Sorry, Fido. Pope Francis did NOT say our pets are going to heaven

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The New York Times was the biggest of several outlets relating an apparently apocryphal tale about pets, paradise, and Pope Francis.

The New York Times was the biggest of several outlets relating an apparently apocryphal tale about pets, paradise, and Pope Francis.

(RNS) When Pope Francis recently sought to comfort a distraught boy whose dog had died, the pontiff took the sort of pastoral approach he is famous for — telling the youngster not to worry, that he would one day see his pet in heaven.

“Paradise is open to all of God’s creatures,” Francis said reassuringly.

Pope Francis greets a crowd on his way to a meeting with cardinals at the Vatican on Feb. 21, 2014. RNS photo by David Gibson

Pope Francis greets a crowd on his way to a meeting with cardinals at the Vatican on Feb. 21, 2014. RNS photo by David Gibson

It was a sparkling moment on a rainy November day, and the setting in St. Peter’s Square only burnished Francis’ reputation as a kindly “people’s pope.” The story naturally lit up social media, became instant promotional material for vegetarians and animal rights groups, and on Friday (Dec. 12) even made it to the front page of The New York Times.

There’s only one problem: None of it ever happened.

Yes, a version of that quotation was uttered by a pope, but it was said decades ago by Paul VI, who died in 1978. There is no evidence that Francis repeated the words during his public audience on Nov. 26, as has been widely reported, nor was there a boy mourning his dead dog.

“There is a fundamental rule in journalism. That is double-checking, and in this case it was not done,” the Vatican’s deputy spokesman, the Rev. Ciro Benedettini, told Reuters on Saturday.

The Vatican reaction came a day after Religion News Service debunked the story.

So how could such a fable so quickly become taken as fact?

Part of the answer may be the topic of the pope’s talk to the crowd that day, which centered on the End Times and the transformation of all creation into a “new heaven” and a “new earth.” Citing St. Paul in the New Testament, Francis said that is not “the annihilation of the cosmos and of everything around us, but the bringing of all things into the fullness of being.”

The trail of digital bread crumbs then appears to lead to an Italian news report that extended Francis’ discussion of a renewed creation to the wider question of whether animals too will go to heaven, and what previous popes have said.

“One day we will see our pets in the eternity of Christ,” the report quoted Paul VI as telling a disconsolate boy years ago.

The story was titled, somewhat misleadingly: “Paradise for animals? The Pope doesn’t rule it out.” It wasn’t clear which pope the writer meant, however.

The next day, Nov. 27, a story in the Italian daily Corriere della Sera by veteran Vaticanista Gian Guido Vecchi pushed the headline further: “The Pope and pets: ‘Paradise is open to all creatures.’”

Vecchi faithfully recounted the pope’s talk about a new creation, and also cited Paul VI’s remark. But the headline put those words in Francis’ mouth, and that became the story.

The Italian version of The Huffington Post picked it up next and ran an article quoting Francis as saying “We will go to heaven with the animals” and contending that the pope was quoting St. Paul — not Pope Paul — as making that statement to console a boy who lost his dog. (That story, by the way, is nowhere in the Bible.)

The urban legend became unstoppable a week later when it was translated into English and picked up by the British press, which had Francis saying: “Paradise is open to all God’s creatures.”

Fueling the meme was the fact that Francis was photographed accepting a gift of two donkeys from a company promoting the use of donkey milk for infants allergic to cow’s milk — and Francis said his own mother gave him donkey milk as a baby.

Social media and other media outlets then picked up the story, further conflating the statements and the chronology. It became a hot mess of a story that was sparking yet another theological debate by a pope who was known for prompting controversy.

The New York Times was the biggest of several outlets relating an apparently apocryphal tale about pets, paradise, and Pope Francis.

The New York Times was the biggest of several outlets relating an apparently apocryphal tale about pets, paradise, and Pope Francis.

Then when The New York Times went with the story, featuring input from ethicists and theologians, the legend became fact. (The Times has since rewritten the story and appended a lengthy correction.)

Television programs discussed the pope’s theological breakthrough, news outlets created photo galleries of popes with cute animals, and others used it as a jumping off point to discuss what other religions think about animals and the afterlife. At America magazine, the Rev. James Martin wrote an essay discussing the theological implications of Francis’ statements and what level of authority they may have. It was all very interesting and illuminating, but based on a misunderstanding.

A number of factors probably contributed to this journalistic train wreck:

  • First, the story had so much going for it: After all, Francis took his papal name from St. Francis of Assisi, the patron saint of environmentalism who famously greeted animals as brothers and sisters.
  • Also, Francis is preparing a major teaching document on the environment, and almost since the day he was elected in 2013 he has stressed the Christian duty to care for creation.
  • Francis also blessed a blind man’s guide dog shortly after he was elected, an affecting image that was often used in connection with these latest reports of his concern for animals.
  • Moreover, the media and the public are so primed for Francis to say novel things and disregard staid customs that the story was too good to check out; it fit with the pattern.

Finally, in most accounts, Francis’ comments were also set against statements by his predecessor, Benedict XVI, who insisted that animals did not have souls. That apparent contrast fit a common narrative pitting the more conservative Benedict against the ostensibly liberal Francis.

That may be true in some areas, but probably not when it comes to animals.

Adding insult to injury, the Times article cited St. John Paul II as saying in 1990 that animals have souls and are “as near to God as men are.” But that, too, was a misquote, as media critic Dawn Eden explained at the website GetReligion.

On the other hand, there should have been warnings signs: Francis has frowned at the modern tendency to favor pets over people, and he has criticized the vast amounts of money spent by wealthy societies on animals even as children go hungry.

In addition, the pope’s huge popularity has led to at least one other instance of myth-making: News reports last year said that Francis was sneaking out of the Vatican at night to feed the homeless around Rome.

The pope personally debunked that rumor in an interview in March, saying the idea “has never crossed my mind” and that “depicting the pope to be a sort of superman, a type of star, seems offensive to me.”

Maybe he’ll have to give another interview to deflate this latest story, and to offer his real thoughts on pets and paradise.


  • Fran

    Ecclesiastes 3:19,20 answers the question about the eventuality of both man and animals:

    “For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them; as one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast; for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again.” (King James version)

    So both man and animals go to the grave after death. However, dead mankind has a hope of resurrection back to life on earth during the millennial rule of God’s kingdom in the near future (John 3:16; 5:28,29; Acts 24:15).

    As to paradise, that is what meek mankind can also look forward to the entire earth becoming, during that rule as well. The animals on earth will also be at peace with one another (Isaiah 11:6-8) 😀

  • Boomer

    So who cares what the pope thinks, all the dogs I’ve ever had exhibit more unconditional love than any human I’ve ever known. When we die we’ll all know about all the BS religion has passed onto us!

  • Doc Anthony

    Be careful–really careful–about believing everything you read in the newspapers, or watch on the TV News, or surf on the News Websites, or the YouTubes or I-Apps.

    These days, journalistic fact-finding is taking a backseat to “creating a narrative” that brings in the eyeballs, brings in the ratings, and most of all brings in the advertising $$$$$$.

    So just because a story appears in the New York Times or CNN News (or even–gasp!–Religion News Service), doesn’t necessarily mean it’s true. Media consumers, beware!

