexual relationships is, technically, sexual assault. Would the victim still engage in the sexual relationship if there was not authoritative relationship? THAT is important.

    But as I hope I have already made clear, there is a huge difference in voluntary sexual relationships and involuntary rape.

    I am truly sorry Joey for the traumas you have been through. I know this personally how horrible they are. I live with the nightmares even today, and it has been over 27 years since it happened. I remember the cops making fun of it, laughing. I wasn’t the first to report it, the doctor at the hospital I ended up in did. I remember the threats of arrest for the times I called the crisis line after having horrifying nightmares. And the cops then even making fun of it. I remember the terrible feelings I had when I was going in to the county health every 6 months to get tested for AIDS & HIV. I was doing that from 1987 until 2000. Terrified because I had zero emotional support. Terrified because I not only witnessed the lack of action by the cops, but the very real truth that really, a man can be forcefully raped by a homosexual and no one really gives a damn. Nothing will happen to the rapist. Because it is so unmanly to be raped.

    But Joey, you and I know how wrong that is, we both know that it is not acceptable, we know this first hand, and there are no words I can truly describe it. But I do not see any of what Steve is saying to be anything that supports these acts you and I experienced.

  • steve are correct in your statements..theres ahuge difference..i know a lot of pople will disagree as well I am also not on this train of “authentic repetence” means automatically turning yourself in in all cases either..i am a beliver in the genuine baptism of the holy spirirt..evidenced with speaking n other toungues ia m not a pryesptarian or a luthern or baptist who don’t belive in his..its real..and whe god gives it to omeone their reptence is accepted..and there has been many cases of people that broke the laws of the land when they were yonger in some of these ways that are not recividivist pedophiles and raping young children every chance they get..there has been people 18 and 19 who messed around with 13 years olds in thiuer youth who ever went to the ploice and god gave them the holy spirirt…am I condong not turning yourself in?no ofcourse not but many of these cases are absurd im sorry…I mean what if a person who in their 20s on drugs had sexual relations with a 15 year old 15 years ago not a sexual predator but did something rong..even going to the person years later asking forgivness…does that person need to turn themselves in for something that happened 15 years I don’t belive that…many of these cases are complex I don’t belive some of these cases deserve 10 years in a violent prision..and then we have the class of people who have sex with 5 year olds which is compltley adifferent ball game..vs the 14 and 15 year old boy who consentually has sex with someone older like in their 20s..does not regret it and is not traumatised by it…

  • Learning to be a survivor

    You really need to stop posting and start listening. Your comments are uninformed and cruel. You just told a victim of sexual abuse that the abuse they experienced wasn’t abuse. Your comments reflect the thought processes of an offender, not a victim and definitely not someone who would protect someone vulnerable.

  • steve

    that is not what I said you need to re read and read carls statemnts…I said you cant be consnetually raped at 20 and theres amajor difference…I asked him to calrify if he was forcibly raped…

  • Rick Patton

    Please God, let Boz read this:
    I wonder whether there will ever be room in your heart for genuine forgiveness. The young lady in this video did a horrible thing, and she should bear the consequences. Sowing to the flesh, even in her youth, will reap corruption. We will not escape that immutable spiritual law. But why condemn her apology? Why castigate her desire to be forgiven? You and 99% of the comments remind me of the crowd surrounding the woman caught in adultery, caught in the very act. Please God, start writing on the ground again. Yes, a great sin occurred, but put the stones down. Paul murdered believers before he became one. Paul regretted throwing stones. Will you make no allowance for redemptive grace for this young lady? Will she not be permitted a “Damascus Road” experience? If Christ’s “outside the box” response to those who would have gladly stoned the adulteress is any example, put the stones down. She should be prosecuted. She should reap what she has sown. She should never be allowed to teach minor children again. But she should be forgiven if that is what she truly seeks. I will not presume her insincerity anymore than I will presume yours. But Boz, we do not need spiritual “Al Sharptons” to gin up hatred in our hearts. I see no attempts on your part to rein in that hatred, Boz. Your grandfather would and did. I will mourn the victims. I will pray for the souls of the perpetrators. I will forgive this young lady unless and until she proves her insincerity. Put the rocks down. You would not survive the scrutiny of the hand of God writing on the ground.

