March 17, 2015

Mormons free to back gay marriage on social media, LDS apostle says

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Elder L. Tom Perry of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles greets legislators and fellow supporters of Utah Bill 296 which balances religious freedoms and LGBT rights. Photo courtesy of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints

Elder L. Tom Perry of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles greets legislators and fellow supporters of Utah Bill 296 which balances religious freedoms and LGBT rights. Photo courtesy of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints

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Backing marriage equality on social media sites, including on Facebook or Twitter, "is not an organized effort to attack our effort, or our functioning as a church.," Elder D. Todd Christofferson said in the interview.

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  • Garson Abuita

    Did any apostles prior to 1978 say unequivocally that the ban on blacks in the priesthood would never be lifted?

  • boarderthom

    The funny thing about sodomy; plenty of heterosexuals practice it and plenty of gays do not.

  • Dan the Mormon

    I’m not sure, but I have seen quotes from apostles dated before 1978 indicating that it would be lifted.

    I imagine you could probably find a quote from an apostle that would suggest that it wouldn’t be lifted. You could find quite a bit support for all sorts of controversial ideas from past apostles. Apostles aren’t perfect and many have spouted opinion as doctrine in the past, especially if they aren’t talking at general conference.

  • Dan the Mormon

    Mormonism still teaches homosexual behavior to be a sin and probably always will. All this article shows is that the LDS Church won’t formally discipline members who disagree with the Church on this particular issue.

    These quotes don’t rule out the LDS Church disciplining individuals who deliberately and persistently trying to convince other Mormons to support same-sex marriage.

  • Doc Anthony

    “Could there be a time when the LDS Church would change its position on gay marriage?”

    Yes. This article makes it clear that it’s happening already. Nice and slow, the frog in the kettle.

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  • I have as much authority to speak the word of a god as an LDS “Apostle” does.
    If one can’t show a God actually gave one the authority, one does not have any more authority than anyone else.

    I grant all Mormon’s the right to do whatever they think best.

  • Mark

    “Negroes IN THIS LIFE are denied the priesthood; UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES can they hold this delegation of authority from the Almighty.” LDS “Apostle” Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p. 527, 1966 edition

  • bla bla bla bla bla, always excusing the Lds leaders.

  • SkyBlaze

    So, now are we able to promote polygamy? Porn? Recreational drugs? All of which have been spoken about by authorities in the past, so are they now elligible for promotion? This puts the church in a unique position. What if they call a Bishop who has promoted gay marriage in the past and then that Bishop performs a gay wedding. What does the church do? Release the Bishop? If I could, I think I would like to promote a campain to withdraw my vote for Bro. Christofferson. After all, we are asked that during meetings and given the opportunity to vote no on people.

  • Wayne Dequer

    Bruce R. McConkie was not an “Apostle” in 1966. He did Not become one until 1972. Of the 1978 Revelation, Elder McConkie wrote: “It was during this prayer that the revelation came. The Spirit of the Lord rested upon us all; we felt something akin to what happened on the day of Pentecost and at the Kirtland Temple. From the midst of eternity, the voice of God, conveyed by the power of the Spirit, spoke to his prophet. The message was that the time had now come to offer the fullness of the everlasting gospel, including celestial marriage, and the priesthood, and the blessings of the temple, to all men, without reference to race or color, solely on the basis of personal worthiness. And we all heard the same voice, received the same message, and became personal witnesses that the word received was the mind and will and voice of the Lord.”

  • Louis E.

    I’m not religious,but I have no objection to “sodomy” between consenting adults of opposite sexes,and a great deal of objection to sex acts between persons of the same sex.

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  • Thanks SkyBlaze, for saying exactly what I feel and expressed in a post just today. I never thought I’d see the day. In the church of common consent, there has never been so much fear of expressing such concerns.

    http://anonymousbishop.com/?p=388

  • Jared

    The members absolutely have a right to their own choices. That is the gift of agency. I just fear that many will take this to mean it’s okay to side with the world instead of the prophets on issues. That is not at all what I believe he is saying. He teaching truth and tolerance just as Elder Oaks did.”Our tolerance and respect for others and their beliefs does not cause us to abandon our commitment to the truths we understand and the covenants we have made. That is a third absolute truth: We do not abandon the truth and our covenants. We are cast as combatants in the war between truth and error. There is no middle ground. We must stand up for truth, even while we practice tolerance and respect for beliefs and ideas different from our own”
    https://www.lds.org/broadcasts/article/ces-devotionals/2011/01/truth-and-tolerance?lang=eng#
    As soon as we begin to criticize the brethren we are on the highway to apostasy. Don’t be led away by sly wording of newspaper reporters.

