Trump’s interview with the devil (COMMENTARY)

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U.S. Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump speaks with the media in the spin room after the Republican U.S. candidates debate sponsored by CBS News and the Republican National Committee in Greenville, South Carolina on February 13, 2016. Photo courtesy of REUTERS/Chris Keane
*Editors: This photo may only be republished with RNS-GRAVES-COLUMN, originally transmitted on Feb. 16, 2016.

U.S. Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump speaks with the media in the spin room after the Republican U.S. candidates debate sponsored by CBS News and the Republican National Committee in Greenville, South Carolina on February 13, 2016. Photo courtesy of REUTERS/Chris Keane *Editors: This photo may only be republished with RNS-GRAVES-COLUMN, originally transmitted on Feb. 16, 2016.

(RNS) It’s August 2016. Slipping in the polls to the Democratic nominee, Donald Trump searches for someone notable to interview him. Satan volunteers. The following is a rush transcript of their wide-ranging discussion of American politics.

THE DEVIL: Issue No. 1 for me is immigration. For the past three millennia, I’ve been irked by God singling out immigrants as a special class of vulnerable people to protect. How will you fight immigrants on day one?

THE DONALD: I will build a great wall — and nobody builds walls better than me, believe me — and I’ll build them very inexpensively. I will build a great, great wall on our southern border, and I will make Mexico pay for that wall. Mark my words.

THE DEVIL: Your position on blaming all Muslims for all terrorism really resonates with me.

THE DONALD: Donald J. Trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States.

THE DEVIL: The devil is calling on all Americans to agree. Tell me more about your views on terrorism.


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THE DONALD: I’m the worst thing that’s ever happened to ISIS.

THE DEVIL: Focus groups show your chief political weakness, though, is with women. Women always complain about tough men, right?

THE DONALD: You know, it really doesn’t matter what the media write as long as you’ve got a young and beautiful piece of [expletive].

THE DEVIL: But what policies do you support?

THE DONALD: I will be so good to women.

THE DEVIL: How so?

THE DONALD: I will be phenomenal to the women.


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THE DEVIL: In what ways?

THE DONALD: You have to treat ’em like [expletive].

THE DEVIL: Indeed. Tell us about one woman who has inspired you?

THE DONALD: You know who’s one of the great beauties of the world, according to everybody? And I helped create her. Ivanka. My daughter, Ivanka. She’s 6 feet tall, she’s got the best body. She made a lot of money as a model — a tremendous amount.

THE DEVIL: This is getting good. Tell me more about your daughter.

THE DONALD: She does have a very nice figure. I’ve said if Ivanka weren’t my daughter, perhaps I’d be dating her.

THE DEVIL: God is always complaining about protecting Creation. I know people really don’t care. How can you best lie to the American people to keep deluding them?

THE DONALD: The concept of global warming was created by and for the Chinese in order to make U.S. manufacturing noncompetitive.


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THE DEVIL: You’re an incredibly successful business tycoon, and boy do I love American capitalism. What’s your secret to effective leadership?

THE DONALD: I know what sells and I know what people want.

THE DEVIL: Yes, I’ve known that strategy to work well. Any tips for me in leading people to evil?

THE DONALD: I play to people’s fantasies. People may not always think big themselves, but they can still get very excited by those who do. That’s why a little hyperbole never hurts. People want to believe that something is the biggest and the greatest and the most spectacular.

THE DEVIL: I’m taking notes.

THE DONALD: There is something crazy, hot, a phenomenon out there about me, but I’m not sure I can define it and I’m not sure I want to.

THE DEVIL: Can you try?

THE DONALD: There’s something very seductive about being a television star.

THE DEVIL: I’ve gotten that before. Maybe I should do TV?

THE DONALD: Nothing wrong with ego.

THE DEVIL: Speaking about there being “nothing wrong,” I always apply that statement to gambling. Do you spend a lot of time gambling in your casinos?