  • Anne m

    I go to Calvery Chapel in Chadds Ford Pa and although I am usually in biblical agreement with my pastor, he has made comments about pets not going to heaven. I can’t understand that thought process when the Book of Revelation clearly states that when Jesus returns he will be riding a white horse! If animals do not have a place in heaven what’s the deal???? Did Jesus get a little winded on the way back here a stop off in some faraway galaxy and hitch a ride with a white horse?!?! I think NOT. Does he need a ride..I don’t think so! Also, all animals are God’s creation and WILL share all of eternity with us.

  • Michael Waters

    Of course dogs and animals have eternal souls. Thus, whatever afterlife is available to humans will be available to our loving dogs, even the ones that chewed our couch up!

    It’s pretentious to pretend you know otherwise.

  • FlyOnDaWa11

    Rev 1:1 And he sent his angel and presented it in ‘signs’ through him to his slave John The key word is signs or symbols. It was a symbolic white horse. Horses represent battle. It meant nothing more.

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  • bumblebee

    What I would like to know is why are there people who would not want animals in Heaven? Why do they seem to find pleasure, exultation, in their belief that God does not find them worthy to inherit eternal life? Do they somehow feel diminished if there are animals in Heaven? I have been a long time believer that yes God welcomes them into His Kingdom. I look forward with great excitement that we shall all dwell in the peace and love of eternal life with God. If we as simple humans can have love for his beautiful creations, can see that they have value, does God’s love not only supersede and is God’s love not the source of our love?

    I think people who cannot/do not believe that God would also include animals in His plans for salvation are lacking in one of God’s most beautiful gifts unconditional love of innocents. And to those who believe that they do not deserve eternal live in Heaven, open your eyes to their plight here on Earth. I cannot believe that God would create such beauty, such life, and have that life consist of only what human hands have meted out against them. For we are a cruel people and God sees their sufferings too. Do they too not deserve to live in the Goodness of the Lord. For why else did He not create them if not because He revels in the beauty of His handiwork.


    Another Deist that had interesting thoughts on death was Benjamin Franklin. One quote of Franklin’s was, “Take courage mortal, death cannot banish you from the universe.”

  • I asked my horse if he had a soul. He said, “Neigh!”.

  • LM

    People have too much time on their hands. Catholics spend too much time defending things about their (our) religion that have nothing to do with being a GOOD person. God wants us to be GOOD people. Share our love with others. Put others first. We care for animals because they are an extension of our love for living things. I look forward to the day I see my animals in heaven. And I look forward to the day I get to confirm that what matters here on earth is not how many tattooes you have or piercings, or how many gay weddings you attended and supported or how many times you said F, but how many times you put yourself last and put others first and you loved all without asking for love in return. I’ll see ya in afterlife….with my damn dog.

  • The man and animals go into the GRAVE but only those who accept Jesus have hope of resurrection. The pope would like to believe all universal muslim catholic hindu, will be saved, even the animals.

    Ps 49:20 “Man that is in honor, and understands not, is like the beasts that perish.”

    The pope as usual is wrong.

  • Christine Gernant


  • I believe that is what he (pope) said.

  • Kathy Stuart

    I have been doing animal rescue work for many years. I personally don’t know or particularly care what any organized religion has to say about the souls of animals. I do know that when you lift up a tortured and abused dog and look into their eyes there is a soul looking back. If any church is not open enough to see and accept that then I believe they are not worth my time, nor anyone else’s.

  • enness

    Actually, we’re called to be saints — not just good, but holy. “Good” cannot become another way of saying “mediocre” or “good enough.” And to this end, it does matter what we believe and profess, because we will tend to act that out whether we realize it or not.

    How do we know what is “good”? If each man is truly on his own in deciding, how can we not be easily mislead?

  • enness

    But you, sir, have absolute certitude. Noted.

  • enness

    You evidently cared enough to read the story (at least the headline) and comment.

    Oh, snap.

  • enness

    Did you even read the story?

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  • HubrisHugh

    Amen to that.

  • marggie


    To the question do animals have souls like human beings?
    First the church does not deny that animals have souls so do plants but they do not have souls like ours. And since the soul is the principle of life and animals and plants are living things they have a soul but not like ours. Our souls (which are spiritual not material) are rational theirs are not
    Animals and plants can’t do anything which transcends the limitations of matter. Although some animals seem clever, they don’t actually possess conceptual intelligence. They can’t, for instance, conceive of the abstract notion of justice. They also lack a moral sense so if scolded for doing something and are told what they did was wrong no guilt is assigned to them since they cannot sin.
    Both animal and vegetable souls are dependent entirely on matter for their operation and being. They cease to exist at death. (There’s no “doggie heaven.”).
    Whether or not there are animals in heaven I guess we will have to wait until we get there to find out.
    Here is what St Theresa of Avila a great saint and doctor of the Church stated that we should be very kind to animals since it is the only heaven they know.

  • Yavor

    All religions are human creations with specific social and psychological functions. It doesn’t mean they are true, although we can’t deny they can in part be true. But from here to enabling men to represent and speak in the name of a supposed God – that is lunacy.

  • Where is the evidence for any of these claims about God or Heaven??

    Popes just make a wish and decide that it came true.
    What childish, irresponsible nonsense.

    Religion is an ongoing assault on humanity, decency and integrity.

    If God exists it is notable that He doesn’t care enough
    to fix religion!

    “Slay them all” (Surah/Q’uran)
    “Execute them” – Jesus
    “Kill the unbelievers in Daylight” – Yahweh (Deut.)


    For Peace, Humanity and The Separation of Church and State

  • Peter

    Gibson is welcome to deny that the Pope said, “Paradise is open to all of God’s creatures”. He can deny it as much as he likes. But the plain fact is: the Pope has neither confirmed nor denied the authenticity of his conversation with a young child. Gibson claims confusion with an earlier Pope and that Francis has had no such conversation, but photographic evidence shows otherwise. You can see a photo of Pope Francis with the boy at

    Until the Pope either confirms or denies the conversation, Gibson is only saying, “I don’t think the Pope had such a conversation”. Does Gibson spend all his time in the personal company of the Pope? Of course not. So let the Pope himself confirm or deny the story.

    I think the reported words were said by Pope Francis, as he loves animals and is keen to bring the Catholic Church into the modern world. It fits his character. Gibson can deny animals eternal life if he wishes, but I have no doubt that they do pass into the afterlife. Opinions will differ. Catholics themselves are divided on the issue.

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  • Red


  • petey

    Thank you enness, I was just about to type that.

  • Hammond Ecks

    When I was growing up there was a Twilight Zone episode about a hunter who dies in an accident along with his beloved “huntin’ hound”. They find themselves at what appears to be St. Peter’s gate but when he tries to enter, the gatekeeper tells the hunter his dog has to stay behind because dogs don’t have souls.

    While they argue, the dog becomes increasingly agitated, snarling and yapping at the gatekeeper. Finally the hunter says, “Well, any Heaven that won’t let my dog in ain’t no Heaven for me!” and starts walking the other way. At that point a bright light appears in front of him; a voice says he’s passed his test for entry to Heaven – and his dog is welcome. He looks back to where he was and sees that the gatekeeper now has a beard and horns, and what was supposedly St. Peter’s gate is really a portal to Hell.