  • Kory Alexander

    Something to point out in relation to this subject (homosexuality) and blacks being able to hold the priesthood is that homosexuality being a sin and immoral is scriptural, the church will never change their mind regarding scripture. Nowhere (if I am not mistaken) in the scriptures does it say a black person cannot hold the priesthood. I believe this is an important point to make.

  • Exactly. Thank you Jared. I think it’s also important to note that if the church did not do this people would be leaving in DROVES. We can say “let them leave then! We don’t want them!” but we need to remember Heavenly Father does want them. It’s about His will and work. I believe these people are misled and there is an unquestionable danger to people misunderstanding or using these statements to justify apostate behavior. Nevertheless, I feel as long as they’re still in the church, they have better chances of regaining their testimony of the Proclamation to the World and spreading the gospel than if they were excommunicated. From what I know (which is very little) very few rejoin and if they do most, if not all, have very bitter feelings for the church and it’s leadership forever after. I don’t agree with or support homosexuality – but I don’t wish ill on anyone and we need to remember to be Christ-like. Look up and really study what that means before you say it’s just…

  • nika

    i believe that the church will not waiver on this. when christofferson said “nope”, he did not indicate anything suggesting that it will change. yes this article is about gay marriage but hes saying that with over 15 million members, there will be some who support it and some who dont. All the church is trying to do is let anyone who thinks they will no longer be allowed in lds temples or will lose church membership because of having an opposite opinion about gay marriage. this being said, i do not support gay marriage but i also advocate anyone who is gay to live theyre lives. i compare this situation to my friendships with my friends, they dont support me being mormon but we’re still friends. i dont support them having sex before marriage but hey, we’re still friends. I dont support gay marriage but some of my friends are gay. they know my views and i know theyre views, we are STILL friends.

  • Rocket3030

    The Church is NOT a democracy. We do not “vote”. The leaders are called and we are asked to sustain them or not by raising our hands. A symbolic gesture.

  • Jim Lohse

    Agreed, Brigham Young said about blacks that if the ban were ever lifted the church would be apostate. Not that I am stating my own position, just showing that what the Brigham Young said doesn’t matter when the church is faced with enough political pressure.

    Honestly if you look at D&C 130 and the current support for anti-discrimination, and look at the church definition of apostasy, they are apostate just based on that. You can all go home now 🙂

    In addition, the existence of de facto gay wards is a good sign of where the church will end up. It won’t be the first members get burned by arguing untenable positions only to have the corrupt leadership turn their backs on them and make them look like fools.

  • Barry Bounous

    The problem that will be difficult to reconcile is when an employee of a church business gets married to a same-sex partner. Then the church will have to use the following tangled logic to fire the person: Yes, we no longer teach that same-sex attraction is in itself a sin, Yes we know that your marriage is legal and therefore you are not guilty of fornication, Yes you may have a current temple recommend, but because we have religious belief protection you are fired. I don’t think that position can be held forever. Some aspect of church policy will change.

  • mikehike

    Joseph Smith ordained blacks to the priesthood. It was never Church doctrine to deny them it. It became policy later on but this was a fallacy of men. God allows imperfect me to make mistakes, even good ones who serve him. So your comment doesn’t apply. God has never and never will approve gay marriage.

  • James Anderson

    No, They didn’t. In fact it was assumed and even state that at the right time, the ban would be lifted. There were those that held different opinions and you can find those commentaries if you search for them. However the official position of the Church was that in due time all worthy males would receive the priesthood. It’s worth noting that The ban of blacks holding the priesthood was never even officially stated anywhere that I can find (I have looked) and that several black members were ordained by Joseph Smith the “founder” himself.

  • Anonymous

    It’s never going change. Sorry dude!

  • Jalen DJ

    Ignorance is bliss my friend. You will never understand what he is saying if you don’t humble yourself and recognize that while we are “mormons” we still have brains and know how to think for ourselves. In fact the church supports self thinkers.

  • Ben

    The joke is on most of you detractors….the whole point of having a living apostleship who receive revelation is so things aren’t static with practices and teachings and things can change when they need to. So when you say “See the blacks got the priesthood, they changed their mind…blah blah blah”, well that’s the whole point geniuses!!! We don’t base everything on a vague ancient book that applies to your life today as much as the phone book from 1950. So basically if the doctrine changes then I am on-board, if it stays the same, I am on-board. Could it change sure! Is it time, don’t know. It’s true the doctrine of marriage is basically the fundamental of EVERYTHING else in the gospel….way more important than the blacks and the priesthood issue, but I suppose it still could change, because that’s the whole point of how it’s set up!!

  • Nate

    Always using “excuses” as an excuse to reject LDS leaders.

