At Liberty University, Jeb Bush seeks support from evangelicals

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Former Governor Jeb Bush of Florida speaking at the 2013 Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) in National Harbor, Maryland.

Photo courtesy of Gage Skidmore, via Wikimedia Commons

Former Governor Jeb Bush of Florida speaking at the 2013 Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) in National Harbor, Maryland.

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LYNCHBURG, Va. (Reuters) "Fashionable opinion" has a problem with Christians and the only proper response is "a forthright defense" of the constitutional right to freedom of religion, Jeb Bush said during a commencement speech at Liberty University.

  • “Bring to me those enemies of mine who would not have me for their king and execute them in front of me” – JESUS (Luke 19:27)

    Jeb Bush – or Any candidate who invokes “JESUS” – should be asked about the wickedness of these verses and these sick parables.

    George W. Bush was the most religious president in 50 years – and what good did his ignorant philosophy do for our country? His bungling, anti-science, anti-reason, nonsense destroyed almost every institution in America and we will be living with the fallout of his despicable presidency for the rest of our lives!

    “God told me to do it” – George W. Bush

    Well – you cowering ignoramus – you were supposed to be listening to the constitution!

    Shame on America for paying attention to the Bush family. They should have vanished with Donald Rumsfeld, Condi Rice, Dick Cheney and Sarah Palin!

    Bunch of over privileged, jug-headed knuckle draggers.

  • Let me say right off that I am a democratic Socialist glad that Senator Bernie Sanders has entered the presidential race. But coming from a Catholic background I do perceive too many liberals as lacking respect and ” gravitas ” ( a nice Latin word ) on an issue many more Americans take very seriously : their religious freedom.Separation of church and state should not mean hostility and fanatical distancing from all kinds of religious expression. Here in Cranston, Rhode Island we had a long ludicrous PRAYER ON SCHOOL WALL controversy. I actually sided with THE FAITHFUL.
    Jeb Bush, I read ,is a Catholic . But many Republicans are influenced by that militant atheist Ayn Rand. She is also Queen of the hateful New Atheism.Does Bush think there is some cognitive dissonance in his Republican Party between Christian conservatives and Ayn Rand followers ?
    THANK YOU .

  • Fran

    My whole-souled love and allegiance goes only to God and his kingdom or heavenly government (Daniel 2:44) as the only hope for true peace, security and other grand blessings, for meek people in all nations on earth.

    The main emphasis of the teachings and preaching of God’s son, Jesus, when he was on earth, was that government, and not man’s (Matthew 4:17; 24:14; John 18:36).

    The forthcoming millennial rule by Jesus as its King will replace all human rule and prove to be righteous, just and loving (Isaiah 11:1-9), because he is the Prince of Peace (Isaiah 9:6). My vote is therefore for that kingdom and its rule instead.

  • Diogenes

    Max: Utterly irrational as usual.
    Ron: I imagine we differ on many issues, but I appreciate your reasoned and measured tone; a rarity on most forums. Cognitive dissonance in the Republican Party? Certainly, but not less so than in the Democratic Party. What you have identified is the difference between the social conservatives (evangelicals, etc.) in the Party, and the fiscal conservatives (followers of Ayn Rand and others). The Tea Party spans the Spectrum from the S.C’s. to the F.C’s. Even with the entire evangelical vote, which is not possible, since evangelicals are split into wings as well; Jeb Bush (or any nominally conservative candidate) will not garner enough votes to win the presidency. Not unless the entire roof caves in on this nation.
    EEDD: If you are Karla, as I suspect, have the courage of your convictions and identify yourself as such in your posts. I agree that Repentance is necessary, but so is moral courage and transparency.
    Fran: Soon, but not yet.

  • Doc Anthony

    Well I agree with you on one thing Max. George W. Bush was the “most religious President” in 50 years, as you said. He wasn’t a fake.

    He was the ONLY President who was recognized even by his enemies, as actually meaning what he said every time he discussed his Christian faith. Friends and foes all acknowledged GWB’s clear sincerity about his Christian beliefs, even if they didn’t agree with him.