    So if there’s a Heaven and my pets aren’t allowed in, “it ain’t no Heaven for me” either.

  • Jack

    There’s something in the New Testament about preaching the Gospel to “every creature” but that might reflect a translation difficulty. There is no specific promise of pets going to Heaven.

    However, that doesn’t mean they aren’t. CS Lewis speculated that they might. He thought that when it comes to heaven, maybe pets are to believers as believers are to Christ in some way.

    Lewis also thought that before Adam and Eve fell, we could communicate fully with other creatures. Some rabbis in the Talmud believed likewise.

  • Jack

    Franklin was an interesting character. I too think he was mostly a deist, yet he seemed to believe in prayer…..if not in its efficacy, then at least as something good for the person praying.

  • dorothy

    There is no “infallible” teaching from the Roman Catholic Church on the subject of whether non human creatures go to Heaven with us or not. We are not obliged to believe any of the calculated opinions of the Catholic teachers on the subject. No one knows enough about it; the argument that Christ died to redeem us is not really an argument because they didn’t need saving – they did not, and could not go against God’s Will with their own wills, so they will not be judged. To say as a matter of fact that animals do not enter the life to come with us is just as bad as saying they do, because in fact, no one knows for certain, not even the Church and then the “hearers” of these OPINIONS become victims of another’s “freedom of speech”. The subject of whether animals will be resurrected and redeemed has not been taught as dogma or doctrine and therefore anyone’s teaching on it does not have to be believed by anyone else or taken as absolute.

    [18] For I reckon that the sufferings of this time are not worthy to be compared with the glory to come, that shall be revealed in us. [19] For the expectation of the creature waiteth for the revelation of the sons of God. [20] For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him that made it subject, in hope:
    [21] Because the creature also itself shall be delivered from the servitude of corruption, into the liberty of the glory of the children of God. [22] For we know that every creature groaneth and travaileth in pain, even till now. [23] And not only it, but ourselves also, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption of the sons of God, the redemption of our body. [24] For we are saved by hope. But hope that is seen, is not hope. For what a man seeth, why doth he hope for? [25] But if we hope for that which we see not, we wait for it with patience. ROMANS 8:18-25

  • frank

    Why do people listen to what the #1 phedophile in the world has to say unless you are like Michael Jackson and half the priests!

  • Ken Wigginton

    You naysayers exhibit a capacity for pastoral compassion on par with the religionists who pointed their bony fingers at Jesus and His disciples for doing work on the Sabbath.

    Here’s what I have known since I was young: All things are possible through Christ (God’s love, compassion and power is limitless) and God has made it clear that we will be very happy in Heaven. Having figured out that “streets of gold” are just some men’s allusion, I came to understand that Heaven must be quite personalized. MY Heaven is pastoral: A place where all of my relatives are alive and well, along with my pets and all sorts of creatures. There is no one and no thing important, loved or cherished missing there. God would not have it any other way!

    While you imagine YOUR Heaven – I suppose a place where you sit around in the absence of all the rest of God’s creation and smugly pat yourselves on the back for your scriptural piety – you might also contemplate how you will answer Jesus’ question why in particular it was that you were in His Name squashing the Hope of those who have love and concern for their pets.

  • sasonahtalmidah

    “…creation itself will be set free from its bondage to corruption and obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God” (English Standard Version).

  • Ken Wigginton

    Thanks for your post. I know well and have loved this episode of The Twilight Zone, as it strikingly reminds me of my grandfather, who was a coon hunter and raised coon dogs!

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  • “All things are possible through Christ”

    Good grief, what a fatuous claim. There is no evidence that it is true.
    It is just wishful thinking and an assault on our intelligence and integrity.

    This often repeated nonsense about ‘All things being possible’ is a vacuous loophole waved around as if it were some sort of checkmate argument for any pie in the sky wish anybody cares to claim as true!

    If “All things are possible” then we can all be Atheists
    and stop this nonsense and Christ will still bring us up to Heaven (if that is what you want!)

    If “All things are possible with Christ” then all things are possible without Christ too – as Christ would reach out and save those who were without Christ! It is completely incoherent!

    There is no need to follow anything if “All things are possible”! Sin and God and Jesus are completely worthless if “All things are possible”.

    Priests, Imams, Rabbis, Gurus and Pastors are adding to the world’s misery by insisting that this garbage has merit. Religious, empty-headed rhetoric and wishful claims are destroying minds world wide. It must stop.

    Let’s all just think for ourselves, okay?

  • Bill

    Everyone, please read this excellent article if you get enough time to do that. I’m a Thomist, since I usually agree with St. Thomas Aquinas. He thinks animals have mortal souls. But now that I’ve read the article, I would be surprised if I didn’t find our pets in Heaven.

  • Earold D. Gunter

    Doc A, You didn’t include Fox. Freudian slip?

  • Earold D. Gunter

    Anne M, That’s the way young lady l!! Keep thinking, keep questioning. It will ultimately lead to more freedom than you can current fathom.

  • Earold D. Gunter

    enesse, Because all men will act in a manner that they would want other men to act, or they themselves will not survive. It’s that simple. No god needed.

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  • steve oberski

    How about that cat on mine that kept pissing in the plants ?

    Does it qualify ?

    This theology stuff sure is hard.

    Good to know we have valuable internet resources such as yourself on call to help.

  • Bee bee

    Makes you wonder how much of what the main stream media reports is reliable at all.

  • dorothy

    What an absolutely great Roman Catholic article; I loved it and I thank you so much for sharing it with us. I am curious, what in the article made you think that we might see our beloved animals in Heaven?

    Thanks again Bill for the article.

  • Zedman

    So the animal abuser, and child rapist is allowed in heaven but not an innocent animal… Hmm either the church has this wrong, or the so called Christian God ain’t so perfect after all.

  • guest

    Very well spoken. Bravo.

  • Animal Lover 123

    Believe what you want, my pets are part of me and if I am saved so too are they, my eternal happiness would not be complete without them. As I believe and will always believe God created the earth and the animals, therefore he would not forsake them, they are not “saved” in the way a human is but if my essence is in heaven so to will be my pets who have loved me unconditionally for their lifetimes, all is not lost to death.

  • Walter Wenger

    As a Confirmed Roman Catholic (as is the Pope, by the way) the Bible and Church teaching are quite definitive on this point.
    The final creation of God was man, whom He created and then breathed into man life, thus giving man a soul. Everything else was created before He created Adam, and God did NOT breathe into any of His creation, except for man (Adam). His soul. Only mankind has a soul, nothing else in creation has a soul. The soul is what survives physical death. Therefore, only people — human beings — man, having a soul, survive physical death and can be in heaven. To claim that animals — of any kind — or plants, or rocks, or ETs, etc. have souls and therefore can be in heaven is pure blasphemy and will subject the believer to the eternal torments of Hell!
    This is not ME stating this truth, it is the Holy Roman Catholic Church which has stated this as truth; if you disagree, please do not criticize me for speaking the truth, it is the Catholic Church who states this as truth. If you refuse to hold to this as truth, you cannot be a faithful Catholic, and thus, by Catholic Church teaching, you cannot be saved and so you are destined for eternal damnation, once you attain the age of reason, seven years old.
    The nuns and parish priests in the Parochial school I attended were very definitive about this!

