May 14, 2015

Southern Baptists to open their ranks to missionaries who speak in tongues

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Anita Hensley of Kansas City, Mo., joins in worship at the National Day of Prayer observance on Capitol Hill on Thursday (May 2). RNS photo by Adelle M. Banks

Anita Hensley of Kansas City, Mo., joins in worship at the National Day of Prayer observance on Capitol Hill on Thursday (May 2). RNS photo by Adelle M. Banks

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(RNS) Allowing Southern Baptist missionaries to speak in tongues, or have what some SBC leaders call a “private prayer language,” speaks to the growing strength of Pentecostal churches in Africa, Asia and South America, where Southern Baptists are competing for converts.

  • JR

    This “praying in tongues” is phony, demonic, or fanatical. The one speaking in an unintelligible language needs an interpreter on hand to reveal what was spoken. Why would God act so weird? At the 1st Pentecost, the /Apostles were given the ability to speak and understand known foreign languages in order to spread Christ’s Word.
    A fit of babbling that the speaker doesn’t understand…..but another does is stupid. Why would God speak gibberish, when He has always spoken to man in the vernacular in use?

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  • Jack

    JR, if God the Father can raise Jesus from the dead, He is eminently able to bestow on individuals the ability to speak in tongues, in terms of both known and unknown language.

    While Pentecostals sometimes go too far in claiming that anyone who is baptized in the Spirit must speak in tongues, the Baptists went to the opposite extreme in the 20th century, betraying their roots by denying the existence of a second baptism, along with tongues. Theirs was an overreaction to the excesses of the Azuza Street revival of the early 20th century….and they parted company with earlier Baptists like Moody and Torrey.

    The bottom line is that any Christian movement which completely shuts out the charismatic movement is making a colossal mistake, because every modern revival movement anywhere in the world sprung from charismatic roots. The key is to accept the movement while curbing excesses. It’s a balance that Paul spoke of in his letters.

  • Caleb Teeters

    It is inaccurate to say that tongues cannot be controlled.

  • “In Pentecostal churches it is considered one of many “gifts” of the Holy Spirit, including healing and the ability to prophesies.”

    Terrifying that any modern people would find any of this patently dangerous nonsense remotely believable. Yet 300 Million have been sold this gibberish?
    Just frightening.

  • Larry

    Whatever works for them. Its not the worst idea the SBC ever adopted.

    Its extremely goofy looking but nobody is getting hurt, right?

  • JR

    I disagree that God would use a completely unknown language to communicate, although He certainly could. If someone burst into German or Chinese I would given it even partial credibility, but even then why would He not communicate in the language of those present? If not pure fakery, then Satan could be the source, since he mimics the ways of God…..usually in a mocking, sacriligeous manner.

  • JR

    Why do you care? Your mind is closed to even the remote possibility, yet will prostrate yourself before “Wheels” Hawkins when he asserts that the universe created itself. THAT is so hokey and dumb that I wonder how he is considered credible with any theory.

  • Deborah

    More than 300 million have been sold on the nonsense. It’s been going on since the day of Pentecost (see Acts 2:38) and according to Peter it is for them their children to ALL THAT ARE AFAR OFF. So I don’t see demon or crazy people in there. Also speaking in tongues when you relieve the Holy Ghost and tongue and interpatation are 2 different things. The latter being a gift of the spirit. But if any of you would care to actually open you Bible you could find ALL of this information in there. God used the tongues as the sign of the Holy Ghost because it is the most unruly member of our body. He takes it and makes it speak a language it’s never learned. Who but God can do that?

  • Roger Lewis

    Why would God do something so foolish and allowing his son to be nailed to a cross for the sins of the world?

  • Martin

    Regardless of tongues or no tongues…What I caught from the article was the word, “competition” in relation to the SBC and other denominations efforts to win converts. It’s a poor but realistic fact. So much for unity. Oh well

  • Why do I care?
    1. The discouragement of rational, critical thought.
    2. Vilification of homosexuality, resulting in discrimination, parents disowning their children, murder, and suicide.
    3. Women treated like second-class citizens based on religious teachings.
    4. Children growing up to hate and fear science because it disproves their parents’ religion – leading to appalling scientific illiteracy.
    5. Tens of thousands tortured and killed as witches (which still continues today).
    6. People aren’t making the most of this life because of their belief in an afterlife.
    7. People dying because they believe their faith makes them immune to snake venom, or other lethal aspects of reality.
    8. People dying – and letting their children die – because their religion forbids accepting medical help.
    9. People choked, starved, poisoned, or beaten to death during exorcisms.
    10. Genital mutilation of babies endorsed by religious texts.

    Dangerous nonsense.

  • “I disagree that God would”

    I thought God was supposed to be unknowable. Isn’t it interesting that you know God – and that God happens to think like you?

  • Doc Anthony

    Max, I’m curious about what **evidence** you can provide for your #6 claim there.

    I’ve met people who failed to make the most of their life, I’m sure you have too. But it occurred to me that I’ve never seen, heard of, or even read of a single case — AT ALL, throughout my life — where belief in an afterlife was the **actual cause** of failure to make the most of one’s life.

    If anything, it’s usually quite the opposite — a belief in God and an afterlife tends to motivate people to at least try to better themselves and live with some measure of ethics, even if they previously failed to do so (such as going to jail in their younger years).

    So, what sayest thou?

    PS: Kudos to the Southern Baptists for allowing missionaries who pray in tongues (in line with the New Testament texts) to be part of their teams.

    With conditions in America and overseas deteriorating so quickly, Christians are gonna need ALL the prayers they can send up — and real soon !!

  • Darren

    You sure have your ducks in a row when it comes to critically thinking about your stand against God. Good for you!

    A little while ago, we laid hands and prayed over a deaf baby. That baby couldn’t respond to its own mother. Doctor verified. As we prayed, Good opened its ears and he began to hear. For the first time, he jumped and started at the sounds he was hearing. It was beautiful to watch momma.

    The next day they took him back to the doctor and the doctor verified the miracle. Pretty awesome stuff! God wants to be involved in our lives and allow us to know Him. It’s a mystery!

    What if He healed you? Would you believe? How can I pray for you? What would you ask for?

  • Darren

    God’s first priority never was to make sure that everything He does is approved by “sensible” people! Often times He does things to our thinking in peculiar ways.

    When men plant trees they put them in nice meat rows. But when God plants them their is seemingly no order at all. It’s a forest! And yet, when you take a step back, it’s beautifully ordered!

    So many reject the moving of the Holy Spirit because they can’t understand it with their minds. But God will never be put in boxes made by men.

    There is not one verse in the entire Bible that says the gifts of the Spirit are not for today. We need them now more than ever!

    Yes, there are abuses. But don’t throw the real thing out because some operate in the flesh.

    The Holy Spirit is wonderful. He is good. We can trust Him the same way we can trust the Father and the Son.

    When you ask the Father for the Holy Spirit, He won’t trick you or give you something false. He’s a good Father and gives…

  • So if missionaries can speak in tongues, than no need to spend all that money on language school. Millions of dollars saved and can be used on spreading the gospel right? Nowhere in Gods Word does it talk about the modern day deceitful gibberish that is going on. People need to STUDY Gods Word.

  • Diogenes

    A remarkably mild response. Frankly though, I am of two minds regarding the modern applicability of ‘tongues’ in the modern Church. Still, this particular development strikes me as amusing given the past hostility of the Baptists to anything involving the charismatic movement. It seems we all have room for growth.

  • Todd B

    How is this a news service? This article gets almost NONE of the facts right.

  • JR

    Always worried about the little things.

  • Patrick Elliott

    So we change our Theology because we are “competing” with Pentecostal Churches???

    Give me a break!

    We shouldn’t be in competition with other Denominations, we should just be preaching the gospel and teaching (discipling) believers with the Word. Period!

  • Larry

    Darren, do I have to bombard you with links to the numerous stories of children who were killed by their parents because they trusted faith healing over real medicine?

    Because those stories are well documented and come from reliable sources that people would consider credible.

  • Carol

    Thanks sir/mam for a direct reply to above statement. Once one experiences the full impact of the Holy Spirit, and learns what Paul was talking about, keeping order, and not inflicting “man’s” standards on folks that cannot be backed up by the word when studied out properly in original context, one cannot deny any of the “Bible days” experiences happening today. I too grew up Baptist and one day went on a sincere looking for HIM and within a short time, discovered tongues ( tho not what it takes to get to heaven is a reality ), healing of various degrees both in me, friends and family where even doctors documented things as miracles and told me so. When God revealed himself to ME… all those signs were shown out to be as much for today as back then and many will miss it because in their true self they deny the power of God and thus God himself and won’t have the real spirit to get them out of here when the time comes and its soon to be here.

  • @Doc,

    “what **evidence** you can provide for your #6 claim there.”

    The claims of Armageddon, for example.
    Because religion insists on an insanity that the world must end according to a Divine plan the majority of humanity is shirking its responsibility of sustaining the earth, controlling pesticide use, making plans for the future.

    The entire Climate Change denial community is faith-based. It is profoundly irresponsible behavior and a morbidly catastrophic policy.

  • @Darren,

    I don’t understand your desire for this god who can repair hearing. If he exists – according to your own beliefs – he would be the destroyer of hearing as well.

    Besides, I saw what you did there.
    You said “we laid hands…” making yourself quite important in channelling and directing the Yahweh spirits in this magical seance you performed. I hope you didn’t mean to be so solipsistic and vain to suggest your own powers initiated this cure.

    “Deaf baby” – Without a doctor to confirm it, I simply don’t believe your story.

    Thanking God for saving a child from a tornado is like sending a love note to a serial killer for not killing your child.

