August 19, 2015

LGBT groups criticize decision to eject them from church near World Meeting event

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The Catholic gay rights group New Ways Ministry criticized the decision by the Philadelphia Archdiocese to cancel the organization’s workshop on gender identity, which was due to take place during Pope Francis’ visit to the World Meeting of Families. Photograph taken on February 18, 2015 when New Ways Ministry's pilgrimage was given VIP seats to a papal audience in St. Peter's square. Photo courtesy of New Ways Ministry

The Catholic gay rights group New Ways Ministry criticized the decision by the Philadelphia Archdiocese to cancel the organization’s workshop on gender identity, which was due to take place during Pope Francis’ visit to the World Meeting of Families. Photograph taken on February 18, 2015 when New Ways Ministry's pilgrimage was given VIP seats to a papal audience in St. Peter's square. Photo courtesy of New Ways Ministry

(RNS) The Catholic gay rights group New Ways Ministry is criticizing a decision by the Philadelphia Archdiocese not to let a local parish host a workshop on gender identity that would have coincided with Pope Francis’ visit to the World Meeting of Families.

“How are LGBT people supposed to feel welcome in the Catholic Church when church officials will not allow them to speak?” asked Francis DeBernardo, executive director at New Ways Ministry, one of the organizers of the workshop.

“No speakers at the World Meeting will address the topic of gender identity, yet this is an issue that is being faced by more and more Catholic families and communities in the U.S.” DeBernardo said in a statement.


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The “Transforming Love: Exploring Gender Identity from Catholic Perspectives” workshop was to take place Sept. 26 at Philadelphia’s St. John the Evangelist Catholic Church parish center. But those plans were canceled after Archbishop Charles Chaput intervened, New Ways Ministry said in an online statement. The Philadelphia Inquirer reported that the organizers are looking into relocating the workshop to Arch Street United Methodist Church, which is near the city’s Convention Center.

The workshop would have coincided with Pope Francis’ highly anticipated visit to Philadelphia on Sept. 26-27.

U.S. ambassador to the Holy See, Kenneth F. Hackett, said the World Families was not a venue for LGBT groups. Photo courtesy of U.S. Embassy to the Holy See of Ambassador Kenneth F. Hackett

Kenneth F. Hackett, U.S. ambassador to the Holy See, said the World Meeting of Families was not a venue for LGBT groups. Photo courtesy of U.S. Embassy to the Holy See Ambassador Kenneth F. Hackett

Speaking before the New Ways Ministry announcement, Kenneth F. Hackett, U.S. ambassador to the Holy See, said he did not believe LGBT issues would be discussed at the World Meeting of Families.

“Why would they want to come anyway if they’re opposed to Catholic views on the family?” he said.

The ambassador explained that while the World Families gathering would not change attitudes toward same-sex couples, there would be an openness to people “in different circumstances,” such as women who have left violent relationships.

“There may be people protesting on LGBT rights or gay marriage equality, but that’s their right in our country so we respect that,” Hackett said.

Earlier this year, Chaput made it clear that he was opposed to welcoming LGBT organizations to the World Meeting. “We don’t want to provide a platform at the meeting for people to lobby for positions contrary to the life of the church,” he told journalists in Rome.

Archbishop Charles J. Chaput, O.F.M., Cap. during the Festival of Families announcement at the Pontifical North American College in Rome on June 23, 2015. Photo courtesy of Chris Warde-Jones, Archdiocese of Philadelphia

Archbishop Charles J. Chaput during the Festival of Families announcement at the Pontifical North American College in Rome on June 23, 2015. Photo courtesy of Chris Warde-Jones, Archdiocese of Philadelphia

“People who have experienced same-sex attraction” could attend the congress, he said, but gay families would not be up for discussion.


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DeBernardo said the workshop would have centered on transgender and intersex people talking about their personal and faith journeys, along with a family member, and would not have discussed the theology of gender identity.

YS/MG END SCAMMELL

 

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  • Sister Geraldine Marie, OP, RN, PHN

    One is born male or female. It’s written in the DNA of every cell of the human body. Any other notion of any other gender comes from the evil one.
    Mistakes are made in nature but they are NOT the norm! Nor should they be made to seem normal.
    Bravo Archbishop Chaput for standing up for the right!!

  • Ted

    Or, you could get up to speed on current science, sister. God’s creation is not so simplistic as you believe. Please stop idolizing the Bible, and try looking instead to the actual world God created, and worship God as God is, rather than as your small heart wants “him” to be.