  • Doc Anthony

    Didn’t include MSNBC either. But you knew that already.

  • Doc Anthony

    The Gospel According to the Twilight Zone? Well, if it helps you appreciate your pets, go for it.

    But do be careful about trying to give God ultimatums. He loves both humans and animals, but he doesn’t owe either one of ’em any tickets to Heaven.

  • Deoacveritati7

    Well I know that it says in the Bible that Christ will return on a white horse with his saints to destroy the Antichrist.

    So we know that there are horses in Heaven. Well…. at least one!

    For God NOTHING is impossible. if He wants to when when Our Lord returns He can revive all our dead pets since He can do everything, not only that it says in Holy Scripture that He will renew ALL OF CREATION, IN OTHER WORDS EVERYTHING and that everything includes animals!

  • josie

    Try to convince that to Todd Burpo “Heaven is for Real” or Don Piper “90 minutes in Heaven, Heaven is for Real” or any of the thousands of others who have gone to the light, and come back. To say animals don’t have Souls is misguided and wrong. There is no limit to the Love and Forgiveness of a pet, that doesn’t come from an empty shell. Believe what you want, all animals have feelings, spirits, souls and love to give to anyone who will accept it.

  • Michaelee

    The Bible speaks little about animals and afterlife. The purpose of the Bible is to rescue us from damnation. I truly believe that our pets can be by our sides in Heaven or Paradise. I know I miss the pets that I spent part of physical life with. They did nothing wrong to have to die under the curse of physical disease because the Sins of Adam and Eve befell all of mankind.
    I believe that if you can cross into the heavens, that if you want your pets to be part of what you have there, they will be by your side. Of course, we have nobody available that has a report on this to us in the physical realm from the other side. One day, we all will realize the truth when we leave this physical realm. I look forward to holding my pet again.

  • carolyn

    All pets go to heaven – God loved them first.

  • This article makes sense. News outlets seem to be making up things about the Holy Father and nobody (Bishops and priests) are challenging it. Now for my opinion. 🙂 Dogs have souls but are not created in the likeness of God. I’ve had several dogs and hope they are all in ‘dog heaven’. But I have one dog right now that I know will do some purgatory time. 😉 JO

  • Hey Pope..

    What about pet snakes? Aren’t they sort of banned forever? Because…you know…

    Are Bacteria included?
    Being the smallest ‘animal’ they must go to heaven too, right?

    Any heaven that has bacteria, snakes, spiders, centipedes, ticks, mosquitoes and fleas cannot be called heaven.

  • Seriously, did you even read the article… when the topic of the Pope’s talk to the crowd that day, which was centered on the End Times, I don’t believe that the Pope was even thinking about dogs of all things. What I truly believe is that there are bunch of evil people out there hell bent on painting the Pope in a bad light at every turn… every single time the Pope says something, some in the media, even catholic ones have added, subtracted & misquoted and blown the whole thing what the Pope said out of proportion. And then we have the so called other denomination Christians & Catholics alike..accusing, convicting and condemning the Pope of all the vile things under the sun… I wonder which part of ‘slandering & judging’ in the bible don’t these people understand..You will obtain Blessings & graces if you pray for someone.

  • KIM

    BRAVOOOOOO, Marggie!!!!!!

  • Deoacveritati7

    Michaelee December 14, 2014 at 12:25 am
    You say :”They did nothing wrong to have to die under the curse of physical disease because the Sins of Adam and Eve befell all of mankind.”

    May I correct that when Adam fell to Original Sin that sin affected EVERYTHING.
    It affected the whole Universe, it affected man, it affected all of Creation.

    One more thing when we die and we entered into the presence of God (that is if we are saved not only by believing but by also leading a good and virtuous life) we will need nothing more, because just by being in God’s presence we will have instant happiness we will not miss what we had here on earth this is theology not an invention of my mind that means that we will remember our life here on earth but we won’t miss any of it.

    Having said that I believe that for God NOTHING is impossible and I do believe that He knows our pets were important for us and if that is the case even if animals are not in Heaven I believe that He can bring them back to life again if we ask Him.

    By the way I do believe animals can be in Heaven or in the Garden of Eden.

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  • TED

    Earold: Simple observation of the world around you will show that all men do NOT act in a manner that they would want other men to act.

  • TED

    It’s easier to think for yourself if you have an open mind.

  • Waking-To Kindness

    I agree that the scriptures of judaism & islam ,
    & even a bit those of Paul (in Romans 13) ,
    contain violent injunctions to us , &/or contain
    attributions to a {pseudo-} ‘God’ who kills & etc .

    But thankfully, Yeshuah {“Jesus”} apparently
    enjoined upon us to attribute to our idea of ‘God’
    the way of only great love, not of any violence .

    “Execute them” [Luke 19:27] was commanded by
    an _allegorical_ king , whose reign seems to personify
    not a loving ‘God’ but rather all of _fate_ , within which,
    as Yeshuah was perhaps thereby explaining ,
    those who have given their love greatly will eventually
    be blessed with even more love, forgiveness, friends, etc ,
    whereas those who’ve hoarded & not (for)given much
    will eventually lose even what they’d had ,
    & their higher future will be destroyed ,
    by all of _fate_ , not by the great love within it ?

    i’m an atheist myself too ( or a hagio-theist ,
    who still believes in great communions
    of perfected saints together rescuing yet others
    –including former animals — up to the same ) .

    It appears that Yeshuah , tho also actually
    possibly a hagiotheist as well , may’ve been
    trying to get people to re-conceive of
    their ingrained notion of ‘God’ as , not all of fate,
    but rather as just all those who love everywhere ?

    .. together saving as many as possible ,
    within this cruel fate-full (causal) reality in which ,
    as he put it, ” those who live by the sword
    { unless lucky enough to be soon converted to love }
    must eventually die by the sword .” [Matthew 26:52]

    — but this by the all-causality of reality itself (of fate) ,
    not by any ‘God’ who is all who fully love thruout it .

    ( Needless to say, BTW, that, in light of
    all his so-very-pacifist teachings & example
    — except when he lost it briefly vs the vendors —
    very few who think of themselves as “Christian”
    really are so . )

  • Earold D. Gunter

    Doc A, purposeful then?

  • John

    So, you may be just a simple “accident” of nature, but for me, knowing I’m created by a loving God and not just some kind of freak accident is pretty special. Have a good day in your accidental world.

  • Earold D. Gunter

    Ted, Perhaps if we got rid of religion a great part of that would changed. Lets give it a try.

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  • Karla

    Snapping is angry reaction seen by God. Be careful.

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  • Michael Kocian

    Colklink, you misquoted the Pope to say he was “wrong.”

    Since you say he is “wrong” “as usual” according to you, we can fairly conclude that you have misquoted him on these occasions as well.

    Does the eighth commandment mean anything at all to you… just so you don’t misquote God too, the eighth is about not bearing false witness, as you have plainly done…..

  • Michael Kocian

    Max, no he didn’t say animals go to heaven…, and those who think humans are some kind of cosmic accident no better than an animal will probably have a hard time as well… So we urge you to seek the Truth while there is still time.

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  • Michael Kocian

    Why did you have to misinterpret enness to claim he (or she) is wrong? It shows you have an agenda that has no real regard for truth.

