Donald Trump, evangelical scam artist (COMMENTARY)

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A Christian who has never sought forgiveness for his sins is like a vegan who has filet mignon for dinner every night.

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  • Larry

    Evangelical voter’s like Trump in the same fashion as a beautiful teenage girl with daddy issues likes “bad boys”.

    The rest of the GOP candidates are fawning over the evangelical voters, idolizing them, trying to appease them with claptrap about privilege. Like how a “nice” nerdy boy would approach a woman way out of his dating “league. Sure they are pampered, but they don’t really appreciate the effort nor respect the people making it.

    At least that is what it looks like 🙂

    But the evangelical voters are falling behind the “bad boy”. The one who is abusive, doesn’t really pay attention to their needs, but always says what is “cool” in public. The one who annoys the boring staid authority figures (“Daddy is going to hate this guy, cool!”)

  • George Nixon Shuler

    Considering the title of the author’s book noted in the blurb about her at the end of the story, it seems to me she needs to be looking in the mirror and not out the window. The whole “War of Christianity” scam is just an attempt to make money off the fearful by playing the “Ain’t It Awful?” game with them.

  • The Great God Pan

    Why would his multiple divorces be a problem for evangelicals? They didn’t mind Newt Gingrich’s multiple divorces. They don’t mind stalwart defender of “traditional marriage” Kim Davis’s multiple divorces. Why should they mind Trump’s?

    Let’s face it. Being Christian isn’t about your own sins, or about the sins of your fellow Christians (*). It’s about the sins of those outside the tribe. Christianity is merely a stick to beat people with. Everything else is window dressing.

    (*) Provided they’re the “right kind” of Christian, of course!

  • Larry

    Trump also seems to understand that white evangelical Christians are largely bigots, racists and xenophobes first, Christians second. They only care about religious beliefs if it means they can act like d-bags to others with impunity.

    The rest of the crowd didn’t feel the need to appeal to the nativists and David Duke crowd, considering them already “in the bag”. Trump went straight for them. Capitalizing on the omissions of the rest of the pack.

  • Ben in oakland

    Christians like Kim Davis and Josh Duggar, among many others that have appeared in the news lately, simply declare– absent any actual evidence but what the convenient voices in their heads tell them– that they are forgiven of their sins. They don’t have to apologize to their victims, they don’t have to do anything but make their declaration.

    There used to be a bumper sticker that said, “Christians aren’t smug, just forgiven.”

    It’s not a bumper sticker. It’s a lifestyle.

  • George Nixon Shuler

    Larry, I believe you have cut through the obfuscation here and found the truth: what is today called “conservatism” is merely a system of advocacy of classism, racism, sexism, heterosexism, xenophobia, ignorance, superstition, and arrogance and as several observers have noted when it comes to a choice between business as usual and the real deal people will pick the real deal every time. The appeal of a character like Trump to religious conservatives though is a no-brainer: he can’t name his favorite Bible verse and they can’t either.

  • ronald

    There is nothing in the Bible about apologizing or atoning to those we have wronged. Christianity is a relationship with Christ, not with other people. We believe in Him and He washes away our sins. That’s the deal, take it or leave it!

    Any “Christian” who apologizes to other people instead of God is placing other people over God, which is blasphemous.

  • George Nixon Shuler

    Well, my friend, that is your opinion, but many including myself do not agree. What you have posted here are mere assertions, devoid of supporting facts and evidence.

    I’m no expert on scripture, but I’d have to say the part in Matthew 18 about settling disputes among the communal early Christians provides scriptural basis against your position. Moreover, one of the tenets of Alcoholics Anonymous, number 5 if I remember right, is to seek forgiveness from those the alcoholic in recovery has wronged. While not sectarian, AA is theistic in its appeal to one’s “higher power.”

    In Psalm 23:5, the Lord pledges to “prepare a table before myself and my enemies,” IOW he’s serving Heavenly Kansas City barbeque to you and those with whom you’ve had conflicts. I do not think the setup there is for a “You’re wrong!” – “No, You’re wrong!” type exchange.

  • Ben in oakland

    George, Ronald is a Poe troll, though this is not one of his more brilliant pieces. Permit me to translate:

    No matter what I’ve done, I don’t have to apologize to anybody for anything. I don’t have to be compassionate, polite, or to feel remorse. As a Bible believing Christian, I am not required to be a good person.

  • Scott Shaver

    Bingo. The Religious Right (what’s left of it) doesn’t understand how badly its credibility has been damaged. I think perhaps Trump does understand.

  • Jack

    Thank you, Dr. Larry, for sharing with us your pop-psychoanalysis from afar.