  • Thank you Boz. This pastor and his church are a perfect example of what the Apostle Paul identified in the church at Corinth. In the face of blatant sin in the church, Paul told them that instead of being broken over what was going on in their midst, they were arrogant. That is my take on this pastor and the fact that he posted this sex offender’s “repentance” online. It is more than just being duped by the offender’s false repentance, it is rank arrogance and boasting about how he and his church are so gracious to her. In all this, they have re-victimized the victim and the victim’s family, showering them with false guilt and pressuring them to “forgive.”

  • Rick – being wise about true and false repentance is not “to gin up hatred” as you put it. These are pretty serious charges you are making here against Boz. You say that you will forgive this young lady unless and until she proves her insincerity. You have it totally backwards. John the Baptist told the hypocrite “repentant” Pharisees to bring forth fruits in keeping with their supposed repentance. He did not do what you claim we should all do – accept a professed repentance and then wait for any evidence of insincerity. Nope. He saw that their repentance was false and insisted on seeing the fruit of genuine repentance. If you apply the same reasoning to John that you are applying to Boz here, you will necessarily have to accuse John of the same charges. For myself, I am going with John the Baptist.

  • Nope, it was a “young man” as the pastor put it. By the way, notice how this pastor is minimizing the evil here. “Young man” as he calls the 14 year old BOY. This teacher raped a CHILD.


    and furthermorehy is it boz always assumes these people in these kinds of situations are “traumatized” we live in a psychology culture I know plenty of boys who had sex at 14 and 15 years old with much older people who are just fine and never felt traumatized or remotely all likely hood a 14 year old boy having sex with his older teacher..however inappropriate was proably not traumatizing at all its the media coverage and people yelling in his face constantly that he was raped is the more traumatizing issue..does it happen? sure..but I know plenty where nothing like that all likley hood his trauma was proably his wrist after all his high fives..the same bible you carry around didn’t have victum mentality when it came to what the law of man calls stautaory rape.and lets face it a teen boy who was “raped many times” wasn’t many of these cases the 15 year old boy planned it..knew what was going on and continued over and over again to engage in sexual activity..that is not rape biblically I don’t care what the united states government says…in that bible if two men or a boy and a girl were caught in the act the boy wouldn’t have been a “victum” he would have been either stoned..or forced to marry.. and don’t get me started on this tax payer waste of money criminalizing or sucking up tax payer money when a 17 year old has sex with a 13 year old and then tagging them with rape charges and locking them up in prison..ridiculus…we need consent laws but they should be tried case by case..cause not every case is the same at all a 15 almost 16 year old in which a magic wand is waved in 3 months where they are perfectly consentual and legal to engage in sex with a 23 year old but then 3 months prior its rape and now he person is a traumatized victum is non sensical not to mention non biblical when the age of consent is 15 in Germany france Italy japan and china…and Sweden and spain…


    and im glad your not the judge of what repetence is and isn’ would urk you to no end to know I know people who at 18 had sex wih 13 year olds as unbelivers and later recived the holy spirirt of god without ever turning themselves in as “fruit of their repetence” and even are friends wih those people to this much for the poor victum..I also know people that in their mid twenties married their 15 year old girlfriends but youd say they raped them .I know many people that did evils in this reguard as heathens that have contacted and apologized to their “victums” and been forgiven that went on to live holy lives without re incidence that did those thinsg as unbelivers that cast out demons today and live holy.. by the way you wouldnt know what the spirirt of god is cause your a T.U.L.I.P believer and a calvanist Baptist..which in some cases is worse than a repented sex offender in the first century that entire belief system would have been denounced as hersey by the apostles and their students of the first 150 years..and being a reformed Baptist im pretty sure you don’t believe in toungues or the power of god or have ever casted out one devil..cause most of your organization doesn’t believe in it which means you do not have the holy spirirt…nor its power among you..

