Election News Revelations

Trump tackles Christianity’s big question: Who is Jesus?

Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump speaks at a campaign event on the day several states held presidential primaries, including California, at the Trump National Golf Club Westchester in Briarcliff Manor, N.Y., on June 7, 2016. Photo courtesy of REUTERS/Carlo Allegri

(RNS) In the New Testament, Jesus asks Peter, his dearest disciple and the rock upon which he founded his church: “Who do you say that I am?”

On Wednesday (June 8), Donald Trump was essentially asked the same question: “Who do you say Jesus is?”

Trump’s answer, which came after his questioner, conservative commentator and evangelical Christian Cal Thomas, asked a second time, was this:

“Jesus to me is somebody I can think about for security and confidence. Somebody I can revere in terms of bravery and in terms of courage and, because I consider the Christian religion so important, somebody I can totally rely on in my own mind.”

The remark comes ahead of Trump’s speech to 500 evangelical leaders in New York later this month. As a voting bloc, evangelicals are considered crucial to the Republican Party, but many have been critical of Trump, with some saying his policies, such as his proposed ban on Muslims entering the U.S. and his  U.S.-Mexico border wall, are un-Christian.

Trump supporters and critics took to social media to pick over the remark, published in a transcript on Thomas’ website, ciphering it for clues to the candidate’s religiosity, which some have doubted and others have heralded.

Trump stumbled a bit in his first attempt at an answer:

“I will be asking for forgiveness, but hopefully I won’t have to be asking for much forgiveness,” he began. “As you know, I am Presbyterian and Protestant.”

He then said it was “deplorable” Syrian Muslims could come to the U.S. before concluding, “I’m going to treat my religion, which is Christian, with great respect and care.”

Peter’s response to the same question in the Gospel of Matthew (Chapter 16:15-16): “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

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About the author

Kimberly Winston

Kimberly Winston is a freelance religion reporter based in the San Francisco Bay Area.

232 Comments

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  • This guy needs to look a little harder and a little deeper. He reminds me of Jesus’ declaration that, “it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter heaven.” Of course, none of us should take a pass to heaven for granted.

  • The Jesus that Donald Trump knows is very different from the perception that most people see. Not that he doesn’t have these qualities, but the outstanding features is that he is always thinking of the other person and how they are treated with fairness and respect. That humility is a quality that equates love for one another. The Donald Trump Jesus is a person in control instead of God in control.

  • The big problem is that whoever wins in 2016 will be leading a backslidden nation that doesn’t want either God or Jesus in control.

    America has forgotten God, precisely as Ben Franklin and Abe Lincoln warned America not to do.

    Obama, Hillary, and Trump have all flunked the “Who Is Jesus” test (and Obama’s is the biggest failure of all), but that is no longer the main issue. This nation has turned its back on Jesus, America has messed up on God. The car is being driven off the cliff right now, no matter which driver wins the little popularity contest in 2016.

  • Franklin and Lincoln were none too religious, but at least they knew what Christianity was about. Clearly Trump has given it little thought. But I have to ask: On what basis do you say that Obama and Clinton have flunked the “Who is Jesus” test? Their speeches indicate they know what they’re talking about.

  • Actually, Jesus taught feeding the poor, accepting the marginalized, self-reflection, compassion, love your neighbor, … I don’t think it is Obama who has turned his back on Jesus. The people who ignore the beam in their own eye and focus on the mote in Obama’s eye have turned their back on Jesus.

  • Since the churches have politicized Jesus, in a democracy they can expect to hear about a multitude of Jesuses and Jesus talkers that they do not approve of. It is obnoxious that the clergy demand a veto power over US politics. And I am not a Trump supporter.

  • Franklin and Lincoln were not regular Christians. Both were more in line with Tom Paine and Jefferson.

  • The religious right, like the rest of us, is voting for President, not Savior. Wouldn’t they be looking for somebody capable, intelligent, decent, sane and prepared?

    You named her: Clinton.

    -dlj.

  • other than saying Christ is his personal savior, it was a good answer and in some was politically correct for if he’d said Christ is the savior the other religions and unbelievers would be pissed

  • They have the choices they have. The R.R. is a major cause of the partisan-political nightmare which the US has become. If the only alternative they have is Clinton — and if they, as perhaps you do, view that with distaste — then they have no one but themselves to blame for it! They should grow up, pull on their big-boy (or -girl) pants, and deal with the consequences of their words and actions over the last 30-40 years, like mature adults … instead of like sniveling little children.

  • All three political giants have now made carefully framed “yes I am a Christian” statements for the voters, even as each person continues to say, do, and openly support things that don’t look like Jesus at all.

    Meanwhile, liberals and conservatives give “their person” a free pass on whatever biblical violations are going on (or will go on) in terms of public policv. So if Trump flunks Jesus, then Hillary and Obama flunks Jesus too.

  • Donald’s answer was clear…”Jesus to me…”…in other words for “my self interest”. Peter’s answer showed his servitude to Christ’s Will. Trump’s self-righteous answer shows his desire to use Christ for his own will, for his Self FREEDOM to justify his way.

  • I’m a liberal–I may say very liberal–Anglican Christian, and I agree with you completely.

  • this entire friggin’ discussion is out of place as American political discourse. I don’t what to know what my national leaders’ faith position is. I’m pretty sure, though, that their position will be easy to surmise from their words and actions.

  • What’s wrong with Hilary? Abortion. But the fundamentalists on the religious right take the Bible literally, and as the only guide. Yet nowhere in the Bible is abortion condemned or forbidden. The Bible literalists have made abortion an issue sheerly for a political reasons – to ally with Catholics and draw them into the Republican party – and not out of religious reasons.

  • Trump is what he says he is – a Presbyterian. Hence he talks of the Communion bread as a “cracker,” common among Presbyterians. BTW, P’s can administer the sacrament to themselves.

  • So what that he’s no E or RC? Trump is what he says he is – a Presbyterian. Hence he talks of the Communion bread as a “cracker,” common among Presbyterians. BTW, P’s can administer the sacrament to themselves. I am not a Trump supporter but I despise the religious wars foisted on our politics by zealots and reactionaries.

  • Really? You have a clear idea of what Peter meant? Jews at that time used “Son of God” to mean someone pleasing and close to God. They did not mean what Christians came to mean by that phrase. Not believing that Jesus was the orthodox Son of God (that is, God) still allows for believing that Jesus had a special mission from God and that he was risen from from the dead by God to establish a religion that would bring God’s will on earth as in heaven. According to jesus that would not include attacking others and acting with disrespect and contempt towards those with whom we do not agree.

  • Obviously he never learned much in his Confirmation Class, if he ever attended one.
    Every child going through Sunday School would answer by “rote” what Peter said.
    If evangelicals are dumb enough to accept Trump’s answer, they are no more than “a blind man would not see”

  • Read the original intention of the interviewer. “Tell me who you are without telling me your name or what you do. We have seen your tough exterior, but who are you at your core and what is your basic philosophy and worldview?” and then one of the questions is “who is Jesus to you?” You have to see that he answered this question very practical. He said he is someone he honors and respects that he is brave and has courage and strength and he is secure in him and totally relies on him. Realize many of these articles are designed to persuade the reader and are taken out of context. Mr. Trump is not eloquent with words but he is practical in his speech and is trying to answer the questions thrown at him in their context. Mr. Trump is saying that Jesus is powerful and he admires him, his courage and strength, and feels totally secure in him in his own mind. And there is another verse that supports Mr. Trumps saying that he will ask for forgiveness but hopefully he is living his life in a way that he won’t have to ask for much forgiveness. Philippians 1:20 “I honestly expect and hope that I will never do anything to be ashamed of. Whether I live or die, I always want to be as brave as I am now and bring honor to Christ.” Trump is saying that he will ask for forgiveness as he makes mistakes, but he hopes that his mistakes are few, and he hopes he makes choices and lives in such a way on a day to day basis that brings honor to Jesus.