  • Michael Kocian

    Misinterpreting God’s word never leads to freedom, but continues the slavery to sin and ignorance.

  • Michael Kocian

    Ed, the problems you note are because mankind’s disobedience to God, not the opposite. The solution to our problems is to follow God, not to reject Him or pretend He doesn’t exist.

  • Karla

    You have why to approach me with also. So why you take sinful approaching? God will judge.

  • eleanor watkins

    I don’t know whether dogs or other animals will go to Heaven or not. But I am sure that a loving Creator God has made provision for them in some way or another. As for babies, baptised or unbaptized, I am sure they will not go to hell. Anyone wanting to find God, forget all the teachings, traditions, doctrines, rules and regulations, Catholic, Protestant or anything else, that go with all ‘religions’. Instead get hold of a New Testament and read about Jesus, who he was, his words and his attitudes to people. I challenge anyone looking for truth to read sincerely and come away unchanged. Jesus is the way, the truth and the life, and he is the one who changes lives from the inside.

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  • Peta

    Pope Francis is a fraud. Will there be animals in heaven? Yes. God’s original creation has been subjected to degradation and decay through sin, but it will be restored as it was in the beginning. The apostle Paul wrote, “For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it in hope; because the creation itself also will be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God” (Romans 8:20, 21, NKJV). Although our sins have destroyed ourselves and nature, God will restore both. Just as animals were part of God’s untainted, original creation, so they will be part of the world and life when He restores everything new—without the corruption of sin and death.
    • Isaiah 11:6, “The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.” (This sounds as if we will have pets in heaven, does it not?)
    • Isaiah 11:7-9, “The cow and the bear shall graze; their young ones shall lie down together; and the lion shall eat straw like the ox. The nursing child shall play by the cobra’s hole, and the weaned child shall put his hand in the viper’s den. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all My holy mountain, for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD as the waters cover the sea”
    • Isaiah 65:25, “The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent’s meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.”

  • S. Keegan

    You commit a fallacy in assuming that those who deny that animals go to heaven do so because they do not wish animals to go to heaven. There is absolutely no basis for such a claim.
    Those who, like myself, believe that animals do not go to heaven hold this belief because we do not believe animals have immortal souls, primarily because the Faith gives us absolutely no reason top think that anything besides humans do. This says absolutely nothing about the relative kindness toward or love for animals on the part of those making these claims.
    For you to say otherwise is both disingenuous and a failure of charity.

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  • Gildersleeve

    Why do atheists haunt religious websites? Could it be atheism is boring and adds no zest to life? Or do fish LIKE having bicycles?

  • @Walking to Kindess,

    “i’m an atheist myself too”

    Atheist = No Belief in Gods
    Your philosophy of ‘communion’ appears to be all made up in your imagination.

    As for, “Execute Them” – Jesus (Luke 19:27)
    It doesn’t matter what was meant by Jesus. What matters is that 100’s of Thousands of people have already been slaughtered because of those words.

    Religion is nonsense because:

    #1. Nobody ever interprets the Bible correctly.
    #2. Those who have interpreted the Bible correctly please see #1
    #3. Those who are certain they have interpreted the Bible correctly see #2

    If a supposedly important book can’t speak at least as clearly as me, it can’t be worth my bother.

  • “Why do atheists haunt religious websites?”

    For the same reason doctors haunt cancer websites.
    To study the disease.

  • guest

    I imagine because maintaining disbelief while faced with ardent faith and worship requires reinforcement by casting scorn on others, lest one begin to question one’s own disbelief.

  • Oregon Bev

    Frankly I don’t much care what the Pope said or didn’t say, I am married to a Catholic and have been for 58 years but I adhere to my Protestant principles and would not wish to inhabit a place where ANY of God’s creatures were to be excluded.

  • @Michael Kocian,

    “One religion is from God, and the doctrines are unassailable, never having been proven wrong.”


    – SAID EVERY childish Santa Clausian.

    What we have here is a willful, pretentious lack of self-awareness.

    Priests and Pastors, make a note of the dire consequences of your “vocation”.

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  • boocatbutterbee

    Well, the difference is Jesus didn’t have the Apostles murder 800 men in a marketplace/ancient mall one day.

    There is no moral equivalency between Judeo-Christian principles and Islam.
    ISIS is the apocalyptic army of the black flag, born of Islam’s culture.

    Saint Malachy told us about this pope.

  • Sting The Bee

    Yeah bee but check out the Inquisitions. Christianity has more blood on its hands than islam, and the bible calls for wiping out whole races.

    Do check out Two Wrongs some time too. Me, I’d bet on neither superstition.

  • guest

    You imagine wrongly.

  • Fran

    We should all be eternal slaves to immortal god. In this way god can provide support slavery. He has asked for this and so in the end he will free us.

  • Pauline

    Wow. You actually admit to being married to a Catholic. Wow. Just wow.

  • The Researcher

    Please read this article it will illuminated the pet questions.
    Do pets go to heaven? Clarifying Christianity
    John 3:16-21,22
    Grace and Peace

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  • If your default position is “God Exists and He is my Lord”
    You are the one with the closed mind.

    Don’t forget it.

  • John,

    You are painting a picture of wish in the air.
    Nothing supports it. Nothing at all.

  • Bill McEnaney

    Hi Dorothy,

    You’re welcome. Mr. Siscoe didn’t convince me that we would see our pets in Heaven. Still, to me, it’s pretty clear that it or part of it needs to be physical, because human bodies occupy space. Siscoe believes that, in the physical Heaven, we’ll see trees, building, animals, and plants in it, too. So I thought, “Hmm, if he’s right, why would God keep our pets out when other animals would got in?”

    Since people have free will, they can deserve blame for their sins, die impenitently, and be damned. But since animals don’t have free will and can’t know right from wrong, they’re not moral agents. Can you imagine how silly it would be to send your dog to prison for, say, “stealing” the food from your stove the way my late dog Ginger “stole” ours when I was a boy?

    Sometimes I worry about some people who seem to forget the huge difference between people and animals. Two chimp experts raised Nim Chimpsky as though he was human. Naturally, he was a sweet, loving baby. Tragically, after he grew up, he ran to his human “mom,” plunged his fangs into her cheek, and then signed, “I’m sorry, I’m sorry.”

    After that he lived in a cage at a zoo, I think, where she visited him. Did he greet her warmly? No, he reached instinctively and violently for her face. From then on, she knew that it was a bad idea to raise him as her “son.” Despite the awful harm he did, he still didn’t blame. His instincts controlled him, and he acted like what he was, a chimp.

    This isn’t the article I had hoped to post, but it’s a goo one.

  • Bill McEnaney

    Oops. I forgot to post a link to the article. Here it is.

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  • Catolicforlife

    This is what Billy Graham said on the subject.

    God will prepare everything for our perfect happiness in heaven, and if it takes my dog being there, I believe he’ll be there.

    Billy Graham

    Heaven is paradise!

  • Catolicforlife

    Actually religion is made by God so that man would know God better and make it to heaven.

    Matthew 16:18 And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it

    The Church Jesus speaks of is the Catholic Church, the pillar and Bulwark of the truth! The Church who’s work it was to bring the bible to fruition so it would be shared with the world.