  • Rick

    Seventy times seven Jeff. Until the Lord anoints you as He did John the Baptist, seventy times seven.

  • steve

    so let me ask you…do you honestly think its rape if a 14 year old boy lies to aperson in their twenties tells them they are 16 (age of consent in most states) talks to the person for months online..knows the person is sexually interested and want the encounter to happen and then meets the person for honestly believe that is rape? biblically and all your feelings and emotions and American law aside would the creator of the universe call that rape?.i know of a situation like this happening 10 something years ago… I also know 22 year olds than decades ago had sex with very willing 15 almost 16 year olds who talked for many months and knew exactly what they were doing and as adults today still talk to the people they had sex with…is that rape? considering as I said in many parts of the world 15 is considered consentual age? you cant pull the rape card on every case im sorry it doesn’t work that way biblically or otherwise..i understand a 13 year old and a 30 year old or something but not all these cases can be classified as rape..your telling me a 17 year old who has sex with a 14 year old a mere three year difference that happens every day in this country is rape? would you have said these same things in biblical days when this was common behavior and god accepted it as valid

  • steve

    if he was homosexual would he care? im sorry to burst the bubble hear I knowmany gay boys who at 15 and 14 had sex with people in their 20s and they loved it and have no problems with it as fact man still talk to the people they had sex with today..this whole concept that every stuatory rape case is some traumatic event is simply not so even the research suggest that I know proably 5-10 people who have had these experiences..the most traumatizing thing is not the sex itself its proably people like you hammering that hes a victum and shoving him into a court trial and new media and several other things all likely hood this boy is not traumatized at all and proably enjoyed the experience..most studies actually prove that..i even at 24 dated a 16 year old boy and we were very much in love I still talk to him to this day..its legal but if I would have had sex with him 5 months previous youd say it was rape and hes a poor victum..its just simply not so in every case im sorry

  • Kimberly

    I doubt that she played him, because like minded people attract like minded people. She was just another willing follower, following her earthly shepherd. They are just hopeful that they can play other people like themselves!

  • Praise the lord I found this site. Some of your comments people are way off base.When everything goes wrong get it right! Some people need to read there bibles more. When Jesus heard it, he said unto them. They that are whole have no need for a physician. but they that are sick. I came not to call the righteous but sinners to repentance. Jesus saves man doesn’t. God loves us no matter what. Did he not say all have gone astray each and everyone. I am a sex offender, sure I am not proud of myself. Is this not a perverse generation? Let’s face it whether your a sex offender, a murderer, a child abuser, or whatever its all a sin to God and he forgives. God is a loving God. Now if you all church people and those that comment on here take a good look at themselves we should all be ashamed of ourselves. Those that know the bible and God’s forgiveness should understand that we all error and make mistakes in our life. There is not a just man upon earth that doeth good and sinneth not. God forgives and whether some don’t than they need to read the one about “love thy neighbor as thyself” I think that sums’ up the whole law of God.

  • This was triggering to watch, but I am glad I watched it. The creepy part is that as a watched, my brain began telling me, “what if you did this as a result of your PTSD? What if this woman is a trauma victim and was dissociated?” I quickly came to a conclusion that disproved these thoughts: 1) this woman had no remorse or desire to change. 2) I’ve never heard of a trauma victim committing such a crime because of dissociation.

    This woman is a liar. She is an abuser and a rapist. I feel that I need to state that, since she doesn’t. She doesn’t take responsibility, but instead, blames the victim. I know of this all too well in my own life. It makes us as victims feel like it is all our fault, and that we should have stopped the abuse.