    Obama, in contrast, was giving off major statements that he did NOT personally believe in, as publicly confirmed by Obama’s own top advisor David Axelrod. Obama was willing to fudge and LIE to get what he wanted from Christians.

    Gullible Christians bought into Obama’s lies and voted for him, of course. Christians who voted for Obama (or even who stayed home on Election Day and allowed Obama to win), therefore killed their own religious freedom.

    And now we’re all about to pay for it….no matter who wins in 2016.

  • Larry

    Not counting Jimmy Carter. He also was big on wearing his Evangelical Christianity on his sleeve. Both were crap presidents.

  • Larry

    The TP spans the range of the religious right who feign concern for fiscal responsibility to fiscal conservatives who feign concern for the religious right. In other words plain old republican phonies.

    Appealing to bible thumpers is a doomed strategy. They are split too wide. Plus their favorite candidates are so far removed from reality they have zero chance in general election.

  • Doc Anthony

    Jimmy Carter was — is — indeed a Christian, and it was exciting to see him running for President in 1976. (Back then the Democratic Party wasn’t allergic to evangelical Christians.)

    But Carter, with his creeping liberalism, wasn’t — and isn’t — quite in the same league with GWB. With George W. Bush, you ALWAYS knew what you were getting. Even those libbies who hated Bush, could ALWAYS count on a clear target to shoot at.

    In fact, Bush even out-did the Republican hero Ronald Reagan (who certainly was politically conservative but still had an astrologer on the side for advice on various things). You never had to wonder about what GWB really believed after the TV cameras were turned off.

    Those days of sincerity are gone now. Long gone. Now both the Dems and the GOPs (and the Libertarians too) just say whatever the pollsters say that people wanna hear.

    But GWB was a real President. In fact, a real man. Win or Lose, at least HE wasn’t fake.

  • Jack

    Jesus never committed a single act of violence against anyone, whereas your friends — Pol Pot, Mao, Stalin, Che, Fidel, and friends — made genocide into an art form — 150 million dead..

  • “But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.” (Luke 19:27)

    God can’t kill His enemies Himself? Invite others to do it.

  • ” Pol Pot, Mao, Stalin, Che, Fidel, and friends — made genocide into an art form — 150 million dead.”

    Inspired and topped by God’s Great Flood genocide story.

    And don’t leave out the good Catholic Hitler, who mentioned God over thirty times in his Mein Kampf, was responsible for killing millions and was never excommunicated by the Church.

  • Larry

    Creeping liberalism and Carter? He was so liberal from the outset even most Democrats thought he was a bit out of touch.

    GWB touted himself as a fiscal conservative, but knew how to appeal to the religious right (who weren’t going to vote for Gore or Kerry anyway). Nowadays even GWB would be considered a flaming liberal compared to his party since 2008.

    You have it backwards, it was Evangelical Christians who became allergic to Democrats. By 1980 the affliction was terminal. It was the culmination of the “Southern Strategy” began by Nixon of luring the racist ultra-conservative evangelicals away from the Democratic party. It began around the time the Civil Rights Act was passed, and rode the wave of hysteria against desegregation which was strongly supported by most conservative Christian churches at the time (the SBC being the most prominent).

    I liked GWB more than many here. But his successors have gone downhill.

  • Larry

    Actually if you were being an honest person you use Karl Marx for comparison. Like Jesus, Karl Marx never committed a single act of violence against anyone.

    Christopher Hitchens and Richard Dawkins never committed a single act of violence against anyone.

    But you are not an honest person.

    Plenty of people have murdered and committed genocide in the name of Jesus Christ. Plenty of people have murdered and committed genocide in service of their nation and dictators leading them.

  • Larry

    1. The current batch of Randoids like to ignore the fact that she was an atheist.
    2. Being a conservative christian means ignoring cognitive dissonance wherever possible.

