• Frank

    So when you look at the data, even if it’s skewed and not scientific, basically men who have SSA who marry a women get divorced at the same rate as any other marriage.

    Stay faithful to Gods will that all homosexual behavior is sinful and is incompatible with God. Celibacy or a heterosexual marriage with someone who knows and accepts that you have SSA is the only way to stay faithful to God.

  • Larry

    Unless you have another study to the contrast, it is just lying for the Lord.

    Actually Lying Frank, the study most relied upon is the one Conservative Christians paid for. The one they touted in order to pretend that children raised by gay parents are somehow unfit.

    It turned out that the study had nothing to do with gay couples raising children and everything to do with “Mixed Orientation Marriages”. (The Regenerus Study). The study found children and parents in such marriages faced high levels of distress and had high incidence of divorce. Something about all that underlying dishonesty, social pressure and tension coming to a boil. Asking people to keep up pretenses in public and lying about what they really were.
    A major flaw with the Regenerus study was misrepresenting in public (and to Congress and the Supreme Court) that it had to do with gay couples raising children.
    [Regenerus did nothing to correct those people misusing his study either]

    Then again its not like conservative Christians have much use for scientific research unless it gives them the answers they wanted. These are the same people who demand that their mythology supplant over a century of scientific research in public education.

    Frank, are you aware that telling lies makes little baby Jesus cry? 🙂

  • SSA? I don’t know what men who have supersonic aircraft has to do with anything marriage-related.

  • Daniel Berry, NYC

    I see Frank here quite a lot. Like several other regulars, he always seem to be highly invested in the articles dealing with topics related to homosexuality.

    Kinda’ makes you wonder, don’t it?

  • Frank

    Poor Larry still clueless. So very sad.

  • benofoakland@gmail.com

    “So when you look at the data, even if it’s skewed and not scientific, basically men who have SSA who marry a women get divorced at the same rate as any other marriage. ”

    So where did you see that? I went to their website and looked at the original report. It said something quite different. the summary here says something quite different

  • benofoakland@gmail.com

    I posted this elsewhere. I don’t really have time right now to elaborate.

    THREE VERY important points here.

    A study came out today of mixed orientation marriages among Mormons. It’s not a perfect study by any means, given the difficulty of finding randomly distributed subjects. (By comparison to the regenerus study, which also had a difficult time finding subjects, so they decided to study something else and pretend they were studying what they claimed to study). But the study basically shows that while first marriages in the heterosexual world end about 25% of the time in divorce, in the mixed-orientation world, the figure is about 70%. Even cutting it down by half to allow for the non-random nature of the study, that’s still 10% more. And of course, that 50% is just pulled out of nowhere. This does not speak well for the chances of success of these marriages. Thus, rather than contributing to a “marriage culture”, and all of the bullbleep touted by the Mormon church in its prop.8 attack on gay people, mixed -orientation marriages contribute to the overall decline of marriage.

    Ironic, ain’t it?

    A nod to larry. Speaking of Regnerus, his much touted study, paid for in full by the anti-ex-gay industry, was intended to show that gay people make bad parents. Of course, they didn’t study gay parents, they studied gay people in mixed orientation marriages. (Regnerus claimed he couldn’t find any children raised by same sex couples, so he just went for the jugular instead.) For once, I’m going to agree that this Regnerus study IS JUST THE VERY BEST STUDY EVER– and it shows that these mixed orientation marriages are harmful to children. It’s a really good reason to ban them, and should be used in Court. But actually, they didn’t even study THAT. They studied families wherein one of the parents had EVER had a same sex experience, according to the memories of their children.


    and then there is this little problem. Jesus: “If a man looks at a woman with lust, he has committed adultery with her in his heart.” Letting my own personal opinions about what the bible says determine what it actually says is a favorite conservative Christian past-time. So these men and their wives– the ones featured in the TLC white-washing the istuaiton, by together cruising other men neither are married to, are committing adultery EACH AND EVERY TIME. They not only seem to not be repenting of their evil sins, they are reveling in their evil sins, think its a good idea, and are publicizing it. AND NO CONSERVATIVE CHRISTIAN, QUICK AND READY TO ATTACK GAY PEOPLE FOR THE ISN OF EXISTING, even think any of this is worth commenting on.


    But not a surprise, because when it comes to gay people, hypocrisy from conservative Christians is pretty much the only dish served up at the banquet.

  • Daniel Berry, NYC

    Ben, when I was an undergrad back in the 70s, we used to say even then that the louder they scream the louder they scream.

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  • Frank does not choose the topics.

    Some of us are of an age where we can recall when homosexuality took up very little space in the papers. If you do not want our commentary, write about something else. The editors might also show some critical distance from their portfolio of mascot groups, but that’s evidently too mentally taxing.

  • Dan Savage, quiet as a mouse.

  • Ken

    The study proves that debauchery and lasciviousness and same sex attraction are almost impossible to separate. Seriously, does anyone really believe that these “same-sex attracted” men are desiring to find the love of their life with just one guy? Got a bridge in the Bronx to sell you if you do. Two things these women should leave, Mormonism and cruisers. It’s hard to find a Mormon wife that wants to watch her husband have sex in front of a crowd in a bath house.