  • Does this column have a point to make? If so, would the columnist please put it in the comment section? Thank you.

  • With Obama, we focus on his opposition to people helping people, instead his approach is to force other people to help people. That is not found in the Bible which called for cheerful (not forced) giving.

  • The Bible called for people paying their taxes. It didn’t say anything about how the taxes are to be used.

    Society and businesses today do not meet the standards set in the Bible for taking care of the poor, so don’t try to hide behind the Bible.

  • Trumps Jesus is one of his own making…
    Jesus is either Lord of all, or not Lord at all!!
    Jesus is the Son of God . the Messiah, Saviour totally God and totally man. His blood on the Cross is the price paid for our Sins that we might be saved from paying a debt we owed and could not pay. Their is salvation in no other name.
    Donald , your knowledge of Our Lord, is head knowledge.
    It “sounds like” you do not have a relationship that is necessary ,
    Jesus said ” YOU MUST BE BORN AGAIN “… (BORN FROM ABOVE)
    My question is… ARE YOU BORN AGAIN?

  • people come on! how many presidents in your lifetime were christians ( as you would define a christian) i considered RR to be but apart from that i don’t remember any. look at obama who openly ridiculed the sermon on the mount and misquoted the OT to mock the bible. an anti-christ is just that, someone who is anti-christ. obama never said one good thing about JESUS and while trump is very rough around the edges he is saying positive things about Jesus and he also knows which restroom to use too.

  • nowhere in the bible is abortion condemned? how about thou shall not kill? how about ‘if anyone harms one of these little ones it would be better to have a milstone tied around your neck and dropped in to the sea?

  • i agree. i’ll take trump over hillary who doesn’t know which restroom to use this week.also, there are like 30 different genders now? these doctors make this garbage up and then teach it as fact and obama/hillary people gulp it down.

  • read in john where jesus fashioned a whip out of cords and whipped the moneychangers who were ripping off people in the temple area. yes. he attacked them and drove them out.

  • Jesus would never agree with a sexual pervert like obama. he would show him the error of his ways. do you honestly believe that jesus would want us all using the bathroom with cross dressers? obama is anti christ. whoever defends abortion is also anti christ. christ did not come to take lives but to save those who are lost. read up.

  • Jesus would love the transgendered person as well. Jesus would understand that a transgendered person is born that way, but that the hate and bigotry you demonstrate is a choice. He would love you and try to help you.

    Funny how Jesus never mentioned abortion. However, on multiple occasions he did equate divorce to adultery.

    I would take a love-filled transgendered person over a hateful bigot who calls himself a Christian. Being unable to love the unloveable (the bigot) is my failing. It is something I need Jesus’ help with. Jesus was able to love the unloveable. However, he did manage to call them “Viper!”

  • I wasn’t aware that Obama opposed private charity. He hasn’t stopped me from helping anyone.

  • Jesus said that in the beginning God made them male and female.also, you are calling the apostle paul a bigot. romans;1;26-27 men abandoned natural relations with women and became inflamed with lust for one another. men committed shameful acts with other men and recieved the due penalty for their error. read your bible dude. wake up.

  • I’ve been a Presbyterian all my 62 years, and a Presbyterian pastor for 38 years. I have NEVER heard ANY Presbyterian refer to the Communion bread as a “cracker.” It is not true now, and has never been true, that Presbyterians can administer the sacrament to themselves. Trump may claim to be a Preabyterian but he is not on any church roll anywhere as an active member, or even an inactive member. He may have attended a Presbyterian Sunday school as a child, but there is no record of him having ever been confirmed in a Presbyterian church or a member of a Presbyterian church.

  • I’ve been a Presbyterian all my 62 years, and a Presbyterian pastor for 38 years. I have NEVER heard ANY Presbyterian refer to the Communion bread as a “cracker.” It is not true now, and has never been true, that Preabyterians can administer the sacrament to themselves. Trump may claim to be a Preabyterian but he is not on any church roll anywhere as an active member, or even an inactive member. He may have attended a Presbyterian Sunday school as s child, but there is no record of him having ever been confirmed in a Presbyterian church or a member of a Presbyterian church.

  • God is love. Jesus is love. Bigotry is a perversion of that love.

    Paul may very well have been a bigot. No one is perfect. For example, the apostles rejected Jesus out of fear. If they had been perfect, they would have stood with him.

    Sex was viewed and used differently in ancient times. For example, sex was used as a way to display dominance.

    Differences in gender identity and sexual orientation were unknown then. If people understood that same sex attraction was a part of how God created some people, same sex marriage may very well have been part of the culture.

    Paul didn’t have the advantage of knowing what we now know about gender identity and sexual orientation. Today, we know better. To be a bigot is a perversion of God’s love for humankind and his creation.

    I would recommend reading “God and Sex: What the Bible Really Says About Sex,” by Dr. Michael Coogan.

  • Actually, your post above brings to a question whether you can be considered a Christian, if you define Christian as someone who follows Jesus.

    Obama has never mocked the Bible. Even if he wasn’t a believer, he would never do it. It would be political suicide.

    When Obama gave a keynote speech at one of Clinton’s Democratic Nominating Convention, I remember him saying with passion “What a great God we have!”

    You are lying about Obama. Jesus wasn’t a liar.

  • Do you think Jesus would whip Joel Olstein, Pat Robertson, Franklin Graham, et al who make a business out of Christianity?

  • Thou shalt not kill did not include the unborn. The “little ones” were referring to children already born.

    If someone caused a miscarriage, they had to pay damages. Then there was the trial by bitter waters.

    Being anti-abortion is not Biblical.

  • Apparently, you are fixated on bathroom use and are anti-science too boot. Well, there is no making up for an inadequate education.

  • i believe that men should use the men’s room and women should use the women’s room. i didn’t change the rules. psychiatrists now say there’s like 30 different gender identifications and honestly it’s confusing. the govt. created a problem where one didn’t even exist. as far as your question about these tv evangelists. it’s not for me to pass judgement but, God knows the heart of every man so, if they are just in it for money they will pay. but, i don’t condemn individuals but, behaviors that are now made legal. you mentioned ‘names’ i don’t want to name names but rather behaviors that the bible says are evil. it’s not for me or you to judge individuals. i hope this helps you out and you know which restroom to use.God will destroy america for what it’s doing. if you don’t believe that, watch and see. that’s all i ask. there’s a terrible storm coming and you need to take shelter. smb 11? i guess that’s your pseudo name. put your real name up or stop contacting me. thanks.

  • I admit, you have strange values and I don’t see Jesus’ influence in them.

    I don’t use my name so that what I write cannot ever be used against my employer. However, I don’t hide what I write. Everything I have written can be accessed by clicking on smb11.

    Bigots and people with hate in their hearts caused this problem by banning transgendered people from using the appropriate bathroom.

    I fervently believe that God and Jesus are love and that any use of their name that doesn’t reflect that is a perversion of that love. God will not destroy his creation. Man is doing a good job of that on his own.

    Anyone who is living as the gender they identify with should use the corresponding bathroom.

    I don’t have any problem with transgendered women sharing the bathroom with me. I would find it difficult to share the bathroom with a bigot, however.

  • Just watch the twitter feed for the results of the search.

    Trump is proving that evangelical racism trumps any commitment they have to their self-proclaimed religious beliefs. Which are now VERY much in doubt, with the elevation of this charlatan. I guess mixing church and state was a really terrible idea after all.

  • Your free from thought cue card based “trial of bitter waters” bunk, has been debunked..or didn’t you get the free from thought memo? … Just check the text of your “proof”:

    Numbers:5:11

    “And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, Speak unto
    the children of Israel, and say unto them, If any man’s wife go aside, and commit a trespass against him, And a man lie with her carnally, and it be hid from the eyes of her husband, and be kept close, and she be defiled, and there be no witness against her, neither she be taken with the manner;”

    …taken with the manner = pregnant, which means your abortion is a-okay with The LORD due to the trial of bitter water is … free from thought, fact, & evidence.