  • Fergus Thornfield

    Elder Christofferson isn’t saying that it’s good and alright for people to have opinions and beliefs different from the church’s regarding homosexuality. He’s reassuring those that do believe differently that they won’t be kicked out of the church just for having a different opinion. He’s reminding us that we have our agency. And while homosexuality is not right, it’s still ultimately up to the individual to decide what they’re going to believe and who they’re going to follow. He’s not condoning homosexuality or changing the church’s official view on the matter.

  • Nope.

    No, same-sex attraction is not a sin. Acting on it is. The church will always have that as part of its doctrine. It won’t change no matter how loudly people oppose it.

    I don’t know that there are any paid jobs run by church businesses that require a temple recommend, but I might be wrong. However, if one is not living up to the standards required to be worthy of a temple recommend, then yes, they would not expect to hold their recommend for much longer. And if one is required to have a recommend to hold their job, then it just makes sense that they would be fired because they simply do not fit the criteria of their job requirements. But they would already know that.

    Anyone who is not a member of the church doesn’t hold a temple recommend. If a temple recommend isn’t required for a job, then the reasons they would be fired from a church business are the same as any other job. Sexuality would have nothing to do with it. This church is about loving people, not the sins they…

  • trainer

    Yes. From the time I was a little child until it was lifted in my sr. year of high school, I was taught that it would eventually be lifted.

  • Angie

    Remember that at that time africian american people were in a different position than they are now. If you truly think about that day in age if an African American were baptizing a white man it would have never happened and it would have been very difficult to baptize anyone in that day in age. God has timing for everything and we don’t know the reasons why he places certain things to happen in specific time frames.

  • Jordan Anderson

    Even though the book was titled “Mormon Doctrine,” Bruce R. McConkie was writing based his own opinion, not church doctrine. After the Church issued Official Declaration No. 2, Elder McConkie revised his book to reflect the teachings of the church.

    In April 2012, Elder D. Todd Christofferson taught:
    “It should be remembered that not every statement made by a Church leader, past or present, necessarily constitutes doctrine. It is commonly understood in the Church that a statement made by one leader on a single occasion often represents a personal, though well-considered, opinion, not meant to be official or binding for the whole Church.”
    https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2012/04/the-doctrine-of-christ?lang=eng

  • R

    Lies

    Re-read the article.

  • Crystal

    You make an excellent point, Barry. I believe it’s important for an organization to establish its beliefs and values clearly and let the members make a choice based on that with clarity. I realize that this may lead to several departing from the faith and that is unfortunate. But pandering only leads to ambiguity and member mistrust in the organization.

  • B

    “If I could, I think I would like to promote a campaign(sp) to withdraw my vote for Bro. Christofferson”.

    Sounds like apostasy at it’s best. Like it was said earlier by someon; “you sustain, not vote-in” apostles. Pretty ignorant mormon methinks.

  • Ryan

    Mormongirl, he’s commenting because he has just as much right to speak his opinion as everybody else whether or not he believes in God. Your comment neither helps your case nor mine as people who believe in God.

    Atheist Max, if the apostles were not given authority from God, then it is true that you and I have just as much authority as them. However, if someone can’t prove something to be true, it does not make it false. Otherwise we’d have a contradiction, for we cannot prove that they do or do not have authority. Hence, if the inability to prove something makes it false, then they would both have and not have authority from God, a clear contradiction.

    I do appreciate your final statement, and I hope all people to do whatever they think is best.

  • Jennifer

    Thank you Jared! My thoughts exactly

  • Jemma

    Yes! This!! Wow, people do not get it. Members of the church can do whatever they want and believe whatever they want. They won’t be formally disciplined for supporting gay marriage, but he’s not saying that that’s the correct view (God’s view) of things. There’s subtlety in his words for sure, but I think it’s pretty clear. If the church won’t change their position on this, why would an active Latter-day Saint oppose that? Because of agency. But as they more fuller grasp the doctrine, I believe they’ll change their minds and align themselves with Christ and his apostles, rather than the current trends of this country.

  • Jennifer

    We forget that as Christians we are commanded to love everyone. No matter the sin. We also forget how sly Satan is. We are being told that if we don’t agree and support something, we are haters. We need to show that we can disagree but also love at the same time. I don’t personally agree with gay marriage but I love many people who are gay. They are wonderful people in my life and I’m better for knowing them. There are many things I don’t agree with, and that’s why ‘I’ choose not to do them, but I can love others that do. My take on Elder Christoffersons message was that we need to love everyone, but that the church’s position isn’t going to change. Me for one would be concerned if it did. Heavenly Father isn’t swayed by political correctness. But he loves us all despite our weaknesses. Thank heavens for that!