    Maybe you should replace Dr. Phil or start your own show.

  • Jack

    Wow, if even Kirsten Powers isn’t liberal enough for you, George, you must make Karl Marx look like Ronald Reagan.

  • Jack

    It’s interesting how conservative Christian hypocrisy transforms our screaming-mimi board lefties into Billy Bob Bible thumpers.

    God works in mysterious ways….and definitely has a sense of humor.

  • Jack

    America is what it always has been — a pretty crazy place politically, abounding in paradox.

    Yet somehow, it all works in the end.

    That’s why we all stick around, rather than emigrate.

  • Jack

    Ben, you’re such a moralist.

  • Jack

    Larry, it sounds like you’re projecting, given your yen for the party of slavery, civil war, Jim Crow, the Confederate flag, and burning the racial-division candle on both ends.

    Interesting how you and everybody else conveniently left out the popularity among evangelicals of Ben Carson, whom the last time I checked was an African American.

    Okay, now do your thing and hurl every form of racial invective at Carson because he’s not the “right” kind of black man — a docile follower of the party of Bull Connor, George Wallace, Woodrow Wilson, and other racist icons.

  • Jack

    If evangelicals are all such racists, why is Ben Carson, the black neurosurgeon from Johns Hopkins, polling second in the poll cited above, and is now apparently tied with Trump among Iowa Republicans, most of whom are evangelicals?

    I strongly suspect that the same sort of people who like Trump like Carson, so to call the Trump supporters racists doesn’t make much sense.

  • Jack

    Or…to put it another way, the last thing in the world you would expect from a racist would be to support a black candidate for president of the United States.

  • Jack

    George, how many new “isms” are just waiting to be invented? Hurry up and invent some of your own, before somebody else beats you to it.

    Doubtless there will come a time when “speciesism,” “realitism,” and “factualism” will join the ever-growing list.

  • Larry

    Ben Carson is trailing badly in comparison to Trump in the polls overall. Less than half of Trump’s average numbers
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/2016_republican_presidential_nomination-3823.html

    Carson did poorly in the last primary as well. He has financial support by the GOP because they are looking to shake an image of being the party which loves racists. But his chances of national election generally evaporate the moment he opens his mouth. A perfect example of a well educated person who is prone to boneheaded remarks.

    Trump’s appeal to racial, ethnic, nationalist and sexist bigotry is yielding greater numbers than Carson’s appeal to merely theocracy.

  • Larry

    Jack, it looks like you are slinging ad hominem, personal insult and outright libelous fiction rather than coming up with an intelligent rebuttal.

    See my comment below. Carson doesn’t even have half the numbers Trump is polling at. Trumps bigotry is far more popular than Ben Carson’s theocratic notions. Btw that is some strawman you are burning. I didn’t mention Republicans in general. Just their white evangelical voters. Unless you are willing to say they are the sole members of the GOP. 🙂

    If white evangelicals were so concerned with electing their own and people who uphold their religious values, they would not be so supportive of Trump. Trump knows that these people are more than willing to set aside their “firmly held beliefs”, if it means the political power to attack various people they despise.

  • Jack

    Larry, sometimes I wonder whether you even believe half of what you post.

    Bigotry is not what drives Trump’s support among evangelicals. Trump’s a buffoonish boor, but people like him because of the old adage that the enemy of my enemy is my friend. They hate the mainstream media, and he does, too. They hate weakness in foreign policy and he says he does, too. They distrust career politicians who they feel never deliver and he says he does, too.

    They love their country and want secure borders for national security and national sovereignty reasons and he says he does, too.

    The big test for bigotry was the 2000 Alabama GOP presidential caucuses…..Alabama might as well be Jupiter to me, since I’m not a southerner and have only been there once to visit the space center while visiting nearby Tennessee, but what caught my eye was who the winner was that year — not any white guy, but Alan Keyes, who was black.

  • Jack

    I agree, Larry, about Carson’s being gaffe-prone. He certainly is.

    My point was that the strong support he’s getting from evangelicals — in spite of his being a gaffe machine — belies the canard that evangelicals are a bunch of knuckle-dragging bigots. As I’ve said, he’s tied with Trump among Republicans in evangelical-rich Iowa — with 23 each.

  • Jack

    BTW, Larry, if you think you can deny the Democratic party’s nauseating history on race, you’re dreaming. It’s a national disgrace.

    Again, for a brief shining period of time, it woke up and supported a color-blind society during the civil rights revolution.

    But no sooner was the ink dry on the 1964 Civil Rights Act, it was back to racialist sewer politics as usual.