THE DONALD: People think I’m a gambler. I’ve never gambled in my life. To me, a gambler is someone who plays slot machines. I prefer to own slot machines. It’s a very good business being the house.

THE DEVIL: So, profiting off gambling gets you going?

THE DONALD: How much have I made off the casinos? Off the record, a lot.

THE DEVIL: You’re on the record.

THE DONALD: Let’s say I was worth $10. People would say, ‘Who the [expletive] are you?’ You understand? They know my statement. Fortune. My book, “The Art of the Deal,” based on my fortune. If I didn’t make a fortune, who the [expletive] is going to buy “The Art of the Deal”?

THE DEVIL: I keep telling people how hard it is for white people in America. What are you going to do about this as president?

THE DONALD: A well-educated black has a tremendous advantage over a well-educated white in terms of the job market. If I were starting off today, I would love to be a well-educated black, because I believe they do have an actual advantage.

THE DEVIL: Black Americans certainly have it easier. Go on …

THE DONALD: I have black guys counting my money. I hate it. The only guys I want counting my money are short guys that wear yarmulkes all day.

Guthrie Graves-Fitzsimmons writes about faith and public policy. From 2011 to 2015, he worked at the National Immigration Forum mobilizing Christians to advocate for the value of immigrants and immigration to America. Follow him at @guthriegf. Photo courtesy of Guthrie Graves-Fitzsimmons

Guthrie Graves-Fitzsimmons writes about faith and public policy. From 2011 to 2015, he worked at the National Immigration Forum mobilizing Christians to advocate for the value of immigrants and immigration to America. Follow him at @guthriegf. Photo courtesy of Guthrie Graves-Fitzsimmons

THE DEVIL: Finally, since I have the chance, just wanted to say … um … what a big fan of “The Apprentice” I am. We need more reality TV idolizing money and fame. Perhaps you could have me on as a judge sometime? Any gossip from the show?

THE DONALD: All the women on “The Apprentice” flirted with me  —  consciously or unconsciously. That’s to be expected.

THE DEVIL: Thank you for your time, and good luck. If you lose this election, I’m looking for my own apprentice.

Author’s note: All the lines from Donald J. Trump are direct quotes. Those from the devil are fictional, as far as I can tell.

(Guthrie Graves-Fitzsimmons writes about faith and public policy. From 2011 to 2015, he worked at the National Immigration Forum mobilizing Christians to advocate for the value of immigrants and immigration to America. Follow him at @guthriegf)

  • Frank Franklinton

    Cindyrella, so are you saying salvation is by faith and works? What about the sin in the lives of those like yourself? If you are a Christian you know you must admit you to have sin in your life, and it continues. And does your good deeds negate the need for a Savior? I prefer to believe that even if I happen to be guilty and morally bankrupt my faith will save me. Future it is clear to me everyone is morally bankrupt. You cannot be a Christian and not agree. So scripture is clear it is by faith, and faith that the sacrifice of Christ for each persons’ own sins is sufficient for salvation. Alone! And to suggest otherwise tarnishes the sufficiency of my Lord’s sacrifice. I think He would agree.

  • Fran

    Repentance, faith, obeying God’s laws, commands and following his principles in the Bible save us. So will the upcoming millennial rule of Jesus, God’s son and King of God’s kingdom (Isaiah 11:1-10) save us, as well as the ransom sacrifuce of Jesus. All of these actions will result in eternal life on earth (Rev. 21:3,4), since sin and death will be no more.

  • Tom Downs

    The real question is can the Donald save you.

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  • Jack

    The only way to defeat Donald Trump politically is from the right, not the left, because the phenomenon of Trump is inexplicable without reference to widespread American concern about the depredations of the far left.

    So making the devil into a conservative and God into a liberal is cute, but it won’t do the job, if your goal is to stop Trump from becoming president.

  • BenCarson2016

    Great article! It reminds me of C.S. Lewis’ “The Screwtape Letters”.