    Please save the rest of the free from thought cue card rehearsal for your “since we all agree it must be true” affirmative action assisted atheists…. Who apparently don’t check stuff out for themselves & will believe you.

  • You might tell biblical scholar Dr. Michael Coogan that he and other biblical scholars have been debunked.

    Did you go to college with Sarah Palin? I admit, I have trouble with Word Salad English.

  • You can go ahead & tell them:
    # “Taken in the manner” = pregnant…. The thing the cheating wife of Numbers 5 was “not”.

    Is that “not-word-salad” enough for you to understand?

  • No, as I said before, I don’t use my name so that my private posts remain separate from my employer. I have spent most of my adult life with an employer that had a policy concerning employees commenting on sensitive matters that could reflect back on them.

    I don’t hide my posts or use multiple alias. All the posts I have written are available by clicking on SMB11.

    Jesus was obviously referring to living, breathing children.

    Jesus Blesses the Children

    13Then the little children were brought to Jesus for Him to place His hands on them and pray for them; and the disciples rebuked those who brought them. 14But Jesus said, “Let the little children come to Me, and do not hinder them! For the kingdom of heaven” belongs to such as these. 15And after He had placed His hands on them, He went on from there.…

    In the following passage, it is interesting that the miscarriage is not considered an injury, but the husband receives payment for the miscarriage. However, if the woman is injured, that is considered a “further injury” and the life for life penalty comes into play.

    2″If men struggle with each other and strike a woman with child so that she gives birth prematurely, yet there is no injury, he shall surely be fined as the woman’s husband may demand of him, and he shall pay as the judges decide. 23″But if there is any further injury, then you shall appoint as a penalty life for life,…

  • You are the one claiming that the scholars have been debunked. It is your responsibility to tell them.

    Personally, their education and critical thinking skills trump yours.

  • So the Priestly Hierarchy Document(phd) holders lack simple vocabulary & reading comprehension skills via the free from thought atheist academia?… That explains much!

  • A disgrace to all religions is to let this charlatan opine on matters of theology

    Trump believes in Trump – not in anything or anyone else

  • Do you think hillary is a christian or will protect christians or is even willing to stand strong with Israel and Benjamin. You may not all agree with his answer but HE will protect you and country, get jobs back, and get you people some decent health care plan.

  • you don’t even realize what your saying, do you. You use the term so much at many occasions
    that it loses it’s I.D. power. You will know the REAL THE anti-christ when you see him. Trump is not it.

  • You shouldn’t be if you’re a Cristian with understanding and compassion, seeking truth and love through forgiveness and hope

  • Trump, were he actually Christian, had the greatest opportunity in history to answer this question just as Peter did, but because he knew nothing of Peter’s response, he stumbled over this question with a bunch of hooey, we used to say. Trump is surely not a believer in “the Christ, the Son of the living God.” Such a response would have echoed down the centuries for a thousand years as the greatest testimony from a presidential candidate ever.

    But, alas, it is not to be. Trump is a pretender, thinking calling oneself a Christian is a wise political ploy.

  • But Garry, what of the biblical statement that the spirit of antichrist has already gone out into the world?

    Confess it, Garry. You are an old-fashioned premillennial dispensationalist.
    But that kind of nonsense is fast becoming passe’; and rightly so.

  • But Danny, we talk about candidates who are Muslim precisely BECAUSE they are Muslim. Is that acceptable to you? Just because you are an atheist does not mean that the great majority of the people of our nation are.

  • …because to be an Anglican Christian is not to be Christian at all. That denomination abandoned Christ long ago.

  • President Obama and his family were members of the United Church of Christ in Chicago. He is Christian, but his Christianity has been questioned over and over by radical right-wing fundamentalists. Donald Trump says I’m Presbyterian, a protestant, and a Christian. He says he respects Christianity. Questions of religion should not be asked in the political arena.

  • Not sure where the KJV got “taken in the manner” from, but that’s not what the text of the Torah states. It means “and she was not seized,” meaning she was not caught in the act. This is in the context of, “and there was no witness against her.” (Num. 5:13). Alternatively it could mean that she was not raped. This woman may or may not be pregnant to go through the ordeal of bitter waters, at least from the plain meaning of the text.

  • When has Obama done any of the things you are saying? Genuinely curious. I’ve just googled and found instances of him saying good things about Jesus.

  • This is a straight news article, there is no commentary, there is no “point” other than the news it reported.

  • Trump’s favorite Bible verse is from 500 Evangelicals…
    But seriously, his answer to “Who do you say Jesus is?” sounds perfectly in line with some modern mainline Protestant concepts of Jesus. It is consistent with the Power of Positive Thinking theology of Norman Vincent Peale, his former pastor at Marble Collegiate Church in Manhattan, part of the Reformed Church in America, which may or may not be “presbyterian” (still not sure what the exact distinctions are between this and reformed theology).
    So why is it that Trump gets a pass from evangelicals, but the majority of evangelical commenters here and in the media rake over the coals any progressive Christian commenter, or Democrat like Obama or Hillary, who gives a similar answer? The reason is apparent: they know Trump is their only hope to stop Hillary. They can afford to call her or Obama a fake Christian. But with Trump, they have consciously or subconsciously made themselves say, “Well, he’s stated that he holds Jesus in esteem, that’s good, guess it’s up to him and God now.”

  • Walt:
    Please defend your assertion, drawing from the historical record.
    Include in your defense:
    a) Your conception of Jesus
    b) documentation that your conception is the correct one
    c) Anglican documents which explicitly reject that conception.

    We await your reply with great anticipation.
    Don’t disappoint us now, ya’hear?

  • Donald “it’s my own orange hair!” Trump, quoted: “Jesus to me is somebody I can think about for security and confidence. Somebody I can revere in terms of bravery and in terms of courage and, because I consider the Christian religion so important, somebody I can totally rely on in my own mind.”

    Hmm. Sounds as though little Trumpie is describing himself … or perhaps how he envisions himself.

    In that regard he’s little different from many Christians through history. Many have rethought Jesus in a manner that reflects themselves and their own lives. When they do that, of course, they’re being not only inaccurate, but are nearly always anachronistic. But hey, they’re Chrishuns, so I guess they’re entitled … no?

  • I would guess it’s because the vast majority of Christians don’t take their Christianity very seriously, and I say that as a Christian who’s very involved in the church.

  • Sorry. It is not reporting an event; it is making an analysis, with no clear assessment. Go pick some fight about something more important. And please be a Christian about it.

  • Trump said the words “Two Corinthians”. I know that seems small, and to evangelicals it’s something they would just look past, but it’s a huge deal! He completely disqualified himself from any legitimacy of genuine Christian belief with those two words. The evangelical movement in this country has sold out to the political system. They’re more concerned with their “side” winning, than being authentic Christians who live into the mission of Christ in this world. Any evangelical who thinks Trump represents a faith based candidate is lying to themselves and to the world. TWO CORINTHIANS? Are you kidding me?

  • Not sure whether you mean me or the reporter. Neither she nor I are picking a fight, neither she nor I are obligated to make a clear assessment (that’s the reader’s job), and neither she nor I are obligated to “be a Christian” about a single thing.

  • Paul was talking about the warring Roman men, who when conquering areas wound up raping women and men. So, Paul wrote against rape.

    At least no one will confuse you with a bible scholar. Nor will they confuse Trump with one either.

  • Please enlighten me as to who these “evangelicals” are from whom Trump gets a pass? Not the ones that check the “evangelical” box because it’s in the Christian category but not Catholic, but actual, convictional evangelicals.

  • Clinton is a committed Christian? That’s not even laughable. A Methodist, and among Methodism’s fringe, at that, perhaps, but in no sense anything resembling an evangelical Christian.

  • I found this on my Kindle. I haven’t read it yet. I will read it when I am finished with the Coogan book.

    Thanks.