    Please do not pray for me. Gods appear to be not only imaginary constructions, but extensions of one’s vanity – I don’t want to contribute to solipsism. We must have more empathy for humanity than that.

  • Pastor Daniel

    AMEN! I am reminded, of Christ’s sermon on the mount. The people asked Jesus in a sense, “How do we know you were not sent by Satan” Jesus responded by saying a Kingdom divided against itself cannot stand… How can Satan cast out Satan. The outpouring of the Holy Ghost we are seeing in this days is foretold. Again people need to read Acts 2. It shall come to pass in the last days that God will pour His Spirit out, and they shall prophecy. Also in the Book of Acts it is mentioned . In Acts 10:45 The Jews thought they were the only ones who receive the Holy Ghost. But non-Jews received the gift too. How did they know (verse 46: For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God….) no interpreter was mentioned AT ALL! they were praising God in tongues…. it’s a prayer language. I’m thankful to be Pentecostal. People need to have faith. The promise is for everyone.

  • it is not of the devil , you can not have the two living in the same body ,some just don’t understand the lauguage of speaking to straight to god ,

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  • Larry

    Being neither Southern Baptist, nor Pentacostal, I feel nothing about the friendly rivalry between the two groups. They are being civil about it. Nobody is being harmed by the practice. One expects a degree of goofiness in religious rites. Speaking in tongues being more ridiculous than most. No big deal.

    My hostility is to the nexus point where religion and the political meet. What goes on inside a church is none of my concern as long as nobody is getting hurt. What happens outside is everyone’s concern.

  • Larry

    Please elaborate. What did the article get wrong specifically?

    Not challenging your statement, just want more details out of curiosity.

  • Shannon

    Sounds like a lot of faith in experience to me. There are many religions, some not even Christian, that have adherents who speak in ecstatic utterances and flail about uncontrollably. That is not the fruit of the Spirit according to Scripture.

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  • Ben in oakland

    There are all kinds of things that Baptists shouldn’t be doing, including attacking other people for their alleged sins (judge not), mixing politics with religion (render unto Caesar), claiming to know the relationship of God with any other person on the planet (Whited sepulchers), claiming to know the relationship of God with any other person on the planet (Whited sepulchers), enjoying bacon and shrimp but condemning other alleged abominations (you know where that’s going), getting divorced for any reason other then adultery, and a host of other things.

    But there you have it.

  • Doc Anthony

    I dunno about all that, Max. I’ve met lots of unemployed folks but I haven’t met a single one who cited Armageddon as the reason why they aren’t employed.

    “Yo dude, I’m just chillin’ out till the End O’ The World gets here.” Nope, not a single unemployed man of ANY theistic belief system has ever told me such a thing.

    They usually want to better themselves, and if they choose to stay in a mess, they usually invoke Alcohol & Drugs, **not** Armageddon, as their reason.

  • Yo Dawg

    @Max,

    You are hilarious. You spend all of your time sniping Christianity but you don’t even know what your own atheist prophets and philosophers say lol. Your whole list is a joke. If you were a consistent Atheist, you wouldn’t care about any of things on your list because you would realize that they’re all pointless without an ultimate cause. Women treated like second class citizens? Tell me what ultimate cosmic principle in materialistic Darwinism says this is wrong? I mean Darwin himself said women and blacks were less evolved than white men! Didn’t you know? You keep attacking Christianity because you thinks its some how less moral, but you have no basis for your own morality at all.

  • Chad

    JR, if you don’t believe that when God baptizes us with the Holy Spirit then I suggest you study the Word of God my friend. I at first had a hard time believing in tongues when I first started attending church. Then when I was praying in my room, the Holy Spirit came upon me and I started speaking in tongues. I provided some scriptures for you to read.

    “I did not know Him, but He who sent me to baptize with water said to me, ‘Upon whom you see the Spirit descending, and remaining on Him, this is He who baptizes with the Holy Spirit.’” – John 1:33

    “For he who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God, for no one understands him; however, in the spirit he speaks mysteries.” – 2 Corinthians 14:2

    “And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues; they will take up serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover.” -…

  • natacha

    Attn: JR-God has given us Christians the special gift of Tongues so that the devil doesn’t know what we’re saying. Tongues is the only language that the devil does not understand.

  • natacha

    God gave us Christians the gift of Tongues so that the devil doesn’t know what we’re saying. Tongues is the only language that the devil doesn’t understand.

  • Chad

    Because Christ laid down His life for us paying the price for our sins and God having raised Him up on the third day, bridging the gap between God and Man Because God so love us that He sent Christ to die for us, through Christ we can now have a relationship and know God personally. However it does not mean God thinks the way we think. In fact, mans wisdom is foolishness to God. God’s ways are higher than our ways, His thoughts, higher than our thoughts. The problem is when men try to put God in a box and make Him like corruptible man, It’s blasphemous.

  • natacha

    John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son That whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

  • Larry

    Because Atheism is the lack of belief. It requires no underlying philosophy or adherence to a given belief. It is simply the lack of belief. A negative assertion. An atheist philosopher such as David Hume, may be accepted by atheists, but there is no necessity to do so.

    It is not like a Christian and the words of Jesus & Apostles. One can take or leave them without changing the nature of the belief (lack thereof).

    “Materialistic darwinism” is just gobbledygook for ultimartely saying that reality makes your head hurt, so you retreat to superstition.

    Criticizing Darwin is as much an attack on the idea of Evolution as effective as comments on the Wright Brothers are to the idea of powered flight. The world has gone so far past those initial stages that any such criticism is woefully out of touch.

  • Kirk

    As a Pentecostal / Assembly of God. I grew going to just about every denomination. There’s many similarities between Baptist and Pentecostal. I pray we’re less concerned about who converts the most but to do like the angels in heaven do. They rejoice every time someone comes to know Christ. Baptist need to hold hands with the Pentecostals and lets do our best to save the world.

    To the ones that don’t believe in the Holy Ghost with the evidence of speaking in tongues neither do the ones getting saved in China and other parts. They’re just wanting all God has for them. Like someone else said, you can’t find in the Bible anywhere that it says that it’s not for today’s Christian.

    To our Atheist friend, I really don’t think you can be so concerned about what Christians are depriving themselves of. My personal thoughts are that you’re a once born again Christian that got hurt and left the church and Satan in you keeps digging at you to try and convert whoever you…

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  • @Doc and Paolo,

    You want Evidence?! From ME?
    Clearly the irony is on overload today.

    You both have apparently forgotten the erstwhile commentor FRAN who literally rejects the Government of the USA and does not vote as she implores everyone to repent, repent, repent.

    She (and millions like her) do not participate in our society. They are convinced nothing matters: not pollution, not carbon, not global warming, not oceanic acidification – not even the spread of nuclear weapons! Because God will save her through Armageddon as she will be swept up to safety in heaven!

    The profound immorality of Armageddon and its death worship is only matched by the preachers who yammer this nonsense from pulpits!

  • @Yo Dawg,

    “You keep attacking Christianity because you thinks its some how less moral, but you have no basis for your own morality at all.”

    Morality is not from religion.
    It comes from the same place you get your fingers and your toes!
    Evolution!

    I say burning your daughter alive is immoral.
    Where do I get this concept from? Do I get it from God? Absolutely NOT!

    GOD SAYS FATHERS MUST BURN DAUGHTERS TO DEATH AS HONOR KILLINGS.

    “And the daughter…if she profane herself by playing the whore, she profaneth her father: she shall be burnt with fire.” (Leviticus 21:9)

    Isn’t pride a sin? Isn’t killing a sin?
    Nope. Both are demands of god.

    There is no morality in religion except the morality evolved humans impose on it – Christians throw out most of the Bible because humans are born to be disgusted at its contents.

  • @Pastor Daniel,

    “The outpouring of the Holy Ghost we are seeing in this days is foretold.”

    The number of people who were absolutely certain
    they would witness the coming of Jesus:

    2 Billion Dead People.

    The number of people who were absolutely certain they would see the return of the hidden Imam:

    1 Billion Dead People.

    The number of people who lived to see God do anything which could be measure by anyone by any method:

    ZERO

    I hope you are not really a Pastor. Your preachments are counterproductive.

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  • j
  • natacha,

    “Tongues is the only language the devil does not understand”

    Good. Then I’m not alone.

  • E. Hearn

    1 Corinthians chapter 14 v.39

  • The statement “Speaking in tongues is an ancient Christian practice recorded in the New Testament in which people pray in a language they do not know, understand or control. The practice died out until Pentecostalism emerged around the turn of the 20th century,” is not consistent with the historical record. This interpretation started in the 1830s. It cannot be traced any earlier. See the Gift of Tongues Project, whose goals is to identify, collate, digitize, and trace the evolution of the Christian dogma of tongues from inception until 1906. For more info see: bit.ly/1dkCcKg I would recommend rewriting the above statement so that it would reflect a more accurate history of this dogma.

  • Robryan777

    I don’t see the sense in debating religion with an atheists… In most cases they know the Bible, they just choose to argue with anyone who believes!!! I just Pray when you call on God, and you will, IT’S NOT TO LATE!!! GOD BLESS

  • Walter The Surfer

    Mr. Atheist Max – God is certainly knowable… through Jesus Christ and Him alone. But you wouldn’t know anything about that, would you? 😉

  • Albert

    You need to read acts 19. This is years after the day of Pentecost and they were speaking the same language and understanding each other until the Holy Ghost entered them in 19:6. This is why God allows speaking in tounges. It is a sign that someone has recieved the Holy Ghost.

  • G6

    JR I am 61 years old and was saved in and raised in the southern baptist denomination and know what you have been told and taught as I was taught the same things about the gifts of the Spirit, and as see from your statement that most of it is in error. I used to believe the way you do also.