  • Catholicforlife

    So have you ever been to heaven??

  • Catholicforlife

    Actually, do you know if there is or isn’t a heaven to speak on the matter? Because if you did you wouldn’t be atheist.

  • Catholicforlife

    Those who think knowing Jesus is about them and them alone…. The “I, I, I’s of the world’, are confused. The body of Christ, the bride, will be known when we meet our savior on the last day, the Judgement day, when there will be a ‘resurrection of the body of Christ’.

    Read about the wedding banquet and this which follows.

    Matthew 22:29 But Jesus answered them, “You are wrong, because you know neither the scriptures nor the power of God. 30 For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels[a] in heaven. 31 And as for the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was said to you by God, 32 ‘I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? He is not God of the dead, but of the living.” 33 And when the crowd heard it, they were astonished at his teaching.

    Read the scriptures folks.. We’ve been dining on the feast, the unending banquet for 2 millennium when others either reject it or aren’t worthy of it.

  • Catholicforlife

    Kudo’s for you. There are many animals spoken of who will be in heaven. The Lion shall lay down with the Lamb. Now these may be representative of Judah and Jesus, but I suspect God loves His animals especially as He spoke of them so much in scripture. No one really knows exactly what we will see in heaven or what the face of God will look like. I suspect it will blow us away!

  • Bob

    Actually, Catholicforlife, your whole Jesus-sacrifice-salvation story is a steaming pile of nonsense, and your religion is obviously entirely man-made. How is it again that your omnipotent being couldn’t do his saving bit without the whole silly Jesus hoopla? And how was Jesus’ death a “sacrifice”, when an omnipotent being could just pop up a replacement son any time with less than a snap of his fingers? Pretty pathetic “god” that you’ve made for yourself there.

    Ask the questions. Break the chains. Join the movement.
    Be free of Christianity and other superstitions.

  • The comments would be hilarious if it weren’t for the fact the survival of humanity depends on the collective mental capacity of all humans.

  • Tim Huegerich


    Sorry, but there is no such “photographic evidence.” That’s a stock photo that dates at least back to July. The same exact photo appears here:

  • Barry

    Cathoholicforwife, you might want to try to learn more about what the term “atheist” means.

    Me, I’m wondering why your oh-so-powerful, supposedly wonderfully kind, “god” has to put us through thousands of years of anxious waiting before “saving” us from a life that he supposedly created. Personally, I think your religious beliefs are just plain ridiculous, and that the claims of your religion are false. No reason to believe in them.

    Good morning, and here’s to a less religious day for you.

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  • The Responder

    You’ve never done real research in your life, and your post is spammy junk.

  • Dain

    Just don’t forget to sacrifice an animal every day or your nice god will smite you hard and burn your ass in hell forever after.

  • Jim

    Actually, in Genesis there are two opposing stories of the order of creation. One says that animals were created before man. The other says that man was created first. Check it out.

  • AJ

    Atheist Max and all the atheists posting on this site……bravo for standing your ground and not claiming to be Agnostic.

    You will never experience the true Peace Christ can bring to your life unless you invite him in. He works miracles for those who follow his rules. Take some quiet time invite him in and meditate on it. I guarantee you will leave a changed person……..

  • AJ,

    “You will never experience the true Peace Christ can bring to your life unless you invite him in.”

    Thanks – I sincerely hope you are correct.

    My Peace is much better than Christ’s.
    My Peace doesn’t torture. My Peace doesn’t insult people for their birth as the racist Christ does; “They are dogs!” – JESUS (Matthew 15:26)

    My Peace does not offer blood sacrifices or condemnations.
    My Peace does not ignore the children being shot at in Sandy Hook Elementary School.

    My morality and kindness is vastly superior to Jesus in that way.
    I tolerate everyone – much more than Christ ever does.
    I am vastly superior to Christ.

    I would never say these things:

    “Bring to me those enemies of mine and execute them in front of me.” – JESUS (Luke 19:27)

    “Hate your parents…hate your life” – Jesus (Luke 14:26)

    “I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his daughter, and a daughter against her mother, AND A DAUGHTER-IN-LAW AGAINST HER MOTHER-IN-LAW; and A MAN’S ENEMIES WILL BE THE MEMBERS OF HIS HOUSEHOLD.” – JESUS (Matthew 10:35)

    Your Christ is offering me
    a disgusting experience
    much worse than the very moral, kind and loving life I have as an Atheist.

    Your Jesus offers me a cruel and vicious alternative to the wonderful loving life I already have.

    Instead, allow me to offer you the Peace of Atheism. It is vastly superior to garbage coming from religion.

    For Peace, Civility and The Separation of Church and State

  • Larry

    For all those Protestants expecting to be taken up in the Rapture:

    1. You will probably be disappointed because life is funny that way. You are never as pious as you thought you were, and God can be a capricious kinda guy.

    2. Just in case, there is special After Rapture Pet Care
    -Hundreds of atheists and members of non-Rapture worthy sects and faiths are standing by to rescue your pets in the event of impending Biblical Armageddon.

  • Stuba

    Like an omnipotent guy really cares whether we peons are disobedient to him or not. Like, ummmmmmm, NOT. Maybe if he was so worried he would have made better peons.

    Your religion is tres STUPIDO!

  • Stuba


  • Larry

    That is perhaps the only thing you have ever said which shows even a glimmer of a sense of humor. Albeit a rather nasty-minded malicious one. 🙂

  • Fred

    Have you? And what do you think of the price of oil?

  • Bren

    S. Keegan, You do not believe that animals have souls? I and many others have experienced pets returning after death. Lots of people don’t say anything for fear of looking ridiculous to others. We are those that are gifted and known as “sensitives.” We see, hear and feel things that most people cannot. I don’t always enjoy having this gift but I have it and there’s nothing I can do about it. I will assure you that animals do have souls. Think about that next time you put a piece of an animal corpse in your mouth. I pity those that believe the silliness in the bible with no proof of any of it, yet when there is proof of other things – reincarnation, spirits, etc, it is ignored by religious people. There is more to the universe than this life here, and only some of us are privvy to get a glimpse of it. Peace.

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  • Jake

    I’m not sure what’s worse. The fact that you’ve banned animals from your imaginary palace, or the idea you’ve fabricated that the ones who believe in science are the ones in trouble.

    “I more willing to believe in the vague, loosely translated scriptures by random people hundreds of years after the supposed Christ, more than what can be scientifically calculated with pretty accurate numbers, which are capable of being replicated.” If anything, you’re the one in trouble. Lose one more IQ point, and you’ll be on par with the animals [Oh, I guess that means no heaven access for you]

  • Bren

    Marggie, I am sorry but you are completely wrong here with your definite . animals “cease to exist after death.” How would you know that? As I told someone in a prior post, I am what is known as a sensitive, sensitive to things others cannot see. I know that animals have souls as I have experienced seeing/hearing/sensing them. I believe that they are in a cycle of reincarnation as we are. Chrisitianity and other religions are for simpletons. The universe is vast and there is no way any of us can comprehend what is going on, what happens after death, etc. An arrogant human being, feeling superior to other animals, possesses a young foolish soul.

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  • Annalyn

    Thank You Micheal! Well said.