  • Tai

    He was merely stating that no one will be “forced” to comply with the doctrine of the church, but that if a mere personal opinion (which was already in contradicrion with the Lord’s revealed will) became an active attack on the church or its leaders, or if that opinion led one to actively support an organization that opposes the Church, THEN that person would be in danger of official church action. He did not say it was OKAY to support gay marriage on social media or elsewhere, he said they were “free” to do so…which is correct. We all have our agency, even if we hold a personal belief that is contrary to the Lord’s will and plan. But if we use our agency to attack the Lord’s church or the Lord’s chosen servants, then we are in danger of official church action.

  • Elizabeth

    no they did not
    they repeatedly said that they did not know what the Lord would do in the future regarding blacks but that, for now; it was not the time

  • Tloke

    Exactly! Thank you!!

  • John Willins

    Ya. He approved gay marriage when he created gays and love. Open your eyes.

  • Aleq

    Brigham Young said that they would only receive the priesthood when all other men in the world had it.

  • Bradley

    I used to believe that, until I heard that the succeeding prophet 1: is always the oldest member of the 12 and 2, they pray until the answer is the same from everyone. Sounds just like the way Catholics pick a new Pope, by writing names down on a paper until they’re all the same.

  • Doug

    No. They were actually hoping and praying to God to allow them to have the priesthood. Remember the apostles are not in charge of the church, Christ is. He does everything in his own time when it’s best for his children. Also the LDS church during that time was the most progressive and friendly towards African Americans. AND you can’t compare race (being born black) with a choice (sexual preference).

  • Doug

    That is false. He never said that, at least never while acting as an apostle. They all had their personal opinions but no statement was ever made like that by the church.

  • Doug

    Not quite true. The fallacy of men will never impact church doctrine or policy. God promised us that if the prophet ever led our tried to lead us astray he would remove him from his place. Blacks received the priesthood at the right moment God intended it to.

  • Doug

    He didn’t say promote. The church’s stance has not changed. They are talking about individuals and their right to believe whatever they want. Go back and read the article more closely

  • Bryan

    If any member of the church entered into gay relations either in a marriage or not, they would be excommunicated.
    An individual in a legal gay marriage would have to end that marriage before being permitted to join the faith.
    In short, the church won’t recognise gay marriage. Period.

  • anon

    nope. God said marriage is between a man and a woman. That’s why he made adam and eve

  • Tony G

    The church is governed by common consent, friend. And the sustaining is literally called a ‘sustaining vote’ by the general authorities. It’s not symbolic. It’s the doctrinal basis of governance for the church.

  • Dakota Iverson

    You are wrong. I won’t ever see this again, so you can respond but it will be pointless.

    It will never be changed. It can’t be.

  • Dakota Iverson

    Dummy

  • sammierose

    The Church will never change it’s position on gay marriage because it will ALWAYS be between a man and a woman. Their support in our free will shall always be there, but they will never support gay marriage as part of the Church itself.

  • The LDS church has a long history of receiving ‘revelation’ shortly after the weight of a changing society changes the direction of humanity.

    – Black priesthood after the abolition of slavery?
    – Abolition of polygamy after it became illegal?

    I mean the Pearl of Great Price implicitly says that church members should adhere to the “laws of the land” they live in. I’m just waiting until it becomes an accepted practice within the church – only time will tell and it’s awfully embarrassing that “inspired prophets” are always behind the curve.

  • ari

    Right on. Well said. And keep in mind that the sexuality of a very important historical figure is not clear..

  • You have a point about proving although we dont force the belief because that falls under God to show you if what we share is true

    But about his opinion, if he says he is atheist then that is his opinion that there is no God no higher being that gives us power or watches over us that we are left to ourselves to live this life till we die

    But now he claims that there is a God and he gave him authority of that of an apostle well now isnt that just beating down on his belief of being atheist so then where does his true opinion stand???

  • Barn2

    This is false. The prophet Thomas S. Monson was not the oldest when he was chosen. Whoever you heard that information from was not correctly informed. I would suggest not believing everything you hear. Including this. Going to lds.org or calling a member of the Bishopric to discover for yourself would be the best route.

  • Wellll

    “This is not a doctrinal evolution or change, as far as the church is concerned,” the apostle said. “It’s how things are approached.”

  • Eddie

    Priesthood wasn’t granted to blacks until looong after slavery was abolished. When exactly do you think slavery was abolished? And when exactly do you think blacks were granted priesthood? Maybe know your history before making such statements

  • Sue

    It’seems nit symbolic. If you remeberremember the last General Conference someone did raise their hand in opposition. It was noticed. It was brief, but it is not symbolic. I have been in stake conference and had someone else do.that. they stopped the meeting and pulled that person aside and I am sure asked why they felt that way. I don’t know or care about the outcome. I just know it’s not symbolic.

  • Austin

    positions at the Mtc require a temple recommend.

  • Sami N.

    So does that mean he approved murder? Should we allow murderers into the church who continue to murder again and again. That’s a choice too you know.