  • In his second answer, Trump three times refers to Jesus as “somebody”. I would think that this would rather rankle most Christians, who see Jesus as a whole lot more than “somebody”. Then he identifies Jesus with bravery and courage, obviously values that Trump considers important, but far from the values that most Christians would identify with Jesus. Wisdom, mercy, caring, forgiving, helping, these come to mind long before bravery and courage. But they are also values that Trump clearly has no time for.

  • How are you a follower of Jesus’ teachings and the example of how he lived his life. Your fruit seems to be rotten at the core. Maybe a little wormy too.

  • Still word salad,

    The test was that if the cheating wife was pregnant, the bitter waters would cause a miscarriage. Since this was a test, it was used repeatedly in that type of situation, not just once. It was sort of like the trial by water during the witch hysteria.

    I am supposed to not believe people who have completed advanced studies in archeology, anthropology, ancient languages, ancient documents and the Bible in favor of believing someone who is a graduate of Word Salad Univ. I don’t think so.

  • Do you have some particular reason for seeking to throw ALL Evangelicals under your particular”bus”, Gsaseeker? And what, exactly, is ” evangelical racism? I await your reply.

  • No one denies that”God is love”,smb11…But the Scriptures don’t in ANY way indicate that love is ALL He is. If you know how,keep Him in balance. Thanks?.

  • Walt Longmire says that Anglicans are not Christian. He writes that they abandoned Christ long ago. He says Danny is an atheist. Danny says he is an Anglican.`

    How is Walt’s behavior like Christ? “By their fruit you will recognize them.” As I said, Walt’s fruit seems a little wormy.

  • If God has all the failings of human beings, He isn’t much of a God. He would be just another power whore.

  • Whoa,dial it back a notch there,smb11!!! I’m not sure what that remark is apropos to,but again the Word of God is very clear: Love is NOT all Almighty God is,unless you and I are not talking about the same God.?—Peace in Christ,always!

  • What other attributes do you attribute to God? If we take the Bible literally, God wiped out almost all of humanity and life on Earth during the flood. God ordered massacres. God promised land to the Hebrews that was already settled by other people. According to the Bible, God is responsible for a great deal of death and misery. Personally, I choose to believe that God is Love and all the rest is a reflection of humanity.

  • The plain meaning of the text is:

    # it be hid from the eyes of her husband,
    and be kept close, and she be defiled, and there be no witness
    against her, neither she be taken with the manner;

    .. Taken in the matter = pregnant

    Okay, I do not really expect those that think fecal encountering gastrointestinal masturbation = sex, or those that think a bloke with a penis is a woman because he won a gold medal at the Olympics & got a boob job, really understand these kinds of things.

  • Only if the expectation is everything must be explicit to be biblical. It is a not much of a leap that if the bible speaks against “spilling seed” than it would also speak against result of that seed being terminated. To say otherwise would be a logical fallacy.

    Your line of thinking equates to, “though shalt not kill” did not include mentally ill, or physically deformed, or x, y, z. Killing is killing.

  • Your education matches the education and training of Biblical scholars?

    Your posts weren’t coherent. You write like Sarah Palin. That is the reason for the comparison.

    Accusing others of their own sins. Typical right wing offensive tactic.

  • My education apparently exceeds that of the “Biblical scholars” that the atheist appeals to as an authority…. How long has Biblical scholars been your authority to appeal to..atheist?

  • Hmm…I get it now,smb11…your “god” is one of your own making,a dichotomous,truncated “god”re-made in YOUR image, one who is your “god” because you can mold him into what you would have him be.If this “god”fails to conform to the kind of “god “YOU would have him be,simple: you’ll simply claim that he is the product of mens’ imagination. So,as I said earlier, we are definitely NOT talking about the same god. I myself have no problem with the idea of Almighty God being sovereign over HIS Creation, unencumbered by the whims,quibbles,and whinings of said creation; I think that the actions He engaged in throughout the Tanakh were to teach us on this side of the Cross that He is not to be trifled with, and irrespective of how you or any other created,finite being thought about the exercise of His Sovereign Will, as He told Israel via the Prophet Isaiah: “My thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways My ways”. And don’t kid yourself: As The Savior Himself made clear…”Whatsoever The Father does,The Son does likewise”…So all that occurred on the other side of The Cross was done by THE TRIUNE GOD,He who…”So loved the world”…At any rate,smb11,I’ll say no more. If on the off chance we ARE talking about the same God,remember this: Yes God is Love,but He DOESN’T love sin.?—Peace.

  • Actually, there is no logic in your argument. God was displeased because Onan did not fulfill his duty to give his dead brother a son.

    “Genesis 38:8Then Judah said to Onan, “Go in to your brother’s wife, and perform your duty as a brother-in-law to her, and raise up offspring for your brother.” 9Onan knew that the offspring would not be his; so when he went in to his brother’s wife, he wasted his seed on the ground in order not to give offspring to his brother. ”

    If there is going to be any “leap” made it is to support Catholic teaching that the only reason to have sex is to have a baby.

    The concept of life beginning at conception is modern, it is not biblical.

    Life begins with the first breath.

    Genesis 2:7

    Then the LORD God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being.

  • I am not an atheist and neither are the biblical scholars I read. I have always looked to learn from well-educated, intelligent people. I started reading history and religious books when I was in the 7th grade. That makes it about 45 years .

    You call me an atheist. I will look to Jesus for guidance. Viper!

  • I believe we get glimpses of God in the Bible. Most of the documents making up the Bible are the writings of men making excuses for bad behavior. If the Bible is truly written by God and inerrant, then He is a power whore. I don’t believe He is.

    A human father who acted as God is portrayed in the Bible would be thrown in jail. God, as revealed in Jesus Christ, preached that the greatest commandment is to love God and the second is to love others as you love yourself. “All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” I read everything in the Bible through this lense.

    I believe God loves all people and that bigotry is a sin. I will take my belief that the true nature of God, as revealed in study and by the Holy Spirit, before God. If I were to practice and teach bigotry and hate, I don’t think I would fare too well before God.

    I thank you for your comments. Even though I think you are “missing the mark,” you, along with the Holy Spirit, help me clarify and solidify my beliefs.

  • James: 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

    ## According to Jesus, He is God’s Word incarnate. Which means all the words in scripture prefaced by “And God said”, “Thus saith The LORD”, etc Is Jesus.

    NewsFlash! Jesus says that homosexual activity is an abomination, an abomination you know is the stench of rotting flesh or feces. Oh hey look! … You have heard it said “love the sinner but hate the sin”… But according to Deuteronomy 22:5 “The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman’s garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.” …There are “some sinners” that are the abomination… Oops! it sounds like The LORD(Jesus) is not so left wing sin-tolerant Himself!

    BTW, perhaps if you spend more time reading “The words of The LORD” found in scripture, rather than “other blokes opinions on The Bible”, or their “copyrighted works of their opinions they call a Bible”, you would gain understanding.

  • Cal Thomas asked Donald Trump who Jesus is?
    He might as well have asked Trump what love is.

    Oh…

  • Yeah, rbag, let’s just help those in need if we happen to feel like it today, and if not, then who cares, no big deal, whatever. How charitable of you. And how charitable of you to blame our U.S. President for your “having” to help the people who most need it. Try rereading smb11’s posts again.

  • Who IS Jesus and who WAS Jesus would be two different questions. Trumps answer of who IS Jesus is a good representation of who Jesus IS to him. It’s a good thing nobody gets asked who is God or what is God because there are no answers to those questions.

  • Being a Christian has nothing to do with knowing the right words. It is about your personal relationship with God and Jesus and how you live your life. So be careful about that piece of wood in your eye and judge not lest ye be judged.

  • Unfortunately racism is not limited to any particular group or demographic or race. For example based on recent political riots there are some Latinos living in the U.S. who hate the country and all those who aren’t Hispanic. BLM is racist against whites and especially white cops. Hatred, racism,bigotry, and Xenophobia are sadly innate to all humans and has been for thousands of years. Almost all humans look for scapegoats and somebody to be superior to which you very nicely demonstrated in your post.