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  • john garratt

    If animals don’t go heaven it’s a very dull place id rather not go and they are innocent compared to they deserve a place more than man .

  • john garratt

    You fall for your heaven why not pets your no better than a dog or cat

  • Catholicforlife

    Okay so you folks are calling out the Pope because you think you know what we’ll see in heaven yet you’ve never been there. So whether the pope said dogs go to heaven or not, we don’t know.

    The price of oil is an earthly matter not a heavenly matter so it is irrelevant to this conversation.

  • Kimpokemon

    Heaven is a place on earth.

  • John

    Something as simple as the existence of good and evil supports it. The sensitivity and balance of nature supports it. The fact that mankind is the only creatures with the ability to be co-creators supports it. The fact that I can create something tells me I am made in God’s image, it He who has created us and all of nature, otherwise man would be unable to create (invent) anything, just like all the other creatures are not creators. Only mankind is made in the image of God. Besides all this, there is plenty of other evidence, if one is open enough to even look. There is no way I can believe humanity is an accident, nor is the rest of such a find tuned nature accidental. If you have a better explanation of the perfection of man and nature, I need to hear it.

  • Maeve

    “The price of oil is an earthly matter not a heavenly matter so it is irrelevant to this conversation.”

    Congratulatons, Catholic, for ALMOST getting Fred’s joke.

    Your religion is a joke too, and with nothing heavenly about it.

  • Mavis

    Most dogs belong in heaven, but as Tolkein said, cats are the creatures of Sauron.

  • Fran

    We are so small and so just to be pets as servants to Almighty God. I have seven cats at least thank you to God.

  • John,

    Certainly if you are so sure of God you must be able to tell me which God is the correct one.

    Allah? Vishnu? Jesus? Yahweh? Aphrodite?

    Which one is the true God?

    And upon deciding which God is the real god
    I need to know why it matters so much that some in your group
    are willing to kill over your decision.

    The burden is not on me for this information. It is on those who make these claims – it is on you.

    Which is the true god? And how did you determine something that billions of other people have been unable to determine?

    If you cannot answer those questions, you cannot claim “you know” – you have nothing.

  • Waking-To Kindness

    i must in part agree w “Atheist Max” (“A.M.”) ,
    despite his {\her?} gross mis•taking of quotes
    ( of Theravadin Buddhism, to be corrected later ) ,

    & most grossly of those of e.g. Yehshuah [“Jesus”] :

    1: re his “.. execute them!” [Lk 19:27] :
    plz see my above comment explaining this .

    2: re ” Haven’t you heard? that it is not right to throw
    the children’s food to the dogs?” [Mt 15:26 \ Mk 7:27] :

    Here, Yehshuah shows deep compassion, subtle humor,
    & great perceptiveness, in seeing & deciding that

    this Syrian(Phoenician) woman who’d come so far
    to ask for his help to save her dying daughter ,
    & who had surely been enduring being treated ,
    during this foray from her own region to find him ,
    as a second- or even third- class citizen

    ( due to the prevailing deep prejudice{fear} which
    most Judeans there, incl’g Edomites _&_ Galileans,
    still held vs these formerly• murderously•ruling
    neighboring Phoenicians ) ,

    [he saw that she] had sufficient chutzpah & wit
    to realize clearly that his gentle tease in the form of
    yet another extreme ethnic slur upon all Syrians ,
    would be his way of instantly commiserating with her
    in her state of great panic & extreme risk-taking
    in hopes for his saving her daughter’s life
    ( this crisis being surely the only thing strong enough
    to bring her out into Judea or Galilee ) .

    ( & she _did_ have sufficient wit & humor , instantly
    retorting, “Lord, even the dogs under the table
    eat the children’s crumbs.” )

    ( … &, sure enough, her daughter was cured ! )


    A.M.’s other mis•interpretations of Yehshuah
    will be addressed here ASAP .

    Meanwhile ..

    As for the more•general issue of
    the impossibility of a ‘God’ ,
    again (as previously) , this is because

    since there’s _always_ something \
    someone \ some group that’s even
    bigger \ smaller , earlier \ later ,
    smarter , dumber , nicer \ meaner ,
    more-helpful \ less-helpful , …\…\..\.\\\\\
    … ,

    this means that
    no individual or group could be
    the _most_ or the _least_ ,
    in any attribute whatsoever .

    So, despite A.M.’s misquotings ,
    if one thinks deeply re what he\she said ,
    in another comment below , re the problem w/
    ” All things are possible with [my own deity] ” ,
    one might realize the irrationality of belief in
    “perfect\total Providence” in any religion ,
    from bloody cargo cults, to mayans sometimes daily
    sacrificing thousands of innocent young girls ,
    to the catholics exterminating
    a million Pacifist Christians
    ( most of them Cathars ) in the 13C alone , then
    killing 70,000 Huguenots (almost all pacifists)
    in the 16&17C ,
    etc etc etc .


    Once one allows the obviousness of
    _limited_ love, intelligence, & collaboration,
    here & there thruout our infinite universe of
    perhaps big bangs like tiny bubbles comprising
    the foam•flecks on the wave•tips upon vast oceans
    of systems of systems of astronomical systems ,

    then, ..

    well, at least there’s that :
    _limited_ love, intelligence, collaboration, etc .

    Compared however to these much•vaster oceans of
    us ego•blinded deluded beings heading straight for
    only yet more of our perhaps•endless suffering ,
    these rare ‘rafts’ of collaborative communions of
    more•awakened saints could only be adding
    a comparative few beings to their happy little
    heavenly cities .

    Still, .. ‘A few’ is better than ‘none’ ; &,
    since the universe is actually not a
    closed system , then, who’s to say that
    these blessed & rare communions
    of those who’ve let their ego die
    & have been brought into ever more joy
    of perhaps•never•ending togetherness
    might not grow & grow ,
    never•endlingly ?

    BTW, this belief , that, therefore,
    the highest conscious powers can only be
    whatever best collaborative communions of
    whatever most•enlightened saints\buddhas
    ( such communion(s) traditionally termed in
    Christian theology as “the Mystical Body” ) ,
    this belief might be better•named as, say,
    [ saint•community {as} deity ] .

    { OK, so now i’m a ‘hagiokoinotheist’ ?
    Hmm .. Oh, well. }

    RSVP plz, here ; or, to collaborate, to this addr. :
    RememberKindness at Hot mail dot com ;
    or, to the ph# USA 206.971.9001 .

    For us all … /\

  • Agnikan->”I asked my horse if he had a soul. He said, “Neigh!”.”

    Buahahaha best comment in the whole thread!!!

    “Viva Cristo Rey!!”

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  • Waking-To Kindness

    Mainly to reply to “John”‘s Dec. 16 AM remarks :


    As we ever•so•slowly untie each other from
    our various rotting rafts of delusive religions ,
    let’s take care not to let anyone drown
    in the ocean of cold truth we all float on .

    So, let’s always encourage anyone
    who doesn’t see a better raft yet ,
    or who isn’t a good swimmer yet ,
    to stay tied upon their rotting delusions
    until they do see one ,
    or at least until they learn to swim better .

    ( — Otherwise, if they did fall in ,
    they’d be likely to call to be pulled up onto
    another one that’s just as bad , or worse ! )

    & so, anyone feeling this dialogue\polylogue to be
    too much for them, do feel free to stop listening .