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  • Daniel Berry NYC

    No, certainly Frank does not choose the topics covered on this blog. But his choice to focus much of his attention on entries dealing with gay-related topics is difficult not to notice after only a short time. I’ll say it again: the louder they scream the louder they scream. Reminds of that christian preacher in Florida–George Rekers, I think? Or how about the one with the rent-boy and the crystal meth? It’s a patter, bro: the more focused on running down gay people a person is the more likely it is that they’re hiding something – only not very effectively.

  • Daniel Berry NYC

    can’t say I’ve noticed Savage to be quiet. And on this particular topic, he roars.

  • Daniel Berry NYC

    Proves? Do you know anything about academic research? Sounds like you know something about the dated prejudices you entertain, but not much else. Your diatribe on gay men is of a type with the kind of things I used to hear said about Black people when I was growing up in North Carolina in the 1950s and ”60s; i.e., they’re all lazy, they all smell bad, they all have venereal disease, they’re all shiftless, they all steal and on and on and on. Thank god that’s finally on the dustbin of history. You’re next.

  • Frank

    You are welcome to chase wild geese all you want. Have fun. It’s both funny and pitiful and changes nothing.

  • ben in oakland

    They are very easy to separate, except for people who use words like debauchery, lasciviousness, and same sex attraction.

  • Daniel Berry NYC

    Bathhouses? Bro you are SO retro. Bathhouses! Jeezus.

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  • CJ

    You guys DO have to admit that the commenters here seem to be one super dysfunctional ‘family’. I’ve been reading this site for almost a year now and it’s always the same: you got Frank and Ken representing our clueless dogmatic fundie bunch, and then there’s Ben and Larry representing the progressive Biblically-literate thinkers. Should I suggest you guys all get your own show? How about ‘Point/Pointed Head’? LOL

    Seriously Frank, you are SUCH a douche and Ken you are such the predictive enabler. C’mon, no one here takes you guys seriously. I truly give Ben and Larry kudos for the amazing patience to spar with you two, I think I’d lose my mind if I bothered. The fact is you guys are clearly closet cases and you desperately need to see scripture from the perspective of condemning gays to justify your hate (self-hate, perhaps?). Meanwhile, the rest of the Church is starting to pull their heads out and waking up to realize the way scripture has been distorted and misapplied toward the LGBT community. I’m sure you’d call that Satanic, but I say clearly it’s the Holy Spirit doing this.

    Look, no one is ever going to convince you otherwise. And you certainly aren’t going to convince Ben, Larry, or any of us that your distortion is truth. Like with me, it’ll take a life-changing event that will force you to think – a child coming out, a close friend coming out, perhaps even YOU coming out (hint hint) – that maybe your prideful thinking will finally be shaken.

    How about this. If you guys insist on taking the moral “high ground” here, I have a better idea. Instead of taking the time to blather on RNS, just imagine how amazing it would be if instead you guys actually spent the time feeding the poor, visiting those in prison, caring for the sick, taking care of “widows and orphans”…well you get the picture. You know. The things that Jesus wants us to do. Pretty groundbreaking idea, huh?

    Until then, your fingers are a-typin’, but all we really see is blah blah BLAH. 😉

  • ben in oakland

    Thanks, CJ.

    I don’t actually spar with Frank. He has only one song to sing, “It’s agin’ the bible, and GAWD agrees with me.” It’s a waste of time until someone he loves can get through his moralizing and his profound contempt for people he despises for no other reason than this: HE DOES.

    I’ve responded a few times to Ken, but he is, like Frank and several other posters, obsessed with alleged sexual sin, cultural purity (whatever that is), and homosexuality. His contempt for those whose existence offends him so deeply drips off of him like sweat off a porn actor on a hot set.

    There are a few others. You’ll soon meet them.

    This is the conclusion I reached long ago: we are NEVER going to reach those who are irretrievably poisoned by hate, fear, ignorance, stupidity, religious belief, mental illness, bad parenting, prejudice, a traumatizing event, lust for power and money at the expense of other people, self hatred, paranoia, or right wing ideology.

    That’s the very definition of “irretrievably.” I’ll occasionally bother to respond for my own amusement or edification, but not because I ever expect them to get it, much less to change.

    Nothing short of a rhetorical 2×4 upside the head will ever get to them.

  • Frank

    Says the guy who refuses to see the truth.

    You can’t change the truth that all homosexual behavior, sexually and romantic, is a sin and nothing will ever change that. You just chose to create your own truth and live by it. Sad.

  • Really the only thing to say here is, “duh.” Marriage is about love. You fall in love and you spend the rest of your life growing that love, finding new ways to fall in love. Marriages that are not based on love do not work. Roommates can come and go. Lovers, like it or not, can come and go. Marriage isn’t just about sex or sharing living quarters, yet both are a large part of the relationship. Missing either diminishes the chances of finding new ways to fall in love.