    The fact that this time, the Democrats became racist panderers rather than racist oppressors is a distinction without a difference, especially if our national goal is true racial harmony and racial equality.

    And again, just watch the old bigotry pour forth whenever a black Republican rears his or her head. Just read some of the posts on message boards about Clarence Thomas or Condy Rice, Herman Cain and now Ben Carson, Thomas Sowell or Walter Williams, Shelby Steele or Mia Love.

    They’ve been called every racist name in the book by white Democrats and white leftists.

  • Larry

    I can do private sessions, but only if your insurance covers mental health.

  • You haven’t been paying attention Jack. Your dislike of Trump is blinding you to his strengths.

    The man is a showman at heart.

    He knows how to play to an audience. Especially a rather cretinous one. After all Trump has valuable experience in both reality TV and professional wrestling (as a promoter, not a wrestler)
    http://www.wwe.com/videos/playlists/donald-trump-greatest-wwe-moments

    He knows people like simple slogans and someone to hate. People tend to mistake boorish behavior with honesty. He also exploited a key discrepancy with conservative tactics. Even the most conservative religious leaders are taking a largely pro-immigrant stance. Their flock, especially white members are prone to nativism.

    What is funny is he is completely ignoring the social conservative agenda, even saying it is not happening with him. But they don’t care. They are enjoying beating up on women and Mexicans too much to notice. 🙂

  • I noticed you did not mention Colin Powell among the Black Republicans. The man had integrity up until 2003. Btw whenever a black republican rears their head, the most stinging criticism comes from the black community. Frankly the GOP doesn’t even take them seriously beyond a local level. Of course it looks like tokenism.

  • Larry

    And this is why nobody takes you seriously when you call people “lefties”. The author is very conservative and makes no bones about it. (Did you read the title of her book at the concluding blurb?) If she is a liberal to you, you obviously have no clue what you are talking about.

  • Larry

    There are enough knuckle draggers to give Trump a huge lead over the other candidates. Plus he has changed the tenor of the campaign. Now everyone is giving nativism a try. Even Ben Carson.

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  • Jack

    The difference between you and me on this, Larry, is that I don’t define left and right solely on one’s stance on social or moral issues. I look at economic and foreign policy issues even more. Thus, if someone’s liberal on social issues but fiscally conservative or conservative on foreign policy, I don’t see that person as a lefty. Likewise, if someone is conservative on those issues but liberal otherwise (as Kirsten is), I don’t see them as conservative.

    As for you, you’re on the left on all three, so there are no such questions pertaining to you.

    Interesting little sidebar — Liberal Kirsten Powers and conservative Ann Coulter once attended the same church — the one I attend when I’m in New York. It’s an evangelical Presbyterian church headed by one of the most interesting pastors in the country.

    That prior paragraph punctures a truckload of mindless and ignorant stereotypes about evangelicals — not that you won’t go right on stereotyping.

  • Jack

    I’ll add one more thing that’s probably key:

    If you’re willing to blow past constitutional limits on the size and scope and function of government n terms of its three branches in order to win on issues like gay marriage, you are a lefty.

    But if you are for gay marriage but want to see it enacted the lawful and constitutional way — by the people and their representatives, state by state — you are not a lefty.

    So it’s not one’s substantive stance on social and moral issues that define left and right, but it is how one seeks to prevail on them that tells the real story. If you’re a lefty, you don’t give a hoot about how you get something done — you just want it done , constitutional process be damned. If you care about process as much as substance, because you realize that the future of constitutional democracy is more important than winning or losing on one’s own pet issues, you are not a lefty.

  • Jack

    Okay, Larry, I will mention Colin Powell, who also has had racist taunts directed at him by white leftists and Democrats for the same reason as the others. Thanks for bringing him up.

    For some reason, the ones white radicals like the most is “house n…..”

    To me, they’re just following in the footsteps of Bull Connor, George Wallace, and all the other haters from the party that turned race-baiting into an art form.

  • Jack

    I’ve run into people I consider to be exceptionally bright who say they like Trump, so it’s not so simple, Larry. And if you look closely at the people that show up at his rallies, they’re wearing polo shirts, chinos, and top-siders. Not exactly the garb of knuckle-dragging cretins. More like the garb of folks who shop at B-squared. These people obviously are not thinking critically, but you really have to strain to imagine that they’re high-school dropouts.

    Of course I don’t totally get it, but calling these people a bunch of toothless imbeciles fit for the movie, Deliverance, obviously doesn’t fit the reality we see.

  • Jack

    But the point is that if Ben Carson doesn’t have what you rightly call Trump’s showmanship, and as you admit, Carson is a bit of a gaffe machine, and, I will add, he has the tone of voice of a mellowed-out hippie who stumbled out of a late 1960s time tunnel without his bong, and he STILL is running second among evangelicals, that’s a pretty strong refutation of the claim that evangelicals are racists.