  • He is a fraud. Any actual Christian, especially evangelical, that votes for him or supports him, is willingly choosing a hypocrite and a fraud. If the largest voting bloc was Jewish or Muslim, he’d try to use a few buzzwords to slip by. The religious “values” voters that are now supporting him are clearly turning their back on Jesus’ teachings. And they follow the advice of the extremely rich religious “stars” who have big financial incentives to push him.

  • he has no personal relationship with God. This is the BS that is being spewed to rationalize voting for someone that doesn’t have a religious impulse in his body. The irony is that these same “values” voters who claim they support Jesus’ teachings, have vilified and attacked a President that actually goes to church and lives by the biblical principals.

  • I believe that the mass appeal of evangelical white religion in America is more about exclusivity than Jesus. Watching the crowds going in and out of these churches everywhere, they are middle class white people who think Jesus looks like Kenny Loggins. They will accept Trump as their candidate because they truly care more about keeping people who aren’t “like them” in line.

  • Why? She has been a Christian her entire life. She treats people with kindness. She and her husband have donated millions to charity.. Jesus’ work… but yeah, you’re politicizing your religion. Trump is someone that has homeless vets removed from in front of his building. A man that has been fined for having all-white apartments in NYC. He is married to a woman that poses nude, and had numerous mistresses and treated his wives like garbage. Calls women “pigs” and has attacked John McCain for not being a hero. That is your version of what Jesus would endorse?

  • exactly. It’s like he equated him with a character from a John Wayne move. Brave and courageous… no, he was kind, and compassionate. Trump doesn’t get that.

  • Yes. A woman who has spent her life actually helping children and families. Stop buying the Fox News version of her, and REALLY look at her life. Her own mother was abandoned by her parents and sent cross-country on a train with her little sister, to grandaprents that didn’t want her. She worked in a stranger’s home at 14, and was only allowed to go to high school if she did all the housework first… Hillary’s own mother grew up that way, and it left a lasting impression on her. This is why she worked to get health care for 8 million kids, fought for kid’s rights all over the country in the Children’s Defense Fund. She created programs to help military families, fought to get expanded healthcare for our reservists. But instead, the right is fed these stories about her that are false. And she is called “corrupt” and “evil.” All are just words that are not backed up by the reality of her life. Ironically, the same Christians that follow these mega-preachers who tell you to stay in your marriage even if someone cheats, and work through it.. attack her for staying married.

    Jesus would not support trump

  • Thank you for supplying the context for Trump’s statement. Most of those posting here are displaying the unChristian attitude of judging him for an off-the-cuff statement taken out of context. That said, I am not convinced that Donald Trump is a sincere follower of Christ, based on his treatment of the other candidates in the Primary. Still, he can scarcely be less Christian than Hillary Clinton, given her rabid and continuing support for “Planned (un)Parenthood” and other baby-killers.

  • According to the New York Times, Mrs. Clinton was asked by high school guidance counselor, Jessica Manning if the Ten Commandments mattered to her, and Clinton responded with:

    “Thank you for asking that. I am a person of faith. I am a Christian. I am a Methodist,” Clinton explained. “I have been raised Methodist. I feel very grateful for the instructions and support I received starting in my family but through my church, and I think that any of us who are Christian have a constantly, constant, conversation in our own heads about what we are called to do and how we are asked to do it, and I think it is absolutely appropriate for people to have very strong convictions and also, though, to discuss those with other people of faith.”
    Clinton continued,
    “My study of the Bible, my many conversations with people of faith, has led me to believe the most important commandment is to love the Lord with all your might and to love your neighbor as yourself, and that is what I think we are commanded by Christ to do,” Clinton added. “There is so much more in the Bible about taking care of the poor, visiting the prisoners, taking in the stranger, creating opportunities for others to be lifted up, to find faith themselves that I think there are many different ways of exercising your faith.”
    “But I do believe that in many areas judgment should be left to God, that being more open, tolerant and respectful is part of what makes me humble about my faith,” Clinton asserted. “I am in awe of people who truly turn the other cheek all the time, who can go that extra mile that we are called to go, who keep finding ways to forgive and move on.”

  • “Treats people with kindness???” Tell that to Juanita Brodderick, Paula Jones, Kathleen WIlley, Monica Lewinsky, etc.

  • The Reformed Church is Calvinist. Broadly speaking, that’s Presbyterian (=ruled by elders). Or do you claim that because the “Church of Scotland” does not have the word “Presbyterian” in its title, it is not a Presbyterian denomination? That said, I agree with you about the “cracker” comment and “Two Corinthians.” I would never vote for Trump as pastor. As President, though, whatever his failings he will be better than the alternative – a third term of the thoroughly corrupt Clinton crime family.

  • alfred, i believe that hillary is a politician and she is very good at it. it wasn’t so long ago that she was fiercely opposed to ‘gay marriage’ and to quote her; i believe that marriage is a sacred institution between a man and a woman. now she’s singing a very different song alfred. the truth is NONE of the candidates are real christians. when you are a christian the Holy Spirit dwells in you. hillary says that she is in favor of abortion and gay marriage. if the Holy Spirit was truly dwelling in her she couldn’t bring herself to utter those words. hillary is lying to the american people and is under investigation as we speak by the FBI, so i don’t believe hillary because her actions don’t match her words. this is not to say i’m going to vote for trump but, ilike him in so far as he doesn’t want to enact crazy bathroom laws where there are 30 different gender identifications. we have more important things to do and we don’t need to create problems where they never existed.obama is not a christian because he never would have used his office as a ‘bully pulpit’ to bring gay marriage to this country and light up the white house in the colors of the rainbow to celebrate. obama is not muslim either because a muslim would rather die than accept gay marriage.he has divided this country more than it was during the vietnam war/

  • Since you do not seem to have even a sophomoric understanding of Matthew 7, I won’t spend the time correcting your ridiculous statement. You are like all unbelievers who like to find a text and use it as a pretext for your own purposes. Matthew 7 does NOT teach that it is wrong to judge. It teaches that if you judge another WHILE DOING THE SAME THINGS, you are a hypocrite.

    I, cken, am not one to deny Christ publicly as did Trump.

    And give us a break in this whacky humanistic psychological nonsense about “relationship.” You have been reading Carl Rogers, admit it.

    Confession that Jesus is the Christ is the bottom line of Christianity. Anyone who does not make this confession is an unbeliever and pretender. Trump is one such.

  • Walt, “we” don’t talk about Muslim candidates… perhaps you and Faux News do. Your judgment on Anglican Christianity is pretty laughable, and demonstrates that you know little other than what your preacher is feeding you. The funny thing is that Evangelical Christians used to be the strongest defenders of religious liberty and the separation of church and state. But since they sold out to the American Civil Religion, I guess that’s all out the window. There are a lot of us other kinds of Christians who would look at you and say that you’re an idolater who has substituted the American flag for the cross.

  • And Jesus put you in charge of deciding who is a “real” Christian and who isn’t? Even Jesus said that wheat and weeds would grow together, and that we wouldn’t be able to sort them out by ourselves. So why presume to do so now?

  • What have I said that causes you to think that? Just what do YOU think Christ meant when He said himself, “You are of your father the devil!” to the arrogant Jews. If you want to hear more about the real Jesus, just follow us for a time. I am not preaching the Christ of the modern humanist invention, but the Christ of the Bible, the real Christ.

  • All that, perhaps. But does he believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God? Does he believe in the blood atonement of Christ on the cross for all who believe in Him?

    I don’t think so. To Trump, Jesus was a really nice guy in history.

  • Oops, you messed up, smb11. You accused Redden of being anti-science when in fact it is you liberals who are in denial of science. Gender is a FIXED GENETIC TRAIT, and no amount of surgery, hormone blasts or anything else, let alone “identifying” as another gender will change the scientific fact that gender is a fixed genetic trait. I have been amused by those of you who criticize those who you consider rubes who deny global warming, but that is far more difficult to determine than gender! It is you who are hypocritical, judging others as deniers of science when in fact it is YOU.