    The apostle Paul began his discourse on the gifts of the Spirit with this statement :

    Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I do not want you to be ignorant: (‭I Corinthians‬ ‭12‬:‭1‬ NKJV)

    And ended his discourse on the gifts with this statement :

    If anyone thinks himself to be a prophet or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things which I write to you are the commandments of the Lord.

    But if anyone is ignorant, let him be ignorant.

    Therefore, brethren, desire earnestly to prophesy, and do not forbid to speak with tongues.

    Let all things be done decently and in order. (‭I Corinthians‬ ‭14‬:‭37-40‬ NKJV)

    Everything in the middle is instruction, I urge you to…

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  • Tanya

    the New Testament lists tongues as a GIFT from God. Even tho it may be considered the least desirable, God does not give bad gifts. So therefore enough said. No one has the right to tell God otherwise.

  • CMR

    “Tongues.” The miraculous gift of tongues attended the outpouring of God’s spirit at Pentecost, 33 C.E. The approximately 120 disciples assembled in an upper room (possibly near the temple) were thereby enabled to speak about “the magnificent things of God” in the native tongues of the Jews and proselytes who had come to Jerusalem from faraway places for the observance of the festival. This fulfillment of Joel’s prophecy proved that God was using the new Christian congregation and no longer the Jewish congregation. In order to receive the free gift of the holy spirit, the Jews and proselytes had to repent and be baptized in Jesus’ name.—Ac 1:13-15; 2:1-47. These “tongues” were actual languages understood by those present. Acts 2:6 – each one heard them speaking in his own language. The gift of tongues proved very helpful to first-century Christians in preaching to those who spoke other languages. It was actually a sign to unbelievers. 1Cor.13:8 says tongues will cease. 1Cor.14:1-19.

  • Huddy

    Atheist Max…You got us wrong. Those people you are calling religious are not Christians regardless of what you or they may think. Real Christians do not kill their babies, but I dare say some atheists do in the guise of convenience (abortion). We are not like “Fran” either. Many people think they are Christians, but will hear God tell them to depart from Him, that He never knew them. They got it wrong just as you have. To be a true Christian one must have a proper relationship with the creator of the universe through faith in His Son Jesus Christ. After that, we are to live like atheists would expect us to, exemplary lives. Those you have identified are not among the ones I am speaking of. Real Christians love their neighbors and do good to them. Try not to hate us, we are not your enemy. We offer hope for a world in trouble. Seek out some true Christians, they will change your mind about us. Don’t let snake handlers, baby killers, abortionists & etc. define Christians. Wake up…

  • Babylon’s Dread

    Few things are more dangerous than caricaturing a group of people in order to nullify them. Your overstated and misinformed critique renders it mute.

  • Todd Benkert

    1. Paragraph 3 I nothing even close to a Baptist understanding of tongues or PPL
    2. The policy change has nothing to do with Pentecostalism in Asia and South America and there is nothing in the article that supports that assertion (other than an outside expert making that assertion). The idea that Southern Baptists are being left behind evangelistically is both not true and has no link to the decision making process of IMB trustees.
    3. The original ban on PPL was not put in place as “a way to distinguish the denomination from others” but as a (unfortunate) way of assuring that all missionaries we appoint were Baptist and not something else.
    4. The article describes Southern Baptists as having previously been cessationist, but the SBC has never (in its doctrinal statements or resolutions) excluded those who held a continuationist view. There is no official stance on the issue. The IMB policy is not about widening membership but about allowing all its members to serve.

  • Todd Benkert

    5. Leonard’s remarks about our need for new constituencies are not substantive nor germane to the trustee decision.
    6. The whole thing is cast as if we HAD to do this to stay afloat, when the SBC constituency has been calling for this reversal since the policies were enacted in the first place. The debate is an internal one about what it means to be Baptist and participate in Baptist missions and has nothing to do with keeping up with the Joneses.
    7. The final paragraph about Baptism is also not true – the policy allowed baptism from some other denominations, but not all.

    This is drive-by, click-bait reporting that did not research the issue nor include the stated reasoning of the very persons who made the decisions.

  • Earold D Gunter

    Huddy, The arrogance you exhibit is a trait all religious people do. Each think the way they understand their religion is THE only way. Ironic that absolutely none of you can prove any of it. Faith is at the root of your beliefs. Faith serves to blind one to reality, and to accept the improbable and impossible as truth.

    As a former Pentecostal I have witnessed people speaking in tongues. In this sect it is used as evidence to everyone else in the sect that the person is “right with god”, which means you are living a holy life. If you don’t, then elders of the church approach you to ask how you are not. This social pressure drives people to fake this, and it is obvious by listening to them as they repeat the same gibberish time and again.

    It is simply a social tool developed to control behavior in a group, nothing more.

  • miesha

    Praise the lord I want to give some biblical truth about speaking in tongues it is a gift from god a conformation that your sins are forgivien are you are fill with the holy spirit this gift is for all men

    Acts 2:2
    1when the Day of Pentecost had fully come they were all with one accord in one place.
    2and suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind and it filled the whole house where they were sitting .
    3Then there appeared to them divided tongues as of fire and one sat upon each of them .
    4and they were all filled were all filled with the holy spirit and begin to speak with OTHER TONGUES as the SPIRIT gave them utterance.

    Acts 2:38
    Then peter said to them Repent and let every one of you be baptize in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins and you shall receive the gift of the HOLY SPIRIT.
    For the promise is to you and you children and to all who are afar off as many as the lord our god will call.

    I pray this was able to help…

  • John Berry

    That is true, you can quench the Holy Spirit in you by choosing not to allow Him to speak in tongues or pray in the Spirit, “building yourself up in the Holy Spirit.” Just like you can act unkind or choose to go ahead and sin when He is telling you not to. There are sins of commission and there are sins of omission.

  • John Berry

    JR, interpretation that you are speaking about is only needed when tongues are spoken in a public setting and the need for an interpreter is absolutely Biblical. Sometimes the one who speaks the tongue is also the interpreter.

    Praying in the Spirit is a personal matter, between you and God and therefore interpretation is not needed. Not even for yourself, your soul(your mind, will & emotions). But your spirit understands and is edified, strengthened and built up in faith. Please do the Biblical verse research.

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  • Jimmy

    You thought that GOD unknowable…the scriptures teach that sHe is knowable through Christ. It seems you have a cultural knowledge of Christianity yet you’re here arguing Biblical practice and theology. I grew up Pentecostal. As a 20 year old man in all night prayer meeting I began to speak in tongues, kneeling in a corner of the church. When I was finished praying, a man from West Africa approached me. He told me I was speaking in his native dialect. Amazed, I asked him what he heard me say. He told me that I was praising GOD. He gave me a couple of phrases. Of course, there are fake Christians. There are fake tongues. There can be no fakes without the Authentic.

  • Gary Woods

    I’m sorry that you believe that. It is a real experience, and there is a God. It doesn’t make sense, but it is true!

  • Believer Wayne

    Atheists are a small minority in this nation—less than two percent of the population—yet such secularists have been involved in removing Christian symbols from public places and getting Christ out of Christmas. In recent years they have also become very aggressive in trying to convert people to their anti-God religion—yes, it is a religion. They have faith (actually it is a blind faith as there is no evidence consistent with it) that the universe and all life can be explained by natural processes.

    In essence atheists worship themselves—they are their own gods. These fallible, finite people make absolute statements about their belief in naturalism and that naturalism was the cause of the universe and life. They determine their own morality—their own supposed purpose and meaning. Atheists believe that when they die, they cease to exist! And they want to convert everyone to their religion. They want to make their own rules. And this is why they are so intolerant of Christians. Their…

  • Nick Catrow

    I personally oppose this action by the Executive Committee. I guess we need a change of committee members . Reading many of the positive responses shows me that there are many, many people who support this action due to their emotions, not Biblical reasons. There are only a couple of responses that are Biblical in nature and look to Acts, not I Corinthians. The book of Acts defines what Speaking in Tongues is: Testifying Christ to a lost world and speaking in the languages of the hearers, not babbling, or speaking in a language the Devil cannot understand, or a personal prayer language. I think this action is not supported by the majority of SBC churches and think we are going to lose churches and missions money because of this misguided action.

  • Misty Nichols

    Then I suppose the Apotles, the followers of Christ, the Disciples were demonic and phony. Anyone who claims that speaking in tongues is demonic and phony clearly has never had the infilling of the Holy Ghost. All throughout the New Testament after the initial outpouring on the Day of Pentecost in the book of Acts, speaking in tongues has been the initial sign of being filled with the Holy Ghost. You can refuse it, but your eternity depends on it.

  • Gary Owen

    Hi J.R.

    I encourage you to study the book of Acts to at least through first part of Chapter 19 and 1 Corinthians chapters 12 -13-14. Paul, in the bible explains well the importance of the “private” spiritual language and the other spiritual language where it is to be interpreted.

    God has downloaded to me more than a few books. Two of them are, The Study of the Spiritual Language – – Other Tongues; the second one has the same title, except it is Part Two. Pastor Jack Hayford has a book titled: “The Beauty of the Spiritual Language” which is very enlightening. He has been respected as a fine man of God for many years. I will post, where you can click onto lower left corner of announcement, and view all the ebooks on Amazon KDP Kindle, that God inspired me to write. My goal in writing is to always write God’s words and never mine. They are priced very reasonable; Please, don’t let that cause you to under estimate their value and truth

    Jesuslovesyou.drgary@gmail.com

  • Gary Owen

    amazon.com/author/garyowen-spiritualbooks-drgary

    Highlight and left click “Go to Amazon – – – – – – – – –

    Thanks and God Bless!