    This teenage boy was NOT involved in the misuse of his own body. This boy was a victim. I pray that he never sees this video and not once questions his perfectly acceptable emotions toward this evil woman. Forgiveness needs to be for his sake,…

  • steve

    and how do you know his life was ruined? you do know scientific studies show clealry that male stautory rape victims above 14 that consent with no force or coercion usually have a VERY VERY low incidence of harm..there is this false pedo hysteria out there that says everytime a willing 15 year old sleeps with a 23 year ld somehow it scars him for life which is aboloutley not true in most cases especially a 15 year old whos maybe 6 months away from the age of consent..and i have more news for you if that same 15 year old was ahomosexual and did this with a 24 year old and consented there would be the death penalty for the 15 year old and 24 year old in that bible you claim to beleive in there was no such thing as a made up stuatory rape law in biblical times…..i know 15 year olds who had sex with 24 year olds and 10 years later they are not scarred or harmed and they enjoyed teh experience and still talk to the people are they victims because the “law” says they were..?…

  • steve

    and how do you know his life was ruined? you do know scientific studies show clealry that male stautory rape victims above 14 that consent with no force or coercion usually have a VERY VERY low incidence of harm..there is this false pedo hysteria out there that says everytime a willing 15 year old sleeps with a 23 year ld somehow it scars him for life which is aboloutley not true in most cases especially a 15 year old whos maybe 6 months away from the age of consent..and i have more news for you if that same 15 year old was ahomosexual and did this with a 24 year old and consented there would be the death penalty for the 15 year old and 24 year old in that bible you claim to beleive in there was no such thing as a made up stuatory rape law in biblical times

  • steve

    apre me the teenagers cant consent card…the age of consent varies around the world it is not the bible guess what if a 14 and 15 year old boy consneted to sex with a female of 25 hed have to marry her and if it was two males..guess what that poor innocent angel you refer to would be stoned to stuatory rape poor victim card …i wonder if any of you relize that..stuatory rape is a ficticious idea in most cases..the same laws say a 15 year old who can consent to a 18 year old and 19 in most states cant have sex with a 22 year old..but in 6 magic months when they turn this magic age of consent can have sex with a 40 year old..but at 15 and half sex with a 20 year old is rape..its nonsense and most are not victims that is a label and tag put on people who have no clue about the realionship itself

  • steve

    well god would say they partook of thier own “abuse” lets see if your little stuatory rape nonsense held up in biblical times when a 15 year old boy was caught with a 23 year old in a consentual sexual relaionship lets see how god would judge the innocent 15 year old child..oh yeah hed put him to death…15 year olds ared not toddlers they know what they are doing…same 15 year old molested an 8 year old youd be the same hypocrite saying he knew exacly what he was doing but yet if he goes and has consnetual sex with someone 7 years older now all of a sudden hes apoor innocent victim get outta here with that nonsense..

  • steve

    i dont belive 15 year olds are children…in the bible if a 15 year old boy had sex with a 23 year old man guess what would happen if caught…that boy would be put to death with the man..hows that for victims? in these relaionships you have many variables involved and many situations not all are the same..biblically people were married at these ages..theres 15 year olds who have sex with 22 year olds willingly and know exactly what they are doing and enjoy it..theres 15 year olds i know personally who were messin around with 24 year olds and are not scarred or “abused” you cant define abuse anyway you want to..yes in some cases there is wabuse and in many there isnt…your trying to blanket things into a box..the age of consent is a arbitary concpet which changes in every state and country..a 16 year old can screw a 40 year old in one state and its legal but in teh next its rape..and stop saying consnetual sex amung intergenertational ages is always abuse..many people had long…

  • steve

    oh but the same 14 year old who can consent to an 18 year old in most states..if the same 14 year old molested a 8 year old youd be hollering he knew what he was doing he was old enough but yet if he consents willingly to a 20 year old now all of a usdden he is abused and he didnt know what he was doing and all this hypocritical nonssene

  • Robert I know its been a while since I posted on here and I don’t know much about your book but to all those that go thru this abuse, victims, family’s, churches, whatever there s one that’s the great healer of all. Man’s wisdom can’t even compare to God’s infinite wisdom. Here is a question I pose for all on these comments. How can you love thy neighbor as thyself if you don’t love yourself?
    Wasn’t Paul one of the chief sinners? I thought people were suppose to keep the bible simple.. I am glad that God has more redeeming powers than man to forgive.