  • Dominic

    Why should this surprise this ‘ministry”? The Pope has universal family issues to discuss, not address the folly of gay marriage or LGBT rights. Believe it or not, there are more critical issues in the world.

  • Ted

    Indeed. Which is why the sooner Bible-cultists cease acting out on their bigotries, and speak with us as fellow members of the body of Christ, the sooner the noise level around LGBT equality will go down.

  • Ted,

    “worship god as God is, rather than your small heart”

    Sorry but Sister knows god much better than you do.

    “Execute them in front of me..”- JESUS (Luke 19:27)
    “Hate Them” – JESUS (Luke 14:26)
    “Avoid Them” – ROMANS (16:17)
    “Do not associate with the GUILTY..” (1 Corinthians 5:11)
    “Bad company ruins good people….” (1 Corinthians 15:33)
    “Do not even to eat with such a one.” (1 Corinthians 5:11)
    “Do not receive him…or greet him..” (2 John 1:10)
    “tell him his fault…!” – JESUS (Matthew 18:15)
    “Have nothing to do with him!” (Titus 3:9-11)
    “LET HIM BE REMOVED” (1 Corinthians 1:13)
    “In the name of Jesus..keep away from him!” (2 Thess 3:6)
    “CURSE HIM” – (1 Cor. 16:22)
    “Deem them unworthy” – JESUS (Matt 10:13)

    Humans have rights.
    Ideas have no rights.

    Religion is cruel, war-mongering nonsense.

  • Doc Anthony

    Archbishop Chaput absolutely did the right thing, but it’s a pretty safe bet that Pope Francis is NOT on the same page with him. Wait and see.

  • Ted

    No, Max, Bible-cultism is cruel, war-mongering nonsense … no matter who is twisting the words to serve their preconceived view.

  • bqrq

    Ted said;
    “….. speak with us as fellow members of the body of Christ…..”

    Dear Ted,
    Let me say this gently. Those who abuse children and teach children to reject Biblical morality and practice sexual immorality are not fellow members of the body of Christ.

  • Ted,

    “Bible Cultism…”

    For crying out loud!
    Why can’t you Christians learn your own religion!?

    Jesus IS Bible cultism! ALL JESUS DOES IS QUOTE FROM THE TORAH!
    “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God has drawn near; repent, and believe in the good news” – JESUS (Mark 1:15).

    Jesus’ “good news” refers DIRECTLY TO ISAIAH!!,
    “O Zion, you that bring good news …”‘ (ISAIAH 40:9)
    AND “who proclaims good news of good … `Your God reigns”‘ (ISAIAH 52:7)

    With one side of your mouth you Christians claim Jesus is a fullfilment of an older prophecy.
    From the other side of your mouth you claim Jesus only had his own prophecy!

    Make up your mind! It can’t be both!

  • Ted,

    “Bible-cultists”

    JESUS IS the ORIGINAL Bible cultist himself!
    Why don’t you study your own religion?

    Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'” – JESUS (Luke 4:12)
    JESUS said Is it not written in the Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”‘? – JESUS (John 10:34)
    JESUS SAID ‘IT IS WRITTEN: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.'” (Matthew 4:4)
    JESUS SAID ‘IT IS WRITTEN:..you shall worship the Lord thy god only”

    100 times JESUS uses the Bible in exactly the way you call CULTISH!

    Why are Christians so ignorant about their own religion?

    The entirety of the Jesus fantasy is constructed on the WRITTEN JEWISH LAW and the character Jesus constantly refers to it LITERALLY for every single thing he does!

  • Ted,

    “Twisting the words..”

    WHAT? Every SINGLE THING Jesus did was Bible Cultism!

    “JESUS SAID ‘IT IS WRITTEN: For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.” – JESUS (Matthew 12:40)

    Jesus is referring LITERALLY to the OLDER BIBLE, Jonah 1:17!

    “Now the LORD provided a huge fish to swallow Jonah, and Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights.” (Jonah 1:17)

    The Jesus fable is nothing more
    than a re-LITERATION of the Torah.
    A completely cultish LITERAL adherence to ancient myths.

    The JESUS story is a primitive insistence
    on interpreting silly Jewish fables as if they were LITERALLY TRUE!

  • Ted,

    More than 100 times
    Jesus uses the Bible in exactly the way you call CULTISH!