    Dr. Gary

  • Gary Owen

    Hi Atheist Max!

    History proves the bible to be the awesome word of Almighty God. I challenge you to prove it wrong. There have been other Atheists that have taken the challenge and proved the bible correct and have received Jesus the Christ as their Savior!

    God’s Blessings on you and yours!

    Dr. Gary

  • bryan kidder

    the speaker only needs an interpreter if doing so in an assembly. read your bible. secondly its nowhere near demonic its IN THE BIBLE for crying out loud. Having been raised in a Baptist church and then as an adult experiencing the baptism of the Holy Spirit as also described in scripture I spoke in an unknown language. while I don’t know the exact words I know it was a shout of praise and joy for the revelation of the fullness of Gods presence. If you would actually read what the Bible says its for the edification of the believer. Also it talks in romans about how we do not always know what to pray and how the spirit intercedes. I think anyone who calls themselves a Christian and scoffs at what scripture describes as a gift from God needs to humble themselves because it is obvious to anyone who has received this gift that they are the phony ones.

  • Larry

    Shilling your own work here is a major faux pas.

  • Wayne, anyone who rails against secularism is really saying they oppose the idea of religious freedom. Secularism is at the heart of our free exercise clause and its compliment, the separation of church and state.

    Secularism is primarily an idea BORNE OF RELIGION. Chiefly those faiths and sects which are not political majorities and frequently subject to sectarian discrimination. The idea that government can’t show favoritism if it is to protect religious belief. Of course Wayne, you would rather have your faith favored in public, hence your attacks on secularism.

    “In essence atheists worship themselves”

    I find that is far more true of fundamentalists. They consider themselves the only authority of their faith. They carry delusions that they are the only one’s whose religious belief must be taken seriously. They are the ones who unilaterally declare one group, “not really of the faith” when dealing with disagreement. In reality you don’t know squat about atheism.

  • @Todd Benkert

    That was a pretty comprehensive list. Thank you.

  • James

    1Cor. 14:
    2 For he that speaketh in an [unknown] tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth [him]; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.
    Apearantly there are special times in prayer when”tongues” are not to be interpreted but ONLY God Needs to understand.
    Why?
    Verse 4 says this is to edify the one speaking in tongues ones own self.

    Verses 28-19
    Paul continued to speak in tongues even more than all the Corinthan Church and encouraged others to do the same. Only while teaching others in the congregation did he command them to speak so that all hearing could understand.
    It seems quite straight forward.

  • Mary Ann

    Maybe reading some of Kenneth Hagin’s books on The Gifts of the Spirit. God give us all gifts.
    Don’t you want yours.
    God uses the foolish things to confound the wise. You can’t understand it in you head…Don’t try…It’s a heart thing.
    Wouldn’t it be great to speak with God about things you know not and the devil doesn’t understand. The enemy is so nosey…
    PRAYING YOU WILL ASK AND RECEIVE ~

  • James

    13:1 Though I speak with the tongues of MEN and of ANGELS, and have not charity, I am become [as] sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
    This established not all tongues could possibly be understood by man for they are tongues Angels.

  • Mary Ann

    You can only come to the Father thru His Son, Jesus.
    Until you have believed God sent his only Son to die for YOU and your SINS . Died and was buried and arose on the 3rd day, the Holy Spirit you never have to be concerned about receiving. It doesn’t happen that way
    Food for thought~

  • Robert Jones

    JR,
    While I understand your concerns. You should look carefully into church history first.

    Here are a few names of those who spoke in tongues from the past. Many of them are well known:

    D. L. Moody, John Wesley, Martin Luther, John Knox, Howard Carter…just to name a few.

  • Robert Jones

    My friend,
    You are troubled by a church’s decision to consider experiencing this “Baptism in the Holy Spirit”. Yet you express yourself an ardent atheist. Why does this trouble you??

    After all if this of man’s design to find some comfort in this world before experiencing the sleep of death. What difference does it make? If we all die and nothing we believed here matters? Nor is there any form of eternal judgment because there is not a Judge. Then why does it matter??

    I will tell you why it troubled you. It is because God’s Spirit is dealing with you, even now. If it is not real then what are you afraid of?

    I have known many atheists who have recanted this belief upon examining the real evidence themselves. I was once strongly anti-Christian. I felt they were naive, fearful, and close minded. I too fought against this “ignorance movement” until I took up the challenge to look into the writings and the writers.

    Read about Caesars, Pliny the Younger, Josephus and…

  • Robert Jones

    Nick,
    You say look to Acts for your understanding, but is that not a partial view. If I could only reference one scripture or one book to explain a theological view that would be absurd. Wouldn’t men like John Calvin and John Wesley call that a contemptible statement.

    Luke wrote of Paul’s travels in Acts. Paul’s letter to the Corinthians are the writings of a pastor strengthening his churches with theological truths embraced by the first century Church. He wrote dealing with an issue. The issue was not “Is this God?”. The issue was “How are these gifts supposed to function in the church?”

    Paul explains tongues can sound ridiculous, like speaking in the air (1Cor. 14:9) it is unfruitful to the mind without interpretation (14:6-14) it is equal to a prophetic message when interpreted (14:22-25) He states, “He speaks with tongues more than others” then adds, “I would rather speak 5 words with my understanding, than 10,000 in tongues.
    Concludes- Do not be children in…

  • Robert Jones

    Nick,
    In addition to what I said above, 1Corinthians and Acts is not the only place tongues are mentioned in the New Testament writings. Also, in the writings of those taught directly by the Apostles and those they taught.

    Furthermore, Here are a few in more recent history after the Canon was sealed.

    Martin Luther, John Wesley, D. L. Moody, John Knox (Scotland) , Howard Carter.

    Reverend R. Boyd of the Baptist Faith spoke of D. L. Moody. He said this:

    “When I got the Young Mens Christian Association (Victoria Hall, London), I found the meeting on fire. The young men were speaking in tongues and prophesying. What on earth did it mean? Only that Moody had been addressing them that morning.

  • Scott

    Wonder if they are doing this because of a fundamental change in beliefs or just because their denomination has been severely dwindling over the last several years and they cant get enough people to fill positions, which is what it sounded like to me.
    .

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  • Jenelle

    This compromise is indicative of a manmade organization going further apostate. Why should they worry that they cannot “compete” and get the same numbers of people? Filthy lucre is the answer and infiltration by the “mother church.”

  • Fmr Cath

    @Max,
    That God is “unknowable” is a Catholic teaching and many others may also say things like it. They are taught that God is a mystery, that he is unknowable, or that he is cruel. The Bible actually says God wants us to know him. See Romans 1:19-20. At Isaiah 41:8, God calls Abraham his “friend”. How could he be a friend if he is “unknowable”? Just because YOU don’t know Him doesn’t mean he is not known by many.
    PS. “Fran” doesn’t vote because she knows this system is as doomed as the Titanic. Just because it looks solid and unsinkable doesn’t mean it’s so. She also isn’t among those who think they will be “swept to heaven” during Armageddon but she believes there will be survivors. People who respect God also respect his earth and we do our utmost to be mindful of the earth and it’s biology and ecology. We are trusting that we “know” God & He knows those who belong to Him…

  • “why would He not communicate in the language of those present? ”

    God is a practical joker? 🙂

  • Steve

    Just curious Diogenes, what exactly are your two minds on the subject? I am seeking a third position between “Yes my tongues and other gifts are real and you’re wrong if you don’t agree” and “your tongues and gifts are wrong and i don’t agree”. I think the issue is deeper and more significant than how black and white it appears.

  • Jon gibson

    JR, here is the thing, the battle is always over tongues, but how many people in that denomination embrace ANY gifts of the Spirit? Baptists as a whole, (some exceptions apply) dont prophesy, work any miracles, have any discernment, or do anything else that was promised to us. Paul said the kingdom was not of mans words, but of Power! Jesus died for you to have access to these gifts. He said, those that follow me will speak in new tongues. Glossolalia. Paul was an apostle, but not an original desciple, everywhere He went he asked, have you received the Holy Ghost since you believed? Furthermore why are you limiting what an unlimited God can do when it doesn’t make sense to you? God isn’t limited by our understanding, or maybe in your case He is.

  • No problem 🙂

  • @Gary Owen,

    “History proves the bible to be the awesome word of Almighty God.”

    1. Nonsense. The Bible is a contradictory ancient bauble.
    2. There appears to be no Almighty God.
    3. If God is Almighty I have no interest in him and neither should you.
    4. How does Almighty God kill people with tornadoes yet it is considered ‘God’s blessing’ when people survive tornadoes.
    5. If prayer worked, the Bible belt would not be known as ‘Tornado Alley’

    Time for everyone to grow up. Religions are silly nonsense.

  • @Robert Jones,

    “Why does this trouble you??”

    I am not the least bit troubled. I only find it distracting that so many adults profess their gullibility and refuse to examine the consequences of their gullibility.

    God exists?
    I doubt it. And I’m thrilled it appears to be nonsense.

    “Bring to me those enemies of mine – Execute them in front of me.” – JESUS (Luke 19:27)

    Good grief! These are not good things to say. This garbage is from the primitive, barbaric parable of the Minas which your pastor simply won’t teach in Sunday school.

    I’m delighted to be a non-believer.
    I’m free to be nice and I shun nobody.

  • @Huddy,

    “They got it wrong…”

    No.
    Don’t you read the Parable of the Minas? Don’t you know that Jesus was clear he intends executions when he returns as the Nobleman does?