  • Jesus would have two things to say to you, I think: 1) Stop bearing false witness against people you don’t know and 2) Here’s a stone…throw it, since you seem to think you’re sinless.

  • …speaking of perversions. There is NO such thing as a transgender person. Had you said intersex, you might have had an argument. But you did not mean intersex, for though there are a minuscule number of those, everyone recognizes them as freaks of nature where some genetic thing went off track.

    No, you are inventing the “transgender” person. There is no such thing. That is some BS by the liberal crowd that is unscientific and unnatural. It, like its cousin homosexuality, is an issue of a screwed up mind, not genetics.

  • He didn’t mean that God had “failing,” nutball. He mean that God is also a God of wrath, a God of vengeance [“My name in Vengeance,” He said]. He is a God of justice, of righteous anger and of judgment to come. And God is all those things perfectly. He is not man but Spirit. The Second person, Jesus Christ, is both man and God at the same time, which is exactly why he can die for others; He has no sin and thus qualified as the perfect sacrifice, “without spot.”

    You are thinking far to much like a mere human. You cannot seem to grasp the nature of God.

  • Okay, I apologize for my comment to you before. I did not know you were a 7 year old child. Please forgive me.

    Your conception of God is a maudlin caricature, not anything real or Biblical. You have created your own God, and he is not the God of the Bible.

  • Good response, Ringo. You have more patience than I at the moment. I will get it together another day, but today these unbelievers are getting under my skin.

  • And yet there is more in the Bible about hell than about heaven! Are we all reading the same book? I think we might be CLAIMING to read it, but some of you are dismally ignorant of what it teaches, as is Clinton. She uses religion as a political ploy to win friends — and votes. Then she spends her life bearing false witness. As I recall, God does not approve.

  • you’re referring to the parable of the weeds where the enemy sowed weeds in with the crop and they were instructed to let them grow together until harvest time. the weeds are the evil ones. you’re applying this out of context. we are commanded to ‘test the spirits’ not eveyone who calls themselves a shepherd is godly (according to Jesus). who are you…the accuser of the brethren? are you in favor of gay marriage and abortion? Jesus had the bible quoted to him by satan and He saw through it right away because the devil misquoted it and misapplied it and tried to get Jesus to respond in a way that he wanted.let’s get back to the parable you quoted. the angels are the harvesters and will weed out all who promote evil and throw the weeds into the fire and the good crop (his true children) into the barn (the Kingdom of God).the Holy Spirit is with me so who is it that will speak against me?

  • This Christian, born from above and sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, will NOT vote for Hillary in any case. It is a difficult time for Christian voters in America, and each one of us must come to some decision if we are to participate in the political process, a thing that I think is the responsibility of the Christian, actually.

    But what choice? If it turns out to be between Hillary and Trump, we are in deep stuff, I am afraid. Both are big time losers, and it would be difficult for me personally to support either one of them with anything but a begrudging vote between two evils.

    So here is my thinking. Hillary represents the entrenched liberal non-Christian element, accepting every perversion from homosexuality to aborting fetuses — and that with a flourish of her hand and a call to some kind of “rights” of women to kill their own children. But Hillary has thought this through and revealed it when she said, “Persons in the womb have no Constitutional rights,” much to the chagrin of the abortionists, who deny that babies in the womb are persons. But Hillary does and somehow justifies the murder of such persons by some appeal to “rights of women.”

    So, I can’t in any good conscience vote for a godless person like that.

    Well, you say, Trump is godless, too. I believe you are right. He cannot even give a right answer about anything to do with the faith at all. But he is against abortion and homosexuality with all its attendant perversions.

    But look what he has done to the Republican party! He has, in one campaign season, deconstructed something that was so entrenched that it had remained in place for more than 100 years! He did what the Tea Party wanted to do but could not get done.

    So, I will vote for Trump, in the hopes that his Attila the Hun approach will do the same to the entrenched establishment of both parties ih Washington, a thing I deem good. This “government” has not been functioning now for about ten years. It is not to be saved. Thus it has to come down completely, and Trump is just the bulldozer to get that job done. It may be a mess, but it is a necessary mess that comes short of armed rebellion, a thing I loathe.

    So, you go, The Donald!

  • Thanks,Walt…I’ll pray that you gain the patience you need to deal with the foolishly misinformed,LOL!?–At any rate,I’ve been,and still am,a student of Biblical Theology and History for over 25 years now,and a Born-Again,Spirit-Filled Child of God since 1976,so there’s not a whole lot about the Christian Faith that I don’t know,so by the Grace of Almighty God I’m well- equipped to deal with pseudo-theological dilettantes like smb11.God bless you,Bro.Walt,and remember: Our Savior died for the likes of smb11,so pray for him(her?),O.
    K.?—PEACE IN CHRIST, ALWAYS!?.

  • you accuse me of bearing false witness? the best defense to someone accusing you of that is ‘truth’. anyone who engages in homosexuality or promotes it is a pervert (according to God) i never said i was sinless but i don’t want my sins honored and to be rewarded for them like our society does . so, you have twice falsely accused me. you’re doing what you’re accusing me of. i never stated that any man is sinless.

  • i agree walt. i can’t abide in sin being made ‘honorable’ and that’s what we will get. we as christians have been given a gift that our brothers didn’t have 2000 years ago and that gift is the right to VOTE. obama is not a king and he has made perversion a celebration and lit the white house up in the colors of the rainbow. back in biblical times they couldn’t vote but we can. some people say it’s unchristian to vote but, i disagree.

  • I call such persons the “See Dick run, see Jane jump” sort of persons, those who are so dull of mind that the only thing that will satisfy them is to see somewhere that “Thou shalt not commit abortion.” But you shall not murder is all we need, and only dullards cannot see the obvious connection.

  • Neither Adam or Eve were infants. That was true only of original creation of man. From that point forward, all were born by natural means — except one, of course, who was conceived supernaturally but born naturally, that man Jesus Christ.

  • It was the life of the baby that was “injured” which required “life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth.” You are totally wrong on this point. You are twisting the Scriptures just the same way that Satan did when he attempted to tempt Jesus.

  • In our day, the claim to being a “biblical scholar” is, as the saying goes, a dime a dozen. Those with even a modicum of spiritual discernment know the difference.

  • The Bible is contradictory. We occasionally get glimpses of God. Most of the writing in the Bible are men’s stores justifying their bad behavior. It doesn’t tell one story.

    This is the real Christ.

    36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”

    37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’[a] 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[b] 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

    I read everything in the Bible through this lense. I consider everyone’s posts through this lense. What in your online behavior demonstrates that you follow this?

    Your online behavior is the opposite of this.

  • Why not bring up Gene Robinson?

    In the words of Jesus

    Matthew 23:

    “27Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside, but on the inside are full of dead men’s bones and every impurity. 28In the same way, you appear to be righteous on the outside, but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness. “

  • What do you think He meant with those statements? Try to remember to whom He was speaking at the time. His comment is a summary, not a detailed instruction.

    To whom was he speaking and why did they need this instruction? What rules/laws/statutes were they trusting in for righteousness? After this statement, what do you think they thought of Him?

  • I am not sure the number of genders is 30, but it is definitely more than 2. Just looking at chromosomes, there are the usual XX (female) and XY (male). But there are also other combinations, such as XXY; XYY; XXXX; XXYY; 49,XXXXX; 49,XXXXY; 47XXY; and 45,X. On top of that there is gonadal dsygenesis, congenital adrenal hyperplasia (leaving some children with both male and female sex organs), and progestin-induced virilisation (making XX people appear male), just to name a few conditions. For a partial list, see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disorders_of_sex_development

  • Ignorance is no defense. “Because I say so!” isn’t scientific evidence. You don’t know Jesus and you don’t know science.

  • Is this post meant to be serious, or are you attempting a parody at a Trump supporter? If the latter, great job!

  • Trump is clearly not against homosexuality. He has made mild opposition to same-sex marriage part of his campaign, but he is the most pro-gay Republican presidential candidate in recent history. He has also flipped on abortion for purely political purposes, and will flip back if he feels it is necessary.