  • P. CHENEY

    Parris Cheney I believe in the gift of the holy spirit, God the Father and Jesus Christ as the only savior in my life. I do not judge others I leave this up to my father in Heaven the creator of all. I am very sensitive and tolerate more than the norm. Each person has a mission, a walk a journey here on this earth. It is people here on earth that have ruined and torn down others lives. I see that there is a lot of pain and the lack of on this earth and its ways. My we embrace one other, and be slow to judge one other. May we all look to the quite spirit of the HOLY GHOST of comfort to lead and teach use with grace on honor this world does not have. May our mirror or image reflect but a grain of sand what Jesus is and has always been and those that are weak, may we teach of love and comfort and understanding.

  • P. CHENEY

    By the way are there any single men in this church?

  • seandra

    Actually they do not nor have they ever come out and stated that it is a sin to have the emotions and attractions towards the same sex individual, they do indeed oppose any one individual whom acts on these emotions or attractions yet the church does not and never has turned away anyone whom wants to be part of the LDS church. I have been inactive for many years yet my testimony has always held, with that I am like any other individual who finds their way to or back to the LDS church I do not expect to walk in and gain all that every other member who has held themselves to a higher standard always trying to be “more like Jesus” as the song goes
    I love all people and do not look at color or sexualality before I become their friend. I do believe that is the same views as the church in some ways, I am not gay I feel marriage is to be for a man and woman but every individual on this planet is my brother&sister see family does not turn their backs on one another they love unconditional

  • Tyra

    Actually black men held the Priesthood when the Church was founded and before slavery was abolished. Brigham Young ceased the practice, and it was reinstated in the 1970s.

  • Tracy

    Thank you Jared. You hit the nail on the head. I see it as a very slippery slope.

  • Kathy

    It won’t change and Elder Christofferson’s very last words were very plain. The “plan of salvation” is a very foundational doctrine of LDS beliefs. The idea that we lived before with our Heavenly Father and Mother, were born to earthly parents, that we will die and live again, with the promise of eternal families and eternal increase. (Meaning endless children) Only happens in the bounds of a heterosexual marriage. There isn’t going to be adoption in heaven of someone else’s eternal family. Changing that would change the foundation of the whole church. It would be like telling Catholics that Peter was a fictional character. Jesus Christ is the accepted leader of both faiths, but other beliefs are only marginally less important. This is one of those.

  • Eddie

    TODD CHRISTENSON SOUNDS LIKE A FUTURE APOSTATE. He does not know what he is saying by stating that facebook and twitter are not organized efforts to oppose church teachings. The medium of communication has changed from standing on street stating your beliefs from posting on facebook or twitter

  • Dialogue in Deseret

    Years ago my family and I wanted to go into the White House while we were on a family vacation in Washington DC. Unfortunately I did not realize until the week before we left that if a person wants to go through the White House he or she must meet a certain criteria and background check which can take weeks to authorize. If he or she does not clear the background check, or meet certain criteria, then they could not tour the White House. I was extremely upset! This was truly my family’s only opportunity to ALL be together at Washington DC to tour the White House. But there are certain rules that one must follow/adhere to. Just being American was NOT good enough? Now I could kick, scream and protest, I could have my own opinion of who should or who should not be allowed in, but the policy still stands regardless of my opinion. It is highly unlikely that the protocols will ever change on how they screen those who wish to tour the White House. Is it likely policies will change? “Nope!”

  • Jason

    “We have individual members in the church with a variety of different opinions, beliefs and positions on these issues and other issues,” Christofferson said. On the other hand, it is considered as a violation of God’s commandments and much more serious to engage in homosexual behavior. Thus if an employee of a church business engages in homosexual behavior, it will not be a case of someone having a different opinion but it will be a case of someone having broken a very serious commandment of God.

  • Ivette

    Exactly!

  • Jessica

    Thank you. Your opinion is beautiful and I agree. It is not our place to judge.. only to love others.

  • Jane

    I have not read every comment but a couple of the early comments struck me. When I was at BYU as a student I became close friends with several gay students. At the time a friend was being counseled by Pres.Kimball. I was concerned about him & made an appt to talk with Pres Kimball. This is when he was being treated for cancer. He had to cancel our appt because he was quite ill that day. So I wrote to him and shared my concerns. I recd a letter back in which Pres Kimball expressed great love for my friend. No judgement or animosity just pure love and concern. My friend nor any other of my gay acquaintances were excommunicated. Also I know of professors who were never fired. I think the church leaders are more compassionate and loving than many of the members. I think they realize this is not a choice these people make but how they were born. One last story-my husband’s childhood friend committed suicide because he knew he couldn’t honestly marry or have children. Be…

  • Ryan

    Polygamy was abolished because the federal gov’t made it illegal, then seized all the assets of the Church and threatened to dissolve the entire organization. There was very little choice in the matter. The official declaration comes in when the Lord revealed that giving up the practice was acceptable to him versus losing the Church altogether.