    Now, who’s ready to splash around just a bit more
    in this bottomless shoreless ocean of truth ?
    Here we go ..

    — Splash —

    First, re the necessary “accidentality” of things ,
    no matter _what’s_ true :

    Even if there _were_ a ‘creator of All’
    ( which above i’ve shown as impossible ) ,
    being “beginningless”,
    it couldn’t’ve created itself .

    & thus, for (a) it to have happened ,
    vs for (b) the universe itself to have
    always been going on instead ,
    ( for things to have happened
    one of those two ways & not the other )
    would be, as they say, “accidental” .

    I.e., even if there _were_ a ‘creator of All’ ,
    the fact that things turned out that way ,
    rather than the universe itself having been
    going on without a beginning (or end)
    would be “just the way things turned out” ,
    equally for either way .

    I.e., in “Michael Kocian”‘s terminology ,
    for humans to have happened in a
    beginningless universe ,
    vs for a ‘God’ to have always existed ,
    either way is _equally_ ..
    .. just a “cosmic accident” .

    So much for _that_ false discrimination
    ( that one way is more “accidental” than
    the other ) .

    { Let’s dive a bit deeper : }


    ‘Good\evil’, tho v. helpful indeed, is just
    our concept•set re what helps\hurts us .
    Anyone who’s been around higher animals a lot
    knows they each have some rudimentary version
    or other , of this set, as well .
    ( — including judgement, too, of course . )

    &, in fact, some animals are highly creative ;
    one chimp, last i heard, was painting
    ( in completely•abstract style ) daily .
    [Source(s) pending.]

    & many species do make unique tools out of
    sticks, mud, or whatever is available,
    in order to sometimes do unique things
    in -occasionally- very unique ways .
    [Sources pending.]

    Primates, dolphins, & even a few birds
    have been known to speak
    _original_ phrases , for years now .
    [Sources pending.]

    & what if intelligent ETs are proven ? ( After all,
    w/ billions of planets in just this one galaxy ,
    & billions of galaxies in just this one branch , .. . )
    Aliens aren’t human, yet the ones visiting us
    will be (or have been*) surely more inventive than us .
    [*: Sources pending.]

    ( & we all know what _this_ pope says re them .. _finally_ ! )

    ( & let’s just hope they’re also far more _tolerant_ ,
    BTW, than, on•avg, _we_ are ! )


    So much for “Humans are the only creatures
    who are (“co-“)creative” !


    As for the universe being so finely &
    sensitively yet dynamically _balanced_ ,
    that _appears_ to us as very true ,
    around where _we’ve_ arisen ,
    & relative to _our_ scale .

    On the level of subatomic particles ,
    or inside any star, however, everything’s
    boiling.. furiously, chaotically, constantly .
    It’s just that most of this boiling gets balanced out
    by the time it gets to the level of _our_ experiencing .

    This is just another version of the fallacy of
    anthropo•centrism : It only _seems_ that
    “the universe is centered around us &
    adjusted perfectly to us” :
    only because this is one of the v. few places in it
    where our kind could arise from everything !

    Well, more splashing around L8r,
    esp. if you want to keep on going w/ me ,
    exploring the endless Ocean of Truth together !

    RSVP to RememberKindness at Hot mail .com ,
    or to ph# (USA) 206.971.9001 .

  • Jack

    That’s cosmic, Bren. Cosmic. Totally purple too. Can you like feel the vibrations that I feel?

  • Ana Marshall

    I used to be Catholic. Three things drove me away from the Church: Its attitude towards birth control, its condemnation of homosexuals, its belief that animals have no soul. This Pope has made me think of going back because he is, finally, giving the Catholic Church a good name. But, if the Catholic Church does not think animals go to Heaven, then it obviously does not believe I will go to Heaven either, because to me a place without our pets is not Heaven.

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  • Tess328

    It’s amazing to me how many sinful humans believe that Heaven is theirs alone, and want to exclude innocent animals. When you think about it, it’s a very hateful way of thinking. Animals suffer tremendously at the hands of humans in this world. To think that there is a God, and He would keep innocent beings that He created out of Heaven, while allowing sinful human beings in is ludicrous. To anyone who has love in their heart, Heaven would not be Paradise without animals, especially the ones we had as pets while we were here on Earth.

    Humans that think that animals should be excluded from enjoying Paradise after having horrific existences here on Earth at the hands of humans, are displaying the same sinful attitudes of selfishness, self centeredness, and hatred that make them the sinners that they are.

  • Tess328

    You wish.

  • James Johnson

    Did you ever stop to think that you’re the disease???

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  • Audrey A

    CS Lewis answered this question. Nothing we want in heaven can ever be wrong. Therefore, if we want to be reunited with our pets when we are in Paradise, then our pets will be there. But I also urge Christians who love their pets to distraction to spend at least as much on the poor as you do on your pet.

  • Michelle

    Seriously!!! I was a catholic for 21 years. If any “religion” is man made it is Catholicism. If the Bible is God’s WORD, which I believe it is, and your faith is in that WORD then you are following the truth. If you follow a list of rules that was made by man that is religion. The TRUTH shall set you free!

  • jude

    of coarse animals go to heaven. .. Jesus come back on the back of a horse. hope he gets here soon

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  • Shan2632

    Just another false belief designed to tickle the ears of the mass of people. I love my dog for Pete’s sake but a bunch of animal fanatics will eat your head off. I’ve read the Bible too. It says nothing about animals going to heaven. And if you want to believe in blind faith that is up to you. True faith is based on some evidence. Blind faith is believing without having any real evidence to support your beliefs.


    To AtheistMax: Why are you on this religious website? How does our belief in God threaten, impair, reduce or annihilate your disbelief in God?
    The two appropriate reasons for debate are to inform someone of that which he does not know or to persuade him to believe as you do. Are you trying to “convert” us, LOL? You won’t. All you do is provoke pity or disgust or both.
    If I were an atheist I wouldn’t waste my time on a website for believers because I wouldn’t care what they think or don’t think. To all appearances you are on this site to insult, to mock, to disrespect, and to hate. It would be more beneficial for yourself as well as for mankind were you to spend your time volunteering at an animal shelter or a soup kitchen or in some other kind endeavor instead of vomiting hate at those who believe in God. If you answer that you do these things, I disbelieve it because if you did you wouldn’t harbor so much corrosive hate in your heart. (Notice I didn’t say “soul”, LOL.)

  • Steve

    We always told our children that when they got to Heaven and they then wanted their pets they will have them for their joy will be full. But a grandchild of one of my friends put it better than anyoneI have heard. He asked “If there are no animals in Heaven, where does Jesus get that big white horse?” Cute, of course, but does make you think!

  • Steve

    Very good advice. While it hurts me (and I’m sure many others) to see all these pleas for funding for hurting animals, one does need to get priorities in order. So many people hurting; so many opportunities to show love and compassion.

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  • Christine Empie

    How do you know that animals don’t have souls, that they don’t go to heaven? How is the Pope wrong? There are more quotes in the bible that insinuate they do. Have you ever bonded with an animal or even took a moment to look into ones eyes? You seem very closed minded and angry.

  • corey

    im not jewish

  • corey

    yes I am

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