    What the evangelicals do not understand about Trump is that like most authoritarians he does not care at all about your religious impulses or desires. He cares about them to the extent it can help him get elected. He will toss everything else aside the instant it becomes an impediment to maintaining power.

    Trouble is, while his supporters deserve him, the rest of us do not.

  • So says the scientifically illiterate. You are as qualified to inform us about science as you are about Jesus.

  • The Bible is replete with stories written by men to justify their bad behavior. If God can hate, if God can be a bigot, then so can I.

  • So, you think the greatest commandments only apply to some people and not others?

    Only some people need to take the plank out of their eye?

    Jesus gives you a get out of jail free card?

    I don’t think that is what Jesus had in mind.

  • If you claim to be a biblical scholar, you are one of the dime a dozen.

    People who have graduated with PhDs from universities and theological seminaries, having studied the texts of the bible in their original languages, having studied the changes in the texts through time, having studied the mistranslation of the bible, having studied the cultural anthropology and archeology of the biblical area, and are continuing their professional studies, these ARE biblical scholars.

    Your “spiritual discernment” sounds more like an excuse to forgive yourself from applying Jesus’ teaching to yourself.

    My “spiritual discernment” tells me that Jesus was speaking to all of us about the greatest commandments, but that he had you in mind when he called out “Viper!”

  • No. The husband was paid for the miscarriage. If further damage was done, i.e., damage to the woman, that is where the eye for eye came into effect.

    Exodus 21:22

    Note that the husband gets to set the amount for compensation of the lost pregnancy.

    “”Now suppose two men are fighting, and in the process they accidentally strike a pregnant woman so she gives birth prematurely. If no further injury results, the man who struck the woman must pay the amount of compensation the woman’s husband demands and the judges approve.”

    The miscarriage has already happened and the husband has been compensated for the lost pregnancy. But if there is further injury beyond the lost pregnancy, (i.e., damage to the woman) then the penalty life for life… comes into play.

    Exodus 21:23-24

    23″But if there is any further injury, then you shall appoint as a penalty life for life, 24eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise.

    This is one passage that doesn’t take a biblical scholar to explain. Unfortunately, you don’t seem to be honest enough to admit what this passage means and you hide behind Satan.

  • I follow Jesus, God and the Holy Spirit. People are fallable. I do not see Jesus in your posts at all. I see wormy fruit.

  • God, as presented in the Bible, is the creation of the Bible writers. No one knows God in His entirety.

    The Bible puts God in a box only to be taken out when He is needed to justify massacres, genocide and condemning non-Israelites.

    God has shown himself to people in a way they can understand. What inspires people to do good, to be loving, to take care of one another and His creation comes from God. Unfortunately, often He has been used as excuse for bad behavior.

    Considering that your posts show that you refuse to follow Jesus’ most important and most basic teaching (the greatest commandments), your conception of an ugly God is a reflection of you.

    Wormy fruit, Walt.

  • Your knowledge of scripture is on par with your knowledge of English Composition.

    I am not persuaded.

  • You are not implying that Obama is any kind of a Christian, are you?? I sure hope not…Anyone who supports child slaughter/abortion and gay marriage is no real Christian, not even close to be honest…

  • You don’t know if he has a personal relationship with God or not.
    What does going to church have to do with your relationship with God? Answer – nothing. Everyone who goes to church is a sinner. Many life a less Christ like life than some atheists.

  • Most Christians are are fairly foggy and ignorant of Christian theology. The are just going along with a group, and relying on what they are told – plus a bit of Bible reading, if they are Protestant.
    “Three gods in one, four gods in one – just tell me how many gods in one there are, so we can go out and play” Alfred Loisy (on the attitude of his young convent school students)

  • Christianity is not based on words, but on relationship with Jesus our Lord and Savior! Christians should know that He is the Judge, Ruler of all, and so we must not judge others. No one could cast a stone at the harlot, because they too had sinned. No man has gone without sin, and no sin is greater than another. Therefore, we are all equal sinners. As christians, we are responsible for the blood of those we don’t share the Word Of God with, therefore share The Gospel, and let Gods light shine through. God has plans that will not harm us, but give us eternal life with Him! So please, do not judge! That is God’s decision. For it is by His Grace that we are saved! Thank you Father for sending Your Son, Jesus Christ down to Earth and to the cross, so that we may be forgiven! AMEN!

  • Just psychological and historic facts. No parody intended and it has nothing to do with politics.

  • What would you identify as an after-market Presbyterian? The kind that hold fast to the Presbyterian heritage of fidelity to the Scriptures, or the kind that decided to derail into going along with whatever was deemed culturally “appropriate,” or pleasing to worldliness?
    Asking as a Reformed Baptist- thus, while I’m familiar with the doctrines of the major denominations carrying the term “Presbyterian” in their name, and most their associated theological intricacies, I’m not as acquainted with some of the internal lingo.

  • So… how exactly does that fit with her complete and utter devaluation of human life, her hostility toward honesty, her refusal to outrightly and unconditionally condemn sexual assault, and her opposition to God’s designs in creation? I know that much about her, and that’s kind of very much at odds with being a new creation, a regenerate believer in Christ.

  • I didn’t say a word about LGBT issues, but it’s nice to know who the obsessed people are.
    The verse we’re talking about reads “v’hee lo nitpasha.” This verb, pay-shin, is a common Hebrew word in the OT. For example, Deut. 22:29, the law stating that the rapist of certain young women must pay her father 50 shekels and irrevocably marry her, similarly reads, “utfasha v’shachav ema,” he seizes and lies with her. It has nothing to do with pregnancy. Even your reading of the dilatory KJV is incredibly daft.

  • Some have stood up to Trump and that’s admirable. The majority seem, like Mike Huckabee, to feel what I said: Trump’s their only hope.

  • I compare the situation to deciding between playing Russian roulette with a fully-loaded revolver versus one with one empty chamber, Hillary being the fully-loaded one.

  • You will need to show me examples of Clinton using her faith as a political ploy to win supporters. Oh the irony Walter. Bear false witness much? And as far as your wagging finger calling her in as many words a liar. That’s been debunked. Is she a saint? What does Jesus say about man? No not one is without sin. Accept Jesus and all sins are forgiven.

  • I think you over spoke this statement…think about it…one’s belief is personal emotions of the heart and mind! Who are you to spell out how anyone should react to their own personal beliefs. I have been a Christian since age 13, I am now 67 years old and sometimes for me its hard to define who Christ is. To make this simple, Christ is God came earth in the flesh to show us all how to live and serve God and to be ready when he comes for his church as warriors…God is not a limp wrist namby pamby God and it will take a Warrior like Trump to get America back! I pray God Blesses America again with Trump to lead us!!! Sounds to me you have made yourself to be the ultimate Judge of who Trump is…you are not! God is!

  • First of all…no where in the US Constitution does it say someone running for President of the US must be Christian!!! It does however state must be born on American soil…something you Libtard DemoRATS failed at when it Came to the Kenyan Muslim in office…which in 1952 it became law here in the USA no muslims!!! So Walt Longmire you talk out of both sides of your face!!!

  • Well, Mimi, your response here is far more revealing about the validity of YOUR faith than you can know. The faith of Christ is NOT one’s “personal” belief; it is a divinely enabled gift from God. Only those empowered of God in the new birth can exercise saving faith.

    When you say Christ came to the earth to “show us how to live” is about as secular a notion as I have seen lately. He came to redeem His own, and said so. His incarnation is about redemption, not how to live.

    No where do you profess faith in Jesus Christ and His death and resurrection; nowhere did you mention repentance from sin. Both these are essential element to saving faith. To have Christ as simply a model for living is not to have Christ at all.

    And who said that God was a limp-wrist namby pamby? He will judge the world in righteousness, destroy the heavens and the earth and create a new heaven and earth. That is not weak, dearie. But He also is no bloviating ignoramus, as Trump is.