    That being said, Separation of Church and State must be hostile to sectarianism and conduct which is sectarian discrimination. It is not hostility to religion. It is hostility to the notion that one religion/faith is favored by government resources. Conservative Christians love to conflate their views as for all religious belief. They get annoyed when people rebuke them for using public resources in favor of their purely sectarian (and blatantly discriminatory) views. But their annoyance doesn’t translate to being correct. The Cranston banner was sectarian and discriminatory in nature. God doesn’t require tax money to support himself.

  • Jack

    Pol Pot and friends were atheists who believed about as much as you do in the biblical Flood account.

    As for Adolf, don’t be ridiculous. If you’d bother to compare the Gnostic doctrines of Nazism with the doctrines of either Catholic or Protestant Christianity, you’d see those of the Nazis were Marcionite, whom the early church deemed heretical. Nazi ideology was a bizarre hodgepodge of eugenics, Social Darwinism, pseudo-scientific racism, the occult, Eastern mysticism, pre-Christian pagan Nordic mythology, and hyper-nationalistic socialism. Had the Nazis been alive in the Middle Ages and spouted this, they’d have been burned at the stake or imprisoned for the rest of their lives in some dungeon. On the three main themes of Christianity — Creation, Fall, and Redemption, Hitler and Nazism diverged completely from anything recognizably Christian. You have to be an ignoramus of Christian doctrine to equate it with the beliefs of Nazism.

  • Jack

    Larry being a (self-appointed) judge of honesty is as fitting as Attila the Hun pleading for pacifism.

  • Jack

    Ron, we could ask a parallel question of you: How do you like your religion-bashing leftist bedfellows?

  • Jack

    Wrong, Larry. Carter was initially distrusted by most Democrats for seeming not to be liberal enough. He ran and won by posing as a moderate who was for “zero-based” budgeting and other centrist-sounding themes.

  • Larry

    I am not the one trying to handwave centuries of bad acts by people who claimed religious inspiration by casting aspersions in another direction. That is all you.

    I find nothing more silly than the “No True Scotsman” arguments Christians use to ignore or excuse how much their churches looooved supporting Fascists and atrocities against religious minorities.

    The Catholic Church was a favorite of several Nazi collaborator groups
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usta%C5%A1e
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rexist_Party

    Church resistance to Hitler was the exception, not the rule.
    http://catholicapologetics.info/apologetics/protestantism/hitler.htm

  • “As for Adolf, don’t be ridiculous.” My thought exactly.

    You promptly then go off on Nazism, Nazi ideology, Middle Ages etc.

    Instead of being ridiculous, I was just adding a serious catholic to your suggested list of evil atheists. Hitler was a Catholic and the Catholic church supported Hitler. Get used to it. Hitler was a Catholic.

    Back to the ‘Flood’. If it didn’t happen, the atheists are correct.
    If it did happen, it was the greatest genocide ever, The animals, plants and children were all innocent. A true genocide by the Christian God. All the evil atheists combined couldn’t match that genocide.

  • Larry

    And yet despite your word salad of excuses, the majority of churches not only supported the Nazis but felt doing so was their duty as Christians. Christian appeals were great for recruiting collaborators to fight in Russia and to man the apparatus of the Holocaust.

    Of course a “True Christian” to a fundamentalist is anyone who agrees with their views verbatim. Even the majority of other sects within the faith don’t meet such criteria. It makes them a poor choice to address such issues.

  • @Jack,

    “Jesus never committed a single act of violence against anyone”

    In the name of Messianism, Jesus was violent in word and in deed:

    Jesus whipped people.
    Jesus made weapons.
    Jesus told people with money to buy swords.
    Jesus prepared for battle.
    Jesus was racist, bigoted and demanded executions.

    “Bring to me my enemies, execute them in front of me” – JESUS (Luke 19:27)

    “whereas your friends — Pol Pot, Mao, Stalin, Che, Fidel, and friends — made genocide into an art form — 150 million dead.

    Wrong again. Those killers were Messianic – not my friends – they are yours!
    The whole problem with religion is the idea that humans can be perfected by force, by conquest, by faith or by inquisitions.

    All of that is religious in nature.
    It can take an explicitly religious form or just another messianic form but it reinforces the point that religion is a man-made ‘cure all’ which cures nothing.