    “Bring to me those enemies of mine and execute them in front of me” – JESUS (Luke 19:27)

    This is not harmless! This is not good. This is not benign.
    There are consequences to believing these childish old books are actually real – they are not real.

    http://Www.Godisimaginary.com

  • Talking donkeys and a flat earth are also mentioned in the Bible – they are just as imaginary as this business about talking in tongues.

    Silly old nonsense.

  • Larry

    On a semi-related note, the Showtime supernatural thriller series, “Penny Dreadful” just started a new season where one of the main elements involves witches speaking in their own version of “tongues”. They call it “Verbis Diablo”, language of the devil.

    Its treated akin from “weirding talk” used in Dune. Hearing the language allows the speaker to control the listener.

    I sincerely doubt the producers are going to get a lot of flak from Pentecostals on this. Few of them would probably watch the show due to the rampant gore and sexual situations that straddle orientation freely.

  • God needs to get us out of running the show with our intellects. HE wants to be in charge you know, imagine that. Tongues helps facilitate Him taking charge of a service or just a life. We have a tendency, just a bit, lol, to control the planet, services etc. He wants to take over folks. The devil is trying, don’t you think it is time God is allowed free rein, after all, He is King. If we don’t let Him take over in the country and in other countries no power Christianity will not get people saved and the demonic hordes will take over. Without letting Jesus do what He does when He shows up, which is miracles, casting out devils, healings, words of wisdom, etc, He won’t even really be at the Church at all. If you think He is there just because you are gathered in His name, but you won’t let Him TAKE OVER, you are more deceived that the people you are trying to save. Gathered in His Name means letting Him run the show. Otherwise you are gathering in your righteousness’ name,…

  • Barry

    Now if both denominations would except the fact that the teaching of tithing came from Joseph smith and was never part of the church during the first 1800 years of Christendom we would be in complete agreement !

  • Jack

    JR, we all need to be careful not to condemn immediately something we disagree with as coming from Satan. That’s risky terrain, because if we’re wrong and the thing is of God, we’ve just conflated God’s work with that of Satan.

    The better way is caution on both ends…..avoiding easy belief in any religious experience as automatically coming from God but also avoiding easy belief that anything that’s strange or beyond our comfort zone is automatically evil.

  • Jack

    Shannon, you’re correct about the fruit of the Spirit — it includes such things as joy, peace, love, self-control, etc. That’s the real evidence of the Spirit at work. But on the other hand, it doesn’t negate that there are also gifts of the Spirit. Unlike fruit, gifts can be counterfeited….but you can’t have a counterfeit without a prior thing that’s genuine. So the fact that gifts can be counterfeited hardly destroys the notion that gifts are real…rather, it’s a proof that they are. Again, a counterfeit means there’s something genuine preceding the counterfeit.

  • Jack

    Good points, Carol. The basic rule of scripture is that if something is in it, it’s presumed to be relevant for today until it can be shown to be otherwise. If miraculous gifts were operating in the first century, the burden of proof rests squarely on the shoulders of those saying that they are no longer for today.

  • Jack

    How is it “dangerous,” Max?

    For once, think before you answer that question.

  • Jack

    Robert, I didn’t realize they all spoke in tongues, but if you’re right, that’s quite telling. While some people obsess about tongues and make it into a be-all and end-all, far too many others are quick to condemn any and all such speaking. Caution and openness are what’s called for here.

  • Jack

    Larry, you’re assuming that if people believe God can and does heal, they automatically will stop going to any doctors. That’s typical of your absolutist, black-and-white thinking.

    But more to the point, you dodged Darren’s challenge.

  • Jack

    Wrong, Larry. The flip side to atheism is strict naturalism, the quite definitive idea or belief that all of reality is contained within nature or matter.

  • Jack

    1. On the contrary, time and again, disciplines ranging from history to archeology have pointed strongly to the veracity of Scripture.

    2. There appears to be wishful thinking on your part that there is no God.

    3. If God is Almighty, all else pales by comparison. But you knew that already.

    4. If Max closes his eyes to the sun, is the sun magically erased?

    5. Speaking of the admonishment to “grow up,” it is childish to believe that prayer is about getting God to protect you from all the bumps in life’s roads.

  • ArguablyAbby

    This is why people have no interest in Christianity or Church. Instead of coming together on common ground and reaching more people with the love and compassion of Christ, we decide to tear down and “ban” certain believers. Shame on you, Southern Baptist Associations, for trying to disqualify someone from ministering just from your own opinions and interpretations of the bible.

  • Jack

    In other words, anything that contradicts Max’s belief that there’s no God must be false and anyone who testifies to such things must not be telling the truth.

    In other words, Max’s mind is shut as tightly as a drum….in his case, his atheism is based on emotion and not reason.

  • Jack

    Max, occasionally you’ll post something that has some relation to reality or facts but this apparently is not such an occasion.

  • Jack

    Well, Barda, if we “study God’s Word,” we will see that tongues are prominently and positively featured in the Book of Acts, which speaks of the church’s earliest years, and also in Paul’s letters, which urge that their excesses be curbed, not that the phenomenon should be quenched completely.

  • JR

    Rubbish….tongues would always mean words understandable, not something otherworldly that cannot be deciphered. Did Jesus not speak Aramaic?

  • Jack

    Max, there are “consequences” for any and all beliefs, including your own.

    Just ask the 150 million victims of godless totalitarianism.

    Wait — you can’t……they’re dead.

  • JR

    God communicates privately with whomever He chooses, as the list of Catholic Mystics can attest to. BUT, His communication is clearly understood by the chosen person or else how would the message be meaningful.For a person to burst out speaking a message in a nonexistent language, how does it mean anything?

  • JR

    I believe you are fooled by your interpretation of Scripture. And who are you to determine what Satan can do, or not? He’s far more clever and malovent than we can imagine, and imitating God is his greatest deceit.

  • @Jack,

    You falsely claim:

    1. Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot were examples of Atheist regimes.
    2. Atheism leads to mass murder.
    3. Religion guarantees morality.

    I have proven over and over again you are completely wrong on all counts:

    1. Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, etc., were Messianic Agrarian Proletariat Cults. which claimed supernatural powers and enforced rigid dogma – That is not Atheism. It is religion.

    2. Religion has NEVER lead to peaceful societies, but it ALONE has led to mass murder.

    3. You live in the legally ATHEISTIC USA; still the ONLY Atheistic Constitution in the world – it forbids Messiahs and that is what keeps the peace!
    (“Congress shall make no law establishing a religion…!”)

    Wherever you have belief in Messiahs you have religion, dogmatic misery and the abandonment of reason!

  • @ArguablyAbby,

    “Instead of coming together….with the love and compassion of Christ, we decide to tear down and “ban” certain believers.”

    Because shunning and hating
    is exactly the Christian way! And it always was!

    “DO NOT ASSOCIATE WITH ANYONE…IF HE IS GUILTY..”
    (1 Corinthians 5:11)

    “Do not be deceived: “Bad company ruins good morals.” (1 Corinthians 15:33)

    “But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one.” (1 Corinthians 5:11)

    “If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house or give him any greeting” (2 John 1:10)

    “Avoid Them” (Romans 16:17)

    Hard to see how a Good Christian can call himself Christian
    without acting in a hateful way toward a whole bunch of people!

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  • @Jack,

    “history to archeology have pointed strongly to the veracity of Scripture…”
    What is true in the bible (I’m not calling it ‘scripture’)
    the talking donkeys or the zombies?

    “There appears to be wishful thinking on your part that there is no God.”
    One must have evidence of something before one can wish it away.
    Did you wish Allah away?

    “If God is Almighty, all else pales by comparison”
    If he is almighty he is the one sending the tornado which kills people.
    You cannot simultaneously say you are blessed to survive. That is like sending a thank you note to a serial killer for not killing your daughter – it is disgusting.

    “If Max closes his eyes to the sun, is the sun magically erased?”
    I can see the sun. I see no gods.

    “it is childish to believe that prayer is about getting God to protect you from all the bumps in life’s roads.”
    Doesn’t matter what you ask for. It won’t work anyway.

  • @Jack,

    How is it NOT dangerous, Jack?
    For once, think before you answer.

  • @Jack,

    “strict naturalism..”

    🙂 LOL! 🙂
    All you did was put a nasty word in front of naturalism to make it sound bad.

    Meanwhile, I guess you believe in “Strict Godism” which I guess means all the gods who were ever claimed to exist must somehow still exist and be very powerful – yet all the same god?
    LOL!

    Every religion is man made. There has never been any sign of any divinity doing anything at any time. If any religion is true it has entirely escaped the ability to stand out from the rest!
    Please pursue comedy. You are good at it.

  • @Babylon’s dread,

    “caricaturing a group of people”

    I assume you are talking to me?
    Gods don’t appear to exist – neither does Sasquatch.
    If I say “believers of sasquatch’ are mistaken” that is not to caricature anyone – it is to point out they are mistaken.

    If you don’t have evidence for any god – but keep insisting one exists – you are either lying or you have deluded yourself. It is that simple.