  • You clearly have no grasp on the concept of revelation. The reason some of the things in the church changed is because Prophets were faced with decisions and challenges and they asked the Lord for guidance in those matters. Polygamy,Blacks holding the priesthood.When it was right and in the Lords time he changed it. We have no idea how long it took for those revelation to come every time. Or how many things the Prophets have prayed about that the Lord didnt change. Those 2 things were changed for a purpose that didnt affect Eternal principals. Changing the institution of Marriage which is an Eternal principal and Covenant when done in the Temple will not change. We are created after our Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother who are the creators of our spirits. Just as man and women are creators of our bodies. We have been commanded to multiply and replenish the earth. Man and man or women and women cannot do that. This will not change and im thankful for that. We still have to love all

  • NOT One of the Two Witnesses

    From Elder Nelson in the Ensign January 2015; the emphasis here should be on the last sentence:

    You need to understand the far-reaching consequences of society’s current skirmish over the definition of marriage. The present debate involves the question of whether two people of the same gender can be married. If you have a question about the position of the Church on this or any other important issue, prayerfully ponder it and then heed the prophetic messages of living prophets. Their inspired words, with inspiration from the Holy Ghost, will bring to your mind a fuller and truer understanding.

  • Gloverboy6

    I believe same-sex marriage should be performed by churches who want to perform it. And I think what Elder Christofferson is saying is: as long as you don’t preach against the church’s refusal to ever perform a same-sex marriage (which I agree with despite by support of secular same-sex marriage), it’s not a problem to support same-sex marriage in general. This latest SCOTUS ruling isn’t about forcing churches to perform same-sex marriages, it’s about same-sex couples being able to go and get a state-issued marriage license and be married by a judge or church that will officiate it.
    Separation of church and state is supposed to guarantee that the gov’t can never tell a church what to do, and that a church can never tell the gov’t what to do. It’s really that simple.

  • Gloverboy6

    You are correct , but this isn’t about religious marriage. It’s about secular marriage. LGBTs are asking to be married in a Mormon church, they’re only asking for the right to obtain a marriage license and be married by a judge (or other church that might perform it) so they can have the same legal rights as any married straight couple in THIS life. Obviously they won’t have the same rights in the next life, but that’s a different story.

  • Liz

    Yes, thousands of them! They are otherwise known as missionaries. 🙂

  • Liz

    I think I see the point in the comparisons, though. To be fair, a gay person is born gay, just like we are born whatever color/race/ethnicity we are born as. No one gets to decide in the womb what we are going to be like when we are born, and no one has control over which gender we are going to be or what our sexual orientation is. We are born as God’s creation, all with different gifts and challenges. Science and social progression have both come to the logical conclusion that being gay is more genetic than choice.

  • Liz

    He also made gay people. 🙂

  • J.McGuirt

    Um not true.. I am single (divorced) and I am not a missionary. Though I did serve a mission from Jan 13, 1993 – Dec 9, 1994.. so I was a missionary back then.

  • As members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints we read these articles and find that our hearts are full of joy and thanksgiving for the wonderful gift our Father in Heaven has given to us. Temple marriage. To be with our families now and forever. To receive all the blessings that He has promised us . Thank you Heavenly Father.

  • Idea

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophic_burden_of_proof

    You’re making it more convoluted than it actually is. There aren’t just two states of knowledge, true and false (although in reality there are only two states of being). The third is agnosticism. You can believe something to be true or false, but you can also not believe anything at all about a particular subject. The point is that it’s not my job to prove your claim about God true, or more importantly false. It is you that has to provide the evidence.

  • Leslie

    This article did not just come out and this is being used somewhat out of context. I agree it’s pretty clear Facebook IS doing those things. And members that participate in putting forth views in opposition are heretics. I hope the church takes a stronger stand against those that do so.

  • scott

    First of all…it’s Christofferson, not Christenson and secondly, all he is saying is that as members of the LDS faith, no one is being compelled to believe a certain way. One can even express their views, even if it opposes the views of the church. Where the church draws the line is when people try actively to pull others away from the faith. It’s the difference between an individual belief and that of a concentrated effort to mislead others. The church isn’t about compulsion. It’s about persuasion and that is done one belief at a time. You don’t have to believe all the doctrine of the church in order to belong to the church. You aren’t going to be excommunicated if you smoke or drink, but the church will invite you by “gentleness and love-unfeigned” to mend your ways. Still, the invitation is extended to all…even if your personal beliefs differ from church doctrine.