    Why does Jesus do this? Because he HAS TO!
    Jesus would not have any reason to exist
    except for the literal interpretations of the Old Testament!

    “For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.” – JESUS (Matthew 12:40)

    The character Jesus explains the Old Testament stories and the law as LITERALLY TRUE: Noah’s flood, Jonah and the fish, Leviticus, Deuteronomy – ALL OF IT.

    And he insist on it in every move he makes in the gospel stories.

    Get a clue, please. This stuff is ancient nonsense.

  • Ted

    I’m sorry you do not understand my faith, and that your lack of comprehension leads you to feel angry. But, it’s a big mistake to assume all Christians interpret the Bible literally, or limit our faith to its words.

  • Ted

    bqrq, first, you are conflating pedophilia and homosexuality, which are two unrelated concepts. Pedophilia is primarily a heterosexual problem, usually expressed by fathers who rape and molest their daughters.

    Second, it’s an amusing statement on your hubris and lack of comprehension of Christianity, that you believe you can judge who is and is not part of the mystical body of Christ.

    But then, it’s long been apparent that you are not a Christian. You are a Bible-cultist (and seemingly a closeted homosexual, as well).

  • Ted

    Whether you interpret the Bible literally to support or reject its statements, you are idolizing mere words into a cult. In this, you are no different than those you so angrily criticize.

  • Davey in PA

    It’s been pointed out to you Mr. Atheist, you are nothing more than animated dust. So how can you even care about what happens to others? There is no soul in you that can be spurred on to justice because there is no justice in an unguided universe. Just random molecules moving around. You are just dust that somehow managed to stay out of the Hoover.

  • Davey in PA

    bqrq,

    YUP !

    Amen brother man . . .

  • Davey in PA

    Look, these activists have the freedom to invent their own weirdness religion and found their own freakish churches or whatever. A genderless religion is lunacy. Stop the attack on ethically sound Catholics and do your lgbt thing where it fits. Which is NOT a catholic church. The Castro district would be a better fit.

  • @Ted,

    “it’s a big mistake to assume all Christians interpret the Bible literally, or limit our faith to its words.”

    That has nothing to do with it.
    If you don’t believe the bible is “literally” true, you have no business accusing people of twisting the words around.

    It is not me, but YOUR Jesus who says:
    “Believe or be condemned” – JESUS (Mark 16:16)

    Sounds pretty literal to me.
    I’m glad you reject it. But then what is your beef with Atheists since you don’t believe it either!?
    You really haven’t thought about what any of this means.

  • Davey in PA,

    “why do you care?”

    Excuse me!?
    I have no choice.

    Religion WORKS AGAINST:
    Science, Equality, Reason, free inquiry, evolution, women’s rights, gay rights, Church State separation, US Constitution, contraception and sexual health, mental health, intellectual freedom, International peace, Middle East diplomacy, etc.

    Religion PROMOTES:
    ISIS, Al Queda, Bigotry, Discrimination
    Hatred of women, Surrender to Eschatology,
    Armageddon, Gullibility, Theocracy,
    Dictatorship, Ignorance of Scientific and Medical methods, Intellectual repression, superstition,
    Faith Healers, Con men,
    Surrender to unaccountable authority,
    pseudo-science, sexual repression, genital mutilation,
    Israeli settlements, honor killings, faith-based suicide bombings,
    holy war, etc…

    Religion celebrates evil behavior.
    It is a social nuisance like smoking, gambling and booze.

  • Ted,

    “idolizing mere words into a cult…”

    What nonsense.
    I am very different from you. I care about what is true.
    You don’t. So texts like this keep getting spread around!

    “Kill homosexuals” – (Leviticus 20:13)

    This is not a ‘misunderstanding of a scripture’.
    This is not ‘twisting of words’!

    You don’t care about people – you care more about your precious nonsense your grandmother taught you.
    Grow up. This nonsense is destructive to civilization.

  • Davey in PA

    One has to wonder if Atheist Max is a puppet, a parrot or a bobblehead doll. A soulless pile of soggy dust is trying to pretend he has feelings.

    Utter nonsense and/or laughable idiocy. Atheists need to cause pain to Christians because they know all too well that they are incapable of making the right choices in life. Anyone that supposedly chooses to be soulless is to be pitied and loathed all at the same time.

  • Davey the Bigot in PA,

    “Atheists ..know all too well that they are incapable of making the right choices in life.”