  • Joel

    Despite what anyone “feels” about this charismatic issue, the first thing to consider is what Scripture has to say about it. When the SBC first acted against this charismatic trait I was, honestly, taken aback. Not because I claim to speak in tongues or have a private prayer language. None of these have ever happened to me, and I pray I would handle them as prescribed by Paul in 1 Corinthians should a moment of tongues ever come over me.
    With that said, I fully understand the SBC stance as I am a pastor within the SBC. However, I was taken aback by the SBC action because it was clear to me that the SBC was acting against God’s word. The very last thing spoken in Scripture about tongues was done so by Paul, writing under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. He plainly said in 1 Corinthians 14:39; “Therefore, brethren, desire earnestly to prophesy, and DO NOT FORBID TO SPEAK WITH TONGUES.” (NKJV)
    This is either God speaking through Paul, or not. If He is, then the SBC acted against…

  • Joel

    Despite what anyone “feels” about this charismatic issue, the first thing to consider is what Scripture has to say about it. I fully understand the SBC stance as I am a pastor within the SBC. However, I was taken aback by the SBC action because it was clear to me that the SBC was acting against God’s word. The very last thing spoken in Scripture about tongues was done so by Paul, writing under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. He plainly said in 1 Corinthians 14:39; “Therefore, brethren, desire earnestly to prophesy, and DO NOT FORBID TO SPEAK WITH TONGUES.” (NKJV)
    This is either God speaking through Paul, or not. Finally, to those who would say that speaking in tongues is of Satan – be very careful, because the unpardonable sin is also found in Scripture. It is attributing the work of God to Satan. What I recommend to my SBC brothers and sisters is this, step back and take a breath. Allow for God to be in something you do not understand.

  • JERRY

    You are absolutely correct. When the bible speaks about tongues it is referring to the many different languages the people on this earth spoke then. It is demonic and complete jiberish . I have been to Baptist, Holy Rollers (Assembly of God) Born Again Christians, and they all speak this crap and then roll around on the floor like a bunch of idiots. COMPLETE HOG WASH !!

  • The Southern Baptist Conventions shields and protects its ministers who are child molesters. Any other stupid thing they do pales in comparison to that abomination

  • JERRY

    I AGREE !! IF THIS IS THE HOLY SPIRIT , THEN WHY IS IT ONLY CERTAIN RELIGION’S DO IT.

    WHAT ARE THEY SAYING , THE OTHER RELIGION’S HAVE NO HOLY SPIRIT IN THEM ? THIS IS NONSENSE !!
    JUST THE BAPTIST’S, HOLY ROLLERS ( ASSEMBLY OF GOD ) BORN AGAIN,ECT ?

    COMPLETE HOG WASH !

  • ArguablyAbby

    Hey Max,
    From what I can tell, Those scriptures are just suggestions to keep yourself from compromising your own lifestyle. I’m not in any way a theologian, but that’s what I can best make sense of. In Acts the bible talks of believers gathered together an united in one place, in one accord, with and by the Holy Spirit(Ch 2) . And that’s what I was basing my response on.
    I agree that there are a lot of Christians that act hatefully and in ways that are not right. That’s not how I would like Jesus to be represented.

  • V.

    If our ability to understand something is the standard, then why did Jesus use parables, the meaning of which are still discussed and argued about today? Why didn’t he just say directly what the parable meant? Why did the disciples routinely misunderstand his meaning (example: Mark 6:52)? I don’t see anything in scripture that indicates that Jesus’ resurrection permanently corrected human understanding. Seems like misunderstandings continued to occur on a routine basis (hence the existence of Paul’s letters). So, I would be careful of using human understanding as a yardstick for determining whether something is from God.

  • I am not excluding what the book of Acts says. It does teach us about tongues in the early church. I am just asking why missionaries go to language school then??

  • Spot on. Numerous holes in the article.

  • Jack

    Sorry, Misty, but I have to disagree here.

    While people in the Book of Acts who were baptized in the Spirit did speak in tongues, it does not follow logically that if you don’t speak in tongues, you are not baptized in the Spirit. That is a logical leap that is unwarranted based on the text.

    In fact, I believe it’s in one of his letters to the Corinthians that Paul asks a rhetorical question, “Do all speak in tongues?” The presumed answer is “no,” given its rhetorical nature. And the context, if I recall, is gifts of the Spirit.

    But worse, to say that one’s “eternity depends on” any of this is flatly unbiblical. The Gospel message is to repent and believe in Christ, period. Yes, there is a second baptism, but when you repent and believe, you have the Spirit.

  • Jack

    No, Max, I refuted your silly contention that atheism requires no underlying philosophy.

    Of course it does. By its very definition, it embraces naturalism, the idea that all of reality is contained within nature.

  • Jack

    Max asks “what is true in the Bible?”

    Well, let’s see…..names, dates, places:

    The kinds of mundane assertions that are verifiable or falsifiable have been corroborated routinely and repeatedly, thus suggesting a penchant for accuracy on the part of the writers.

    A person reading your mountains of spam would never have guessed that.

    Hence the mountains of spam….

  • Jack

    You’re saying something is dangerous, Max.

    Prove it.

  • Jack

    For the same reason that Christians become doctors….not because they don’t believe in miraculous healings, but because the norm is that the body heals itself with the strategic and often-crucial intervention of medical professionals.

  • Jack

    I don’t mind debating with atheists at all. Often it takes patience….as many lack the mental discipline to stay on topic and not constantly change subjects the way some TV watchers channel-surf. To avoid the predictable blizzard of non sequiturs, what’s needed is to keep bringing them back to the topic, so the conversation doesn’t end up meandering aimlessly.

  • Jack

    Max, they were all atheists.

    Their governments were atheistic.

    And they killed people — oh, did they kill people.

    Lots and lots and lots and lots of them.

    More than any other regimes in the history of the planet.

    Or to put it mathematically:

    Godless totalitarian regimes’ mass murders = Inquisition deaths x 10,000.

    We’re talking about unprecedented genocide….nothing like it in all of history.

    150 million, Max. Bigger than the entire population of most countries.

    Out goes God, in comes godless totalitarian tyranny, and look out, humanity!

    Your friends made Attila the Hun look like Barney the Dinosaur.

  • Jack

    Max, if all Christians did was shun people, there would be even fewer of them than there are atheists.

    The Gospel would’ve gone nowhere.

    There wouldn’t be 2 billion people in the world saying they are Christians.

    Anti-social religions obviously don’t attract legions of converts.

  • Jack

    If there is anything to what you are saying, jeriwho, you have a duty to report it to the police.

    If not, then you need to take a good look at why you’re saying what you just said.

  • Jack

    Interesting examples, Max: “talking donkeys and a flat earth.”

    If the Bible said that the earth was literally flat, that would be a problem since it’s not.

    If the Bible said donkeys naturally talk, that, too, would be a problem since they can’t.

    But the Bible doesn’t declare the earth is literally flat…..any more than one who speaks of “the four corners of the world.”

    To describe what one sees isn’t to say it’s ultimate reality. You don’t even have to think scientifically to understand that. People who believe in God differentiate between seen and unseen. And when the Romans said “across the world,” they meant across their Empire, not countries beyond it, even though they knew such countries existed.

    Nor does the Bible say donkeys naturally talk. It says that for one moment, God enabled it. The whole premise behind that miracle was that donkeys don’t talk. A miracle is by definition something that nature doesn’t do on its own.

  • @Jack,

    “if all Christians did was shun people, there would be even fewer of them than there are atheists.”

    Christians tried to shun all the Jews in WW2. Half of Hitler’s SS were confessing Catholics.
    Christians tried to shun all the Tutsis in Rwanda. Priests and Nuns killed 800,000 innocent people.
    Christians tried to shun all the non-Christians in Tai Ping. 45 Million died.

    Atheists don’t believe in god. We don’t shun anyone. We have no reason to do so.

    As for the number of Atheists? Hard to say – most of them still go to church every Sunday. The pews (and many pulpits) are full of them.

    Admitting ‘faith is necessary’ is a coward’s way of saying he is an Atheist.

  • @ArguablyAbby,

    “Those scriptures are just suggestions…”
    Sorry. That is not honest.

    “In Acts the bible talks of believers gathered together an united in one place, in one accord, with and by the Holy Spirit(Ch 2) . And that’s what I was basing my response on.”
    If the Bible gives two different messages, it isn’t fair to lie that it is one consistent message. It isn’t. The Bible was written by countless mysterious people – it is clearly made up of legends. One would expect a work of fiction composed by hundreds of people to be very contradictory as the Bible is.

    “I agree that there are a lot of Christians that act hatefully and in ways that are not right.”
    Which is why the Bible is dangerous. It dictates hateful behavior.

    “That’s not how I would like Jesus to be represented.”
    I don’t blame you. But you have built up a sweet Jesus which is taught from pulpits – not the rather nasty one written about in the Bible legends.

  • @Jack,

    “the four corners of the world.”
    The bible is plain wrong. There are no four corners of any kind. The compass was invented in China in 200 BC – long after the Old Testament was written. Directions were not divided into ‘fours’ as in North, South, etc.. until well after the Bible was written. (good grief!)

    “they meant across their Empire, not countries beyond it…”
    The writers of the Bible knew nothing. And it shows.

    “Nor does the Bible say donkeys naturally talk. It says that for one moment, God enabled it.”
    So you say. But since donkeys *cannot* talk, there is no reason to believe this claim would be possible ever.

    “A miracle is by definition something that nature doesn’t do on its own.”
    And a pot of gold at the end of a rainbow is by definition unnatural, also.
    Since miracles exist only in stories, there is no reason
    to think they ever really happened.

  • Shawnie5

    “Directions were not divided into ‘fours’ as in North, South, etc.. until well after the Bible was written. (good grief!)”

    However…”People will come from east and west and north and south, and will take their places at the feast in the kingdom of God.” Luke 13:29.

    And you “taught Sunday school,” Max? Good grief!

  • Shawnie5

    “Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, etc., were Messianic Agrarian Proletariat Cults. which claimed supernatural powers and enforced rigid dogma – That is not Atheism. It is religion.”

    They claimed no supernatural powers and did not believe themselves to be messiahs, and what you call “enforced rigid dogma” was simply a different perspective which prioritized the interests of the state over the interests of the individual — not your “dogma” of course but just as valid as yours from a purely materialist perspective. You’re never going to be rid of your embarrassing cousins, Max, because you are not qualified to set the checklist of qualifications for “atheism” beyond the plain meaning of the word.