  • scott

    Well said

  • Tyson776

    As a Mormon I don’t drink I coffee, yet I don’t expect a law prohibiting everyone from drinking it. As a Mormon I believe that marriage as ordained by God is between a man and a woman, but I don’t expect the law to discriminate and punish people for marrying outside of that.

    Frankly, this should be a moral and personal issue rather than a legislative one. Homosexual couples will exist whether gay marriage is legal or not. By denying them the right to marry all we’re doing is discriminating and punishing them for not sharing our beliefs. Gods law is God’s law and that will never change. But our laws are inherently different, we are not a theocracy and should not treat our country as one. Keep both Gods law and ours and exercise your beliefs and allow others to do the same. As was said about the freedom of speech, “I may not agree with what you say, but I’ll defend with my life you’re right to say it,” the same applies to this in my opinion. Freedom is the foundation of the…

  • Penelope

    Thomas S. Monson had been in the Quorum of the Twelve the longest. That’s what they meant by “oldest.” Brigham Young was the Prophet who put that qualifier into action (under the direction of the Lord, of course), and it has been that way ever since.

  • Lizzie

    Keep up dude. Even the church acknowledges it isn’t a choice.

  • Robert Arave

    The whole point is simple. The church and God teaches and always will teach that homosexuality is a sin. however, we are ok to believe that we should let gays go and marry if that’s what they really want to do. I can give them free-agency and still be firm in the fact that it is a sin. The number one thing to remember? The first and great commandment, Love they neighbor as thyself.
    I will not force you to stop being gay but will love you and try to be the best example I can. And Gods laws will never change or be voted on by man.

  • “We do not intend to admit to our campus any homosexuals. If any of you have this tendency and have not completely abandoned it, may I suggest that you leave the university immediately after this assembly…. We do not want others on this campus to be contaminated by your presence.” (Ernest Wilkinson, president of Brigham Young University, in a 1965 lecture to the BYU student body, titled: “Make Honor your Standard.”

    http://mormonquotes.com/Homosexuality

  • Steve

    I’m impressed (for the most part) by the civil nature of your discussion. Mostly you avoid name-calling and simply express your opinions, with the intent to clarify what others seem not to understand. I have seen so many online ‘discussions’ with violent name-calling and insults, I really appreciate that. We should all respect and love one another regardless of the differences in our beliefs, and most of you are modelling that. Bravo! I’ve been alive long enough to learn that there are are always those who think differently than I do, but I can still be their friend and we can still get along. Christ is the perfect model of this: he loves every one of his children. Don’t confuse love of person with acceptance of wrong-doing, though. He forgave the woman taken in adultery, but then followed that with the charge to “go thy way and sin no more.”

  • Neil

    Yes, positions today have evolved from what they may have been in 1965. Kinda like how Obama was against same sex marriage in 2008 but for it in 2012. Good for the LDS to acknowledge their evolving views.

  • Michelle

    For those wanting to know the honest story, please go to the following article explaining how sites (like this one) are misquoting and construing bits and pieces of things to come up with their own narrative. Makes you wonder why there are no links to any of the actual interviews- only bits quoted and dissected- in this article. Sad.

    http://www.sixteensmallstones.org/lds-apostle-d-todd-christofferson-did-not-say-that-it-is-okay-for-lds-members-to-support-same-sex-marriage/

  • David M

    Note, BYU also did not (and does not) admit people who are engaged in extra-marital hetero sex either, and for similar reasons. Just sayin. I know. I was kicked out of school, and deservedly so. It helped me get back on track.

  • Grant Pufer

    Well said! I completely agree.

  • Richard

    No, actually: The issue isn’t two gay people getting married (believe it or not, I believe consenting adults can enter into whatever contract they deem fit so long as their is no coercion and they are of sound mind, at least from a social secular government point of view which should provide freedoms equal to the lowest common denominator for a society in order for it to maintain freedom from government, not to say that this changes God’s Law, which is very succinct that any sort of homosexual practice is a sin and should not be committed as with any other sin), its what such a ruling is going to be used to do, which is to destroy freedom of speech, freedom of association and freedom of religion. The Obama administration is already threatening to revoke religious organizations tax exempt status for not performing gay marriage (this argument was part of the argument the administration’s lawyers gave in front of the Supreme Court). This ruling, combined with Obamacare subsidy ruling…

  • Richard

    Continued from previous–(which basically means that the government, regardless of how a law is actually written, can ‘reinterpret’ the law to mean whatever it likes, utterly destroying the concept of the Rule of Law) are two of the largest hits to the united states constitution in its entire history. The constitution is now, more than ever, lingering by a thread.