    I’d say the plain truth is that it’s not totally clear to anyone why so many people like Trump. I have my explanations and you have yours, but no explanation really suffices…..all of them lead to other questions.

  • Larry

    Another description of this article article calling her a Conservative columnist. She contributes to Fox News and frequently posts here for social conservative causes.

    http://www.gospelherald.com/articles/57610/20150903/conservative-columnist-says-donald-trump-is-scamming-christians-for-vote-urges-conservative-evangelicals-to-wake-up.htm

    “That prior paragraph punctures a truckload of mindless and ignorant stereotypes about evangelicals”

    Not at all. All 3 say rather silly and dishonest things in service of faith and conservative politics.

  • Larry

    Btw you don’t know squat about “Constitutional process”. The Supreme Court has had the power to shoot down laws which are unconstitutional since 1801. It is a check upon political branches of Legislative and Executive power to ensure we do not descend into what Madison referred to as “the tyranny of the majority”.

    You were too thickheaded to notice nobody made such arguments in front of the Supreme Court in service of various gay marriage bans. Why? Because it is an argument based on complete ignorance of the Judicial branch. The 14th Amendment permits SCOTUS to strike down discriminatory laws.

    Had the homophobes not been so malicious as to institute bans and simply left things alone for legislative apathy, it would be another decade before one saw marriage equality. So the only ones to blame here are those Bible thumping discriminatory types who could not leave things be.

  • Larry

    That is more of a sign of the terrible choices of candidates the GOP is fielding. The only other “fiscal conservatives” have way too much baggage and history of bad behavior (Christie, Walker). JBush tries to straddle fiscal and social conservatives, but the guy is hapless. There are diminishing returns on the Bush family.

    None of that explains Trump’s numbers with evangelicals. They love him so far and he is treating them with barely disguised contempt. People who ARE best described as rejects from the casting call of Deliverance.

    Trump’s appeal is the guy knows how to play to different audiences. He is a showman first and foremost. A grandstander in a field of people trying to appear humble. Right now he is the only one the fiscal conservatives are happy about.

  • Jack

    Physician, heal thyself.

    That’s the underlying point.

  • Jack

    Larry, don’t skim….read.

    I don’t deny that Kristen Powers tilts conservative on social issues.

    What I do deny is the conclusion that this makes her a conservative. Social issues are but one set of issues on which stances are taken. There are constitutional issues, fiscal and economic issues, foreign policy issues….

    And looking at all these other issues, beyond the social issues, Kirsten is not a conservative and would surely be the first person to acknowledge it.

    So unless you’re obsessed with social issues and believe nothing else matters, it is the height of forgetfulness to ignore all the other sorts of issues. People who are obsessed with social issues alone often are driven by organs other than the brain.

  • Jack

    Larry, you seem to have gone off into a corner and are mumbling to yourself. I have no idea what your point is. Nobody is denying that the Supreme Court has the power of judicial review. The question is whether it has ruled rightly in a given decision as part of its exercise of that power.

    And you have said nothing about the 14th Amendment, other than the self-evident fact that it exists and has been used to combat “discrimination.”

    No kidding, Larry.

    The question is whether it correctly applied the 14th Amendment in its gay marriage decision.

    Until you’re prepared for an intelligent discussion on that question, you might as well continue mumbling again in a corner, to no one in particular, about nothing in particular.

  • Ben in oakland

    I’m glad to hear that you think i am a conservative.

    Liberal on social issues? Chack.

    conservative on fiscal issues? I have been criticizing the conservatives for years on deficit spending. Get out of these wars that we don’t have the money for, stop trying to be the world’s policeman, defund the war on drugs. Check.

    Conservative on foreign policy! stay out of wars when we haven’t been attacked. war is a failure of international diplomacy.ccheck again.

    Hurray. I Am a conservative.

  • Ben in oakland

    I always have been, jack. I am a moralist, but I am not a moralizing busybody.

    I hold myself to very high standards. I hold my friends to those standards, and they appreciate it. That’s why when they want to know what the right thing to do is, they ask me.

    Am I perfect? no, absolutely not. Nor do I have any interest in claiming that I am. But one thing I will absolutely NOT do is say that you should do X, Becuase X is right and moral, and then go ahead and do the opposite of X.

    And when I do fall–and I do– I do my best to apologize to those I have wronged, and do my best to make amends to the wronged party. I absolutely do not produce a “get out of jail Becuase God has forgiven me” piece of BS.