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  • Jack

    Max, when I say “the four corners of the world,” I am speaking metaphorically, not literally or scientifically. And to cite another example, when the Bible says the trees of the fields will clap their hands, only a veritable dunce would take it literally and respond by saying trees don’t clap.

    As for donkeys not naturally being capable of speech, again, that’s the whole point about miracles. In order to be called miracles, they have to be something that nature can’t produce on its own. And the only way to rule out miracles is to rule out either the existence of God, or His ability or willingness to act upon nature and bring about a result we call a miracle.

    Since you can’t prove your atheism, but can only assert it as something you believe to be the case, you can’t disprove miracles. And since you can’t disprove miracles, you can’t say that God, if He exists, can’t make a donkey speak.

    But again, nice try.

  • Jack

    Max, you’re dodging again.

    Again, if the essence or core of Christianity were shunning people, how did it attract 2 billion people who either are Christians or who wish to associate themselves with Christianity?

    A world-shunning religion is not going to attract people. It’s common sense.

  • Jack

    Actually, Nick, speaking for myself, I don’t base my own belief in tongues on anything other than what Scripture says. I am by nature disinclined to rely on experience or emotion of any kind as a marker of truth. I believe in tongues because if something is in the Bible, the burden is always on us to show how it is no longer relevant for today. The default position is that it is for today until proven otherwise.

    But on a deeper level, I’m very concerned that the same attitude that can’t abide tongues can often make people deaf, dumb, and blind to spiritual things that are a lot less controversial. Sound doctrine is essential, but the life of faith is more than belief in right doctrine. It is a necessary but insufficient condition for a life of faith. It’s the roadmap, but people actually need to travel on the roads or it’s worthless.

  • Jack

    It seems quite straightforward because, in fact, it is.

    Words have meaning and should be treated accordingly.

  • Jack

    Of course. Paul was very sensitive to abuse and misuse of tongues, to people obsessed with that gift, but ironically, in his attempts to correct their error, he revealed to his readers his belief that tongues, known and unknown, are themselves legitimately from God and of the Spirit.

  • Jack

    All of the great revivals of our time have come from a charismatic-oriented base….not because there’s anything magical about charismatics, but because the kinds of people who are most open to moves of the Spirit tend to gravitate to the charismatic movement. In many instances, they were driven away by the hyper-fundamentalism that began in the early 20th century as a reaction to the rising apostasy of mainline denominations on the one hand and to the excesses of the Azuza Street revival on the other.

  • Larry

    Untrue. Kim Il Sung and progeny all claim supernatural powers to defeat the decadent west. He is the culmination of the CULT of personality.

    Supernatural appeals, spiritual appeals, use of dogma and even theological language are all part of their shtick. Religious belief was the model which they built their regimes on.

    As for body counts, The Taiping Rebellion, began by quasi-Christian fanatics had a body count not exceeded until World War One (21 Million). 30 Years War (a strictly sectarian conflict between Catholicism and Protestantism) killed more than 8 million people. That is just two OBSCURE conflicts well before the 20th Century. Religious mayhem has a much longer backlog than commies.

    Disputing the well worn chestnut of Communist = atheist with Jack and Shawnie is a waste of time. They love their weaselwording, equivocating and phony revisionist apologia. Whatever is brought in response will be ignored.

    Just blather rinse and repeat.

  • brandy

    If god always speaks clearly why did he use parables when living here in the flesh as Jesus?

  • @Jack,

    I’d say the killing of 6 million Jews and 800,000 Rwandans
    was a heck of a lot of shunning.

    Christianity (like all religion) appeals to our natural solipsism and selfishness – the idea that all of this universe is made just for us.

    Christianity appeals to our natural racism – the idea that others need to be adapted or destroyed to purify our culture.

    Christianity also appeals to our fear of death – it tells us death isn’t real. A lie.

    Christianity worst of all appeals to our desire to be irresponsible – to surrender our fate and our responsibilities to King in the Sky (or on earth) who will solve all our problems for us in return for a little fee.

    These are the despicable hooks which make religion self-righteous, murderously dangerous, cowardly and irresponsible.

    Religion is sugar water for the conscience.
    Zero nutrition and bad for people.

    But you have every right to it – just like smoking and drinking.
    Use with extreme…

  • @Jack,

    “since you can’t prove your atheism…”

    What?
    I don’t believe in Mermaids. You think I must prove that I don’t believe in them? What nonsense is this?

    I’m not claiming a god does not exist! I’m responding to the claim with disbelief!

    Prove what? Do you believe in sasquatch? if not how do you prove your disbelief – you are ridiculous.

    I don’t believe a god exists. I think you are making it up and lying to me that a god is out there which you only claim to know about.

  • @Jack, @Shawnie:

    “Godless totalitarian regimes…”

    There never was one.

    Stalinist Messianism is a religion with supernatural powers of Lysenko’s ‘miracles’.
    Pol Pot Messianism, Hitlerian Messianism, Hirohito, Mussolini Messianism is all religion.
    North Korea’s dear leader is the most religious regime on earth today.

    Cults of personhood are also religion.

    Halo float over Stalin’s Icons and statues in Russian Orthodox churches today – None of that is Atheism.

    None of these totalitarian regimes were godless.
    The only way to make a totalitarian regime is with religion.

    Putin is doing it all over again, cloaking himself as the Czar (a religious position) and dictating to the churches.

    Religion kills – not atheism.

  • Shawnie5

    @Max: Why do you keep lying about Lysenko’s “miracles?” Nothing “miraculous” was ever claimed about Lysenko’s ideas. It was simply pseudo-science that Stalin was convinced presented some solutions for Soviet agriculture. And he did not put the halos in the churches — beleaguered Orthodox believers did that in weary gratitude for his easing up on his persecution of the church during the war. Persistently making such easily refuted claims makes your case look even more pathetic than it actually is.

    Pol Pot, though clearly an atheist, had some background in Buddhism early in his life — much like your Catholic background. I guess we can continue to count you among the faithful?

    I have no idea what Hirohito or Hitler have to do with this as nobody has claimed that they were atheists–although they may have been and Mussolini certainly was. And one demented little Korean in power in Asia removes not one particle from your compadres’ track record elsewhere.

  • Shawnie5

    @Larry: You need to find out more about the Taiping Rebellion instead of simply taking Max’s word for it — as Max is prone to dishonesty and is not very well-read. Most of the death toll of the Taiping Rebellion was due to famine and disease, and the brutal Manchu rulers were responsible for much of the remainder. You also might want to think about which of the Taiping goals you oppose — women’s equality, abolition of polygamy and foot-binding, redistribution of land and economic equality, universal literacy…? Because although the movement was led by a false Christ most of the people who joined it likely had no idea what he did or didn’t believe; they just wanted to be free of Manchu oppression.

  • Shawnie5

    Oh, and Larry, gotta love your consistency in your projection…one can hardly imagine a more colorful demonstration of “weaselwording, equivocation and revisionism” than nonbelievers in God claiming that other nonbelievers in God are not really nonbelievers in God. You’d do far better to own up to your camp’s embarrassments, because this kind of tomfoolery simply keeps others from…y’know, “taking you seriously.” LOL!

  • @Shawnie,

    “Pol Pot, though clearly an atheist, had some background in Buddhism early in his life — much like your Catholic background. I guess we can continue to count you among the faithful?”

    Good grief.
    I’m not Messianic! I do not enforce any dogma. There is very likely no perfect life, nor perfect philosophy nor universal truth to be had on earth or anywhere else. I have no interest in doctrinaire answers to life’s problems.

    I don’t believe in God but I do not dogmatically say that Gods are impossible. Nor do I desire the abolishment of religion.

    The closest I get to dogma is my adherence to this:
    “Congress shall make no law establishing a religion, nor limit the free exercise thereof.” – US Constitution

    I would defend to the death your right to believe and preach your religion freely.
    But only if you similarly defend my right to abandon and discourage religion freely.

    That is not POL POT.

  • Jack,

    “Max’s mind is closed tight as a drum”

    Nonsense!
    My position is SPECTACULARLY VULNERABLE!

    SHOW ME the evidence that what you say is true!!!

    Where is your God? Where is the evidence that speaking in tongues is a real divine thing!? Where is the evidence which shows this isn’t just a bunch of fanatical crackpots?

  • @Jack,

    “No, Max, I refuted your silly contention that atheism requires no underlying philosophy.”

    Nonsense.
    Atheism is the lack of belief that a god exists –

    ATHEISM DOESN’T RULE OUT GOD’S EXISTENCE!!

    NOR DOES IT RULE OUT PIXIES OR FAIRIES!
    ATHEISM DOESN’T RULE OUT ANYTHING!!!
    JUST SHOW ME THE EVIDENCE FOR YOUR GOD!
    OR ELSE, I REMAIN FREE TO THINK IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN SASQUATCH OR KINGKONG OR QUANTUM JUMPING JACKS!

    “Of course it does. By its very definition, it embraces naturalism, the idea that all of reality is contained within nature.”

    No. Atheism doesn’t embrace ‘naturalism’ (whatever that means!)
    I simply don’t make any claims without evidence! Which God created the universe? How many gods were there? Did the earth form from a giant galactic water bug?
    I DON’T KNOW, JACK!! AND NEITHER DO YOU!

    Apparently you cannot grasp the absurdity of your wild – absolutist – claim that GOD. DID. IT!

    Where is this god of yours…

  • 9/11 was a religious act.
    As was the invasion of Iraq by Christian Crusading dingbats named Dick Cheney and George Bush.

    If you don’t see dangers in such garbage, nobody can help you.