  • @Jack,

    “religion bashing bedfellows”

    You know, it is hard to not bash religion when religion claims Atheism is ‘wrong’ and that morality comes from the man-made, fossilized philosophies which led to Father Josef Tiso, head of the Slovakian Nazi Party or Father Antatole Serromba who personally killed thousands of his fellow Rwandans at the direction of your Lord.

    45 Million were killed in the TaiPing rebellion – Christians on a murderous rampage.

    Religion doesn’t make people behave morally ESPECIALLY WHEN IT IS FOLLOWED AS DIRECTED!

    Our Atheist USA Constitution has managed to keep religious war out of our country since 1865 – and you should be thankful for that!

    America has he longest uninterrupted period of religious peace within one country in the history of mankind – thanks to separation of church and state (an Atheist concept).

    Thank your Atheists for it!

  • @Jack,

    Your claim that Atheism leads to mass murder is empty.
    Furthermore, your claim that those mass murderers were Atheists is also unsupported.
    Furthermore, all the evidence points to religion being the culprit in every case:

    Pol Pot: Theraveda Buddhist with messianic (religious) delusions.
    Hitler: Catholic Jew Hater. 35% of the Waffen SS were confessing Catholics.
    Stalin: Orthodox Christian Seminarian with Czarist (religious) Messianism
    Mao: Agrarian Messianic Cult (religion)

    Furthermore if religion leads to morality:

    What explains the immorality of Father Jozef Tiso – Catholic Priest and Leader of the Slovakian Nazi puppet regime responsible for deaths of hundreds of thousands of Jews among others. Prayed to Christ every day!

    What explains Father Antatole Serromba, following Christ’s lead to slaughter thousands in Rwanda in 1993?

    What explains the Vatican’s support of 2000 known rapists?

    Religion is poison.

    So you are wrong twice.

  • Jimmie Berry

    Dear ramaus,
    Lots of people in the world have used the name of “God” in many ways. To truly know, worship, and follow the living and soon coming God is a different thing. I hope you will read the Bible with as much attention as you seem to have done the writings of Hitler. Each individual decides what they personally will do with the Lord. As the world continues to take the path it is now going, you will quickly begin to see true Christians hated and harmed because of their faith. If you read about the second coming of Christ, you will be surprised to recognize these things as they happen before your eyes. My best regards to you.

  • Doc Anthony

    Ummm…, Pol Pot, Mao, Stalin (and Fidel) were *Messianic* ???

    THAT’s a new claim for sure. No telling what interesting things a person might learn when they visit the good ole RNS forum !!!!!!

  • Doc Anthony,

    “Messianism is the belief that only a savior or redeemer can repair humanity; a human demigod.”
    – Webster’s New International

    Many religions have a messiah concept; jewish Messiah (from which the term and meaning originates),
    the Christian Christ (the Greek translation of the Hebrew), the Muslim Mahdi and Isa (one of the Arabic names for Jesus),
    the Buddhist Maitreya, the Hindu Kalki,
    the Zoroastrian Saoshyant and
    He whom God shall make manifest in Babism (believed to be Bahá’u’lláh by Bahais), Hitler’s Nazism, Stalinist Czarism, Pol Pot’s Ankara and others believe the state of the world is seen as hopelessly flawed beyond normal human powers of correction.
    Messianism is the belief that ONLY intervention through a specially selected, ultimately perfect human DEMI-GOD
    is necessary.

    Messianism is the claim that a perfect demi-god exists and will force humanity into perfection.

    Only the USA has proper protection from this in its…

  • @Jimmie Berry,

    “I hope you will read the Bible with as much attention as you seem to have done the writings of Hitler.”