    30 years married to the same woman is a ‘wrong choice’?
    2 grown children through college is a ‘wrong choice’?
    Paying off my mortgage by the time I was 45 is a ‘wrong choice’?
    Being a leader in my area of study is a ‘wrong choice’?

    You know what?
    I never insult Christians. I never attack a believer for their belief.
    I limit my attack to the ideas and claims – not the believers themselves.

    But you, sir, are a bigot.
    You have only hatred and prejudice against Atheists and you lump us all together!

    I hate bowling. That does not mean I hate bowlers!
    But you apparently hate Atheism AND Atheists just for being Atheist!

    You hate these Atheists:
    Paul Newman, Oskar Schindler, Jacques Cousteau, Dr. Jonas Salk, Richard Feynman and Gene Roddenberry!

    That is foolish. Prove your god!

  • bqrq

    Morally, there is no difference between those who practice sexual immorality and those who give approval to immorality. Anyone who claims to be Christian yet practices sexual immorality is a liar and other Christians must avoid such individuals.

  • Ben in oakland

    If it takes your religion to make you empathetic and compassionate, then I would suggest that the concepts are foreign to you.

    If it takes your religion to keep you from robbery, rape, and murder, then I would suggest that you are not a good person.

  • I appreciate the research and knowledge Atheist Max shares on the Bible, Old Testament and New. Jesus was a Jew, perhaps a Rabbi. He lived as a Jew and died as a Jew. Therefore, his referencing the Torah should not be surprising.

    However, none of the quotes of Jesus in the New Testament were actually verbatim speech from Jesus. There are no primary sources for anything Jesus said or did. Nothing was written by his disciples. They were illiterate, unable to read or write in Greek. Everything we think we know about Jesus came to us first by word of mouth and then was written down decades after
    his death. Paul wrote first, maybe 20 years after Jesus died. Paul never met him; only had a vision. Mark, Q, Matthew, Luke and John wrote decades after Paul. None of them were disciples or apostles of disciples. They were anonymous writers who used disciple and apostle names to make what they wrote seem more authoritative. All quotations from Jesus were made up by the gospel authors.

  • bqrq

    Atheist Max said;
    “…..Religion celebrates evil behavior. It is a social nuisance like smoking, gambling and booze…..”

    Like most atheists, Max venerates sodomy and that is probably the closest thing to what could best be described as his personal “religion.” After Max dies, he will find out whether or not he really knows the truth. Meanwhile, the Word of God endures forever. The empty words of Max will be rejected and forgotten.

  • bqrq,

    “like most atheists..max venerates sodomy…..”

    Hysterical.
    You are an Atheist regarding Zoroaster – does this mean you
    are a venerator of Sodomy?

    There are thousands of supposed gods – NOT JUST JESHUA, YAHWEH AND SATAN and ALLAH – and all of them appear to be completely made up.

    Making that reasonable observation
    does not carry with it the slightest obligation
    to ‘venerate’ anything.

  • bqrq

    After Max dies, he will find out whether or not he really knows the truth. Meanwhile, the Word of God endures forever. The empty words of Max will be rejected and forgotten.

  • John

    Athiest max is more honest than liberal Catholics and other Christians who want to argue Scripture does not say homosexuality is a sin. Of course he uses it to disparage all religion but Scripture also says that unbelievers will just not get it for such things are contrary to fallen human reason. But for those who claim to be Christian, including Catholics, to claim homosexuality is not a sin sounds more like a religion of worshipping “what I want and putting God’s name on it” than actual faith.

  • brbq,

    “After max dies”

    WRONG again!

    If Jesus is true, everyone is saved in an afterlife no matter what.
    “Regardless …for as all died in Adam, all shall live in Christ.” (1 Corinthians 15:22)

    Because I have lived my life as if it is my only chance
    I don’t waste it. I appreciate it fully knowing the end will probably be final.
    Plus if there is an afterlife, I shall have it like everyone else.

    Your religion is so full of lies and contradictions
    you can’t possibly know what to do with any of these silly fables.

    And the people who wrote about God were so ignorant they didn’t know where the sun went at night.

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  • Belinda Carter

    Why do people say that there is no where in the Bible that God condemns Homosexuality? Clearly it does, please read: Lev. 18:22 “You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination,” That is from the Old Testament.

    Lev. 20:13, If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. New Testament,

    Romans 1:26-27 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.