  • Hi JR,

    I grew up in a church that taught little to nothing about the Biblical subject of speaking in tongues. I studied this for myself and found Biblical Benefits to speaking in tongues 1) 1 Cor 14:4 “He who speaks in a tongue edifies himself…” NKJV. Tongues is a way for a Christian to build himself up spiritually. 2) It is a way to speak to God 1 Cor 14:2 “he who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God NKJV. 3) Tongues is a way that God will speak to you. 1 Cor 14:21 “With men of other tongues and other lips I will speak to this people; NKJV. These are some of my favorite reasons to speak in tongues. I will challenge you to study the Bible on this subject. It is a large part of what brought the power of God in the early church and it is a large part of what still brings that same power in our day. God has not changed and neither has this wonderful gift!

    In Christ

    Mark

    http://www.markostromministries.org/downloads2.html The Benefit of…

  • Dr George fredericks

    Good point

  • Carol L Suderno

    I totally agree, there have been abuses in the past, and maybe even now; but this is real. God is working in the hearts and lives of pentecostal people. It is not demonic. Many are being healed, both physically and Spiritually. The love they have is flowing out to other’s who have witnessed Jesus at work in the lives of those who are Pentecostal. It is obvious that ‘they’ have been with Jesus.

  • ArguablyAbby

    Like I said, I’m not a bible scholar. But I do think the bible has, what can be viewed as, inconsistencies due solely to the fact that it has been misinterpreted and not read in its entirety.

    Jesus was never nasty in the bible. People who poorly represent him are nasty. And people who misuse his name to justify their own dumb actions are nasty. I know Jesus is not all butterflies and rainbows. He has anger, he felt pain, but never was he nasty. I’m sorry if that’s how he has been taught or introduced to you. But that’s not the man I read about.

  • Steve

    Speaking in tongues in worship and spiritual messaging is not just a singular purpose or expereince, JR. It wasn’t in teh New Testament and it isn’t today. The Aposltles who wrote of it as the Holy Spirit moved upon them to write, were clear in their expositions on the matter. Not every use of tongues is the same. There is a tongue (or language if you prefer that word) that one might use in private prayer and worship, in a time and place in which the person is caught up in such spiritual connection in realtion to God that the very spirit of the man or woman cries out to God in a language known by God, even if not known to another person in the room. That is a personal moment. There is also the use of tongues (or language) that is used to edify the church or other beleivers, genreally followed by an interpretation by another person that received it in the language of those that are about, thus fulfilling the Paul’s commendation to avoid confusion.

  • @Arguably,

    “Jesus was never nasty in the bible.”

    Wrong. Jesus was despicable:

    “I have come to bring FIRE…such constraints! I am impatient to bring NOT PEACE BUT DIVISION.” – Jesus (Luke 12:49-51)

    “Hate your parents…hate your life, or you are not worthy” – Jesus (Luke 14:26)
    “Eat of my body” and “Be baptized and believe” or “Be condemned to Hell” – Jesus (John 6:53-54) (Mark 16:16).
    “I shall kill her children with Death” – Jesus (REV. 2:23)
    “…if they are unworthy..REMOVE your blessing of peace.” – JESUS (Matt 10:13)
    “And why do you break the command of God
    for the sake of your tradition? …. ‘Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.’ ” (Matthew 15:3)

    “..bring to me those enemies of mine who would not have me as their King, and execute them in front of me.” – JESUS (Luke 19:27)

    Jesus directs people to do evil things.

  • Stephanie

    Well said Mark!

  • Prayer for the person not believing in God or His providence is more effective than debate and putting down others for what they believe. God has given total freedom to believe Him or not believe Him or His providence. Building long lasting genuine relationships and respecting others for what they believe and do makes both to understand one another and chose what they want to continue to believe. Bible thumping never worked, it only intimidates people into pleasing you. God is love and patient, caring and providing,healing and delivering and hears our earnest prayers and faith which HE rewards with eternal friends. Understanding, is needed knowledge and wisdom, which God gives to the believer and non believer. When we have promises like God hears our prayers, when it is his will, and when we unite and fast and pray? Why do wee debate and make fools of ourselves? Ii Peter 3:9; Luke 8:4-8, John 4:38,, John 15:16, Psalm 1:1-3; Micah 6:8, Revelation 3:20, Hebrews 11:6, Revelation 22:12.

  • @samuel peters,

    “Execute them in front of me.” – JESUS (Luke 19:27)

    I do not find Jesus to be a worthy character.

  • You have to believe in the supernatural to understand. If 3 million charismatic/Pentecostals speak in other tongues and find it helpful for their prayer in the Spirit, there must be something to it. It is scriptural you know. Search if out for yourself and ask Jesus to to give you this editifying gift. It will deepen your faith.

  • @Delores Tabor,

    “If 3 million charismatic/Pentecostals speak in other tongues and find it helpful for their prayer in the Spirit, there must be something to it.”

    Wow – 5 million people believed in Osiris in Egypt for 5000 years – so Osiris must be true!

    Wow – 6 million vikings believed in Thor for 3000 years – so God Thor must be true!

    Wow – 1 Billion Muslims believe in Allah – so ALLAH must be true!

    There has to be something there!
    I can’t just be all superstition and hogwash.

    Or it is all lazy brained, superstitious nonsense.

  • Nathan

    The baptism of the Holy Ghost with the evidence of speaking in tongues is not phony, demonic, or weird. It’s Biblical and wonderful at the same time. What a great combination! I was filled with the Holy Ghost for the first time when I was 10 years old and that was 35 years ago. Everybody thinks I’m crazy, but nobody for a moment thinks I am phony, demonic, or weird. I can’t understand why anybody would not want to receive the baptism of the Holy Ghost.

  • Ron

    You are mistaken. The phrase “unknown tongue” used by the Apostle Paul would refute that. He said when he speaks in an unknown tongue his understanding is un-fruitful. And the person who prayed in an unknown tongue speaks no to men but to God.

  • Ron

    If its Demonic, do you have the gift of casting out Devils?

  • Ron

    If your statement is true now, wouldn’t it have also been true for the early church? Paul spoke with tongues that he said he didn’t understand but God did. why would God do this in the first century? Your logic is flawed.

  • onetruth

    The only clear characteristics in Scripture of speaking in tongues are that it is a spiritual gift, not of highest value, given only to some, that is self-edifying, and very prone to abuse.

    Part of a “second blessing” called the Baptism of the Holy Spirit? No. Jesus says His baptism (as opposed to John the Baptist’s) IS a baptism of the Spirit – for all who believe, not an experience possible after the rebirth of salvation. (Baptism pictures rebirth). Scripture confirms this: Cor. 12:13, Eph. 4:4-6, Rom. 6:3-4, Gal. 3:26-28, etc.

    Always present when someone is filled with the Holy Spirit? No. There are more references to people being filled with the Holy Spirit without a mention of tongues, than there are with any mention of tongues occurring (there are only 3 instances anyway)

    Tongues always present at salvation? No. There are far too many recorded salvations in Scripture (people thus inhabited and sealed by the Holy Spirit) and no mention of tongues is almost ever…

  • onetruth

    …Let’s get rid of the “always” and stop trying to make it more than it is (as Paul tried so very eloquently to do in 1 Cor. 12-14) and maybe there will be more acceptance and civil discussion about it.

  • Steve

    If Southern Baptist Church is not baptized in the Holy Spirit or (speaking in tongues). That it means they don’t have power to Evangelize? Why the church is growing in numbers then?

  • Scott

    You’re obviously void of Biblical understanding. Read the book of Acts 10:44-48; Acts 19:1-6. Read I Cor. 14:2,4,39. It is for the edifying of himself (I Cor. 14:4). Calling speaking in tongues “demonic” is bordering on Blasphemy of the Holy Ghost if not being that. If you would do your research, you would see that most of the famous preachers of the 19th and 20th century spoke in tongues – Moody, Graham, Wesley, etc. Look it up. They must’ve been “demonic” I guess.

  • Robin

    Please be VERY careful, that is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. Read Hebrews Chapter 10, and also Jesus taught as recorded in Matthew that saying a word against the Holy Spirit is unforgiveable. It is the Holy Spirit speaking to God through God’s servant the Christian.

  • JD

    Part of the answer to your question may be Found in Mark 16:17. Same Greek word as used in 1 Corinthians 14 and Acts 2. We love Mark 16:15, but oft times overlook the verses after it written in red as well. I love provoking articles like this, because it pushes us out of our comfort zones and we see things that were right in front of us, but we’re veiled to us before. We need power to be witnesses just as the apostles did. If tongues are phony, demonic and fanatical, then why are we still doing Mark 16:15?

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  • Eric Pena

    Guess you might as well scribble out Mark 16:17, Acts 2:4, Acts 10:6.

  • Eric Pena

    Acts 10:46, Acts 19:6

  • Tiffany

    Speaking in tongues is real. I went to a pentacostal church here for the first time and was speaking in Vietnamese without ever even learning a single word in Vietnamese. I am a white girl from Wisconsin and only studied Spanish and if I could have chosen a language would have chosen German. God gave me Vietnamese. My mouth was moving so fast and it was very articulate. I found out later it was Vietnamese because I searched a couple words I was saying a lot and in English they mean hi, father, daddy, Yahweh and Jesus, and forgiven. I went to a nail salon and said some words to a lady doing my nails and she told me I said ugly as one of the words. I don’t know if I was calling her ugly or me, or satan. All I know is to get this gift I was seeking him passionately and DESPERATELY and said Lord I Lay down my body for you and I give my life to you. I love you more than anything in this world and I repent for ever hurting you and disobeying you. I empty my cup Lord so please…