    Yes.
    Because there are a lot of similarities:

    “Execute them”- JESUS (Luke 19:27)
    “Hate Them” – JESUS (Luke 14:26)
    “Avoid Them” – ROMANS (16:17)
    “Do not associate with the GUILTY..” (1 Corinthians 5:11)
    “Bad company….” (1 Corinthians 15:33)
    “Do not even to eat with such a one.” (1 Corinthians 5:11)
    “Do not receive him…or greet him..” (2 John 1:10)
    “tell him his fault.” (Matthew 18:15)
    “Have nothing to do with him!” (Titus 3:9-11)
    “LET HIM BE REMOVED” (1 Corinthians 1:13)
    “In the name of Jesus..keep away from him!” (2 Thess 3:6)
    “CURSE HIM” – (1 Cor. 16:22)
    “Deem them unworthy” – JESUS (Matt 10:13)

    Humans have rights. Bad ideas have no rights.

  • “the earth didn’t just create itself.”

    How do you know this?

    Nature creates water and snow.
    Fire is only a process of oxidation.
    Tides are created by gravity.
    Molecules are created by atoms.

    How do you know a god did any of this? How do you know it wasn’t 9 gods or 322 gods?
    How do you know it wasn’t a pixie or a fairy?
    How do you KNOW? Who are you to say things which you cannot support?

    The earth is made of molecules which are made of atoms. There is no evidence Zeus is behind any of it!

  • @Greg,

    “How did all of that material come into existence?”

    I don’t know and neither do you!
    Stop claiming you “know” it was a god just because you can’t answer the question. Learn to be truly humble (instead of your phony religious humility) and accept that you don’t know.

    Where is your evidence? Why was one god responsible and not two or ten?
    Who started these gods – other, earlier gods? How far back does it go? Infinity? And what does that answer? And how do you know?

    And why would a god do all this while requiring primitive blood sacrifices from only one species?
    Why would such a god divide supernatural and natural? There is no evidence of any supernatural.

    Where is your evidence for your God?
    If you don’t have any just admit it and give up!

    “I don’t know” is the only answer you can have regarding gods.

  • Fran

    Hi there, Diogenes!

  • Diogenes

    Your reply does not differ marginally from what I stated. Characterizing those under discussion as ‘phonies’ is hardly to the point. I agree that evangelicals are apt to split, and their numbers are insufficient anyway to guarantee election to a conservative. Right now it seems the country is swinging away from conservatism, that doesn’t mean under the right circumstances it couldn’t swing back. Vox populi represents itself frequently in mere fickleness.

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  • Donald

    These are not Jesus’ words to anyone. These are the words of a harsh king in the parable Jesus is telling. He is teaching a spiritual lesson using a worldly scenario. He used many parables, all based in common situations of the time, but having deeper, spiritual lessons. He is talking about how atheists and other non-Christian people do things, not about how Christians do things. There is a clear implication that in the end though the king decides what happens to us. I couldn’t possibly get into all the context and implications in this short post, but it is obvious that this verse has been taken completely out of context and misrepresented intentionally.

  • Donald

    These are not Jesus’ words to anyone. These are the words of a harsh king in the parable Jesus is telling. Jesus is teaching a spiritual lesson using a worldly scenario. Jesus used many parables, all based in common situations of the time, but having deeper, spiritual lessons. Jesus is talking about how atheists and other non-Christian people do things, not about how Christians do things. There is a clear implication that in the end, though, the king decides what happens to us. I couldn’t possibly get into all the context and implications in this short post, but it is obvious that this verse has been taken completely out of context and misrepresented intentionally.

  • Donald,

    “misrepresented intentionally.”

    Absolutely not!
    The Nobleman is Jesus – the entirety of the Parousia rests on Jesus as the Nobleman in the parable of the Minas (Luke 19:20).

    My Catholic school nuns taught me well! Jesus is the Nobleman – and Jesus knows it as he tells the parable!

    “Bring to me those enemies of mine and Execute them in front of me”

    This is a nightmare, not a good way of life.

  • Larry

    Never heard of a “Cult of Personality”?
    Was not their image venerated by the people they governed?
    Were there not giant statues and monuments to them in tribute?

    Dictators of all stripes running from the most devout theocrats to the most anti-theist types liked to have themselves venerated by the people in some appropriation of religious trappings. In North Korea, they even consider their hereditary monarch of a leader to be divine.

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