  • Trasi

    Wonderful! 🙂

  • Bill

    It has nothing to do with age or voting. There is only one vote and it is the Lords. The Prophet is the one with the most seniority not age. The Lord votes by not allowing an apostle to live long enough to have the most seniority. The President of the quorum of the 12 is the one with the most seniority of the apostles. He becomes President of the Church when the previous President dies, and yes the Quorum gives its sustaining vote. Please don’t confuse a sustaining vote with voting on whether or not it should happen

  • Erica Nabel

    Soooo God’s mind changed as times got more modern and segregation became more a thing of the past?? What kind of church has “revelations from God” like that? The Bible clearly states that his word is the same today & tomorrow. It is everlasting and unchanging. He made the rules, and they don’t change, basically. Jesus never said to exclude any race from following him, or that he’d love certain races less. He is for all humanity. So Brigham Young was wrong from the beginning. The Mormon church was built on idea’s and values not supported by the Bible…the very word-the only word, of God.

  • Erica Nabel

    Open your eyes and read the Bible. He destroyed Sodom and Gamorah for the perverse actions of its inhabitants. Homosexuality is absolutely not something God created. It is a sin and that is easily found all threw the Bible. He did create love, and free will, and the great lier who deceives mankind into thinking all sorts of misconceptions. I believe whole heartedly that gay people believe they’re gay. I also believe whole heartedly that God loves everyone on this earth-gays included. But it is still wrong, and not of God. Undesputably so. Unless you want to re-write the Bible. God teaches love, kindness, patience….my goal is to treat everyone this way. Hate is an evil thing. But no one can convince me that God is pro-gay/gay marriage.

  • Erica Nabel

    You sound more like someone who believes in evolution then your creator….sad….Science would like you to believe all their reasoning for the unexplainable. It’s called “free will” & the fact we live in a society that makes being gay cool and trendy, and being Christian out-dated and a bigot. Don’t forget the fact that Satan himself was given free-reign over this world and his ultimate goal is to lie & deceive all mankind that there is no God, & to twist God’s love & laws into something that keeps man away from him. I suggest you pray for guidance and knowledge…I don’t think your quite on base with your comment, in my opinion.

  • Jordan S Bevan

    Why don’t you read AND understand what Brigham Young said…about the black people having the priesthood and the church being in apostate. IF in the 1800”s and early 1900”s if they allowed black people to have the priesthood most of the white people would leave and the church would not exist today. As it was many white people left in 1969. But it was always promised that one day it would be allowed. And also it never says Sodom and Gamora was destroyed for homosexual behavior either. Although it is inferred as a reason, depending on your translation of the Bible it says different things. The inference with homosexuals is that the people came to lots house and asked for the visitors and infers they want them to rape them. Never says it though.

  • Jordan S Bevan

    Homosexuality is never definitive in the Sodom and Gamorah story it is only infered. Because the men wanted the visitors to know them.

  • Jordan S Bevan

    Your ignorance is astounding, look for any reference and you will find many of the prophets said one day black people will be allowed the priesthood.

  • Jordan S Bevan

    Gay people are not born gay. It is a load of bull. http://socialinqueery.com/2013/03/18/no-one-is-born-gay-or-straight-here-are-5-reasons-why/

    We want it to be that way so it’s easier to accept. By this standard people attracted to kids, people that love murder, people that love drugs and alcohol are ALL born that way. The reasoning that families with more gay people in it have more gay childeren. So it must be genetic. Or it MUCH MORE LIKELY that it was an observed acceptable action. Just like almost everything else in life it’s a learned behavior. So you have more gay people in your family your more likely to be gay. The same as a kid who is abused is more likely to abuse their kids. It’s not DNA, It’s learned behavior.

  • Jordan S Bevan

    The church does not acknowledge it is not a choice, it acknowledges that you may be born a way that makes it more likely for you to have homosexual tendencies. BUT STILL 100% your CHOICE to act.

  • Jordan S Bevan

    Actually the quotes specifically rule in that they can do that.

  • Jordan S Bevan

    Just for the record God did NOT SAY in any record we have marriage is between a Man and a Woman. The Bible does not say it for sure. But it is infered. And Adam and Eve is techniques correct, but you can’t forget there were others on the planet back then. Giants, nephlam (probably spelt wrong). Don’t forget about the first woman LILITH that was created the same way as Adam was and then she left and reproduced with others. AND then God created eve from Adam.

  • Brandon

    You’re right, God never changes his commandments. Guess we all need to offer up our first borns and pets as sacrifices.

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  • Bruce Josephson

    “Forget everything that I have said, or what President Brigham Young or President George Q. Cannon or whomsoever has said in days past that is contrary to the present revelation. We spoke with a limited understanding and without the light and knowledge that now has come into the world. We get our truth and our light line upon line and precept upon precept. We have now had added a new flood of intelligence and light on this particular subject, and it erases all the darkness and all the views and all the thoughts of the past. They don’t matter any more.”

    Past quote of Bruce R. McConckie