    I have made no judgments at all. The ones made are those made by God in His Word. Read that, which you seem not to have done. You have created a god in your own image. Turn to the God of the Bible, who has a name: Jesus Christ, and trust Him not for Trump, but for salvation from your sins.

  • Walt you are not only a fattened tard you unlike trump and jesus.. you call evil good and good evil. Immigration? Escaping the evils in life are one thing, but on the other side you have crime like never seen in America’s history on our border! So you calling rape trees, human sex trades including children and missing american people.. evils.. unspoken evil slipping across our border less important then immagration.. Crooked Hilary who is only equal in polls to trump is because illegals & criminals are voting.. are going before God one day like you.. you evil man.. and you will be held accountable for ever little girl that is raped and sold when you say trumps evil for stopping these evils.. may their blood be on you and hilaries head.. In hell..

  • Who is Jesus has everything to do with the answer Peter gave when our lord and savior asked him, the bible tells us clearly that we must acknowledge he came down in flesh even though he was God the son of the most living God, however, Trump answered the question as though he was asked who is Jesus Christ to him.
    we cannot separate our live styles with our knowledge of Christ and and his work of redemption, Just as the disciples became like him even in character because they had been with him, i think we miss the point if we emphasize on the salvation and forget about the works, he has redeemed us for, good works, as we continues in relationship with him through his Spirit that now dwells in his children.May God help America vote rightly, don’t miss it in this election choose truth

  • All I know is when I see a grown man making fun and mocking a someones crippled handicapped hands in front of millions of people….for laughs, I cant trust my families future in the hands of someone with that little of empathy. He has shown no guilt for doing that..no apologies..just the same way he handles the other things. He just lied about it like he does everything. He has shown us what is in his heart. I know what Christ came and taught us. I will rely on FAITH in God before I take the Trump stamp. I feel like I am being led by many Christians to vote for him against the very core of my being. Im a learning Christian. I still have not heard from anyone why we lower our faith to support an unrepenting man of the crudest nature? For material wealth? For fear not FAITH in the God? God help us all.
    I dont care if he doesnt read or know much about the Bible…he cant even be honest about that.

  • I did not judge this person. In order to know what in the world you are talking about, you will have to give me your working definition of “judging.” Her words judged her, in accordance with Scripture: “…and by your words you shall be judged.

    You snowflakes get a little uncomfortable when someone tells the truth. I don’t think this person is a Christian at all, except in the common usage of that term by moderns, which to them means conservative Republican. She may be that kind of “Christian,” but that is not a biblical Christian at all.

    I called no one a fool. That is your own judgment, speaking of judgments. And she is not my brother in any biblical sense.

    Think before you speak, guy.

  • Oh, so it is YOU who decides what words mean. Sorry, I did not know that you had that authority from God. This person listed NONE of the beliefs that are central to the Christian faith, and indeed revealed that she knows little about what salvation in Christ even is. No, one need not set forth a statement of doctrine when they write, but if you are claiming to be a Christian and cannot even list any of the core elements of the Gospel and reduce the faith to a place where Christ is just a personal “model” for us, that is NOT Christianity.

    And you, contradicting yourself, believing in your own mind that I have insulted someone, turn and judge me! An interesting contradiction if ever I saw one.

    What Christianity does NOT need in this hour are Christians like you [I have no reason to think you are not, but keep talking and I will be better able to judge — oops – discern whether or not you are] who fold and run when you meet any resistance or someone who differs from you. I think that is what was trying to describe when she used the phrase “namby pamby.”

    If we are to be faithful to the Gospel, we must confront the unbeliever with the truth, even it is “insulting” to them. To not do this is to do nothing, really, just pretending to engage the world with the truth of the Gospel.

    May the Lord grant you insight into this needful action so direly needed today when the faith is being mocked and spat upon.

  • Read more of what he says… not what other people think. For years he has confessed Christ… he is required to uphold the Constitution , he has no choice.
    On the abortion and gay rights… those are personal decisions and choices. I have followed Christ for 50 years and dont find any time when He treated a sinner the way “Christians” do now. We put all sins on our own point system and as long as our total is less than their total, we feel we can judge.
    “For ALL have sined and come short of the glory of God.” “There is none righteous, no not one.”
    How dare we, the church, sit in judgment when our robes are filthy.

  • Trump did not confess that Jesus is God’s son…you are not a Christian if you do not believe Jesus is the son of God.

  • What I was taught in Sunday School is to see how each person measures up to the word of God. I know that nobody is perfect so I’m not looking for perfection. I’m hoping that someone will compare the candidates to the Word of God, it would be very interesting to see how they hold up against The Ten Commandments.

  • When I was ten my best friend was raped by her grandfather and got pregnant.
    Her parents were told that the fetus was abnormal and if she carried it to term she had a 85% chance of dying and the child had a slim chance of surviving but since they were “Christians” the parents wouldn’t allow an abortion and at thirty weeks my friend went into labor and died giving birth to a brain dead girl who died when taken off of life support shortly thereafter…….

    Who are you to profess to know God’s mind? How do you know what He judges when He has changed His mind on many things? He got a minor pregnant then killed His own son for the greater good……. Had it have been me, everyone would’ve gone straight to hell because I wouldn’t have let my son die!

  • DONT FORGET SEPTEMBER IS PERSECUTE A CHRISTIAN MONTH IN THE USA AND IT HAS BEEN EXTENDED THRU OCTOBER ,THATS RIGHT WE CAN NOW PERSECUTE THEM ANOTHER MONTH,,,NON-VIOLENT PERSECUTIONS ONLY…THE BAPTISTS ARE THE WORST

  • What we see is an illusion. What is unseen is reality. Were Osiris, Mithra, Aristotle, and Plato also bogus. If they are not explain why they aren’t bogus and Jesus is. All of them advanced philosophical/theological concepts for what has become the Christian Bible.

  • cken, you have no idea what you are talking about. You are trying hard to speak Christianeze but clueless. As far as your Matthew 7:1 card you played, you know the ‘judge not lest ye be judged’? Well take not scripture out of context lest ye be like Satan. Matthew chapter 7 is not about NOT judging. It’s about judging righteously and not hypocritically. Read all of chapter 7, you left out the you will know them by their fruits? Trump is not a Christian. He does not bear the fruit of a Christian when he said he didn’t need God’s forgiveness. Funny, you judged Walt hypocritically by using Matthew 7 on him when he judged righteously making you “Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.” I realize you will defend your opinion over God’s word so I suggest you read chapter 7 in context before throwing it out there, use a commentary or something and read further down about that wide gate to destruction and narrow path to eternal life that few find.

  • Yes, we do know if he has a personal relationship with Jesus, cken, because he told us in his words:

    “Jesus to me is somebody I can think about for security and confidence. Somebody I can revere in terms of bravery and in terms of courage and, because I consider the Christian religion so important, somebody I can totally rely on in my own mind.” – Trump when asked who Jesus was to him.

    That’s not a relationship, that’s idol worship. He created his image of Jesus in his own mind.

  • How hard is it to say Jesus is Savior? You gonna take that mark from Trump too when he adjusts Obamacare? God shows us how to judge false converts… and FYI everything you type is a judgment. You just judged Walt in the way cken did making yourself a hypocrite too.

  • Firework you just judged Walt. See how that works? Everything we write is a judgment on something. And you took Matthew 5:22 out of context because calling out a phoney Christian like Trump isn’t being angry at a brother. Its judging the way Matthew 7 shows to judge… you will know them by their fruits.

  • Firework, For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith. – Romans 12:3

  • So if in my heart and mind I rely on God that is idol worship. Personally i think if you can’t rely on Jesus, God, and the HS then I am in big dodo.

  • So in other words If somebody doesn’t regurgitate the correct biblical Christian verbiage then you can “righteously judge” them as being non-Christian. Since we have all sinned who among us is righteous enough to judge others.

  • cken, I’ll let you argue with yourself on your own word choice. I’ll check back to any response to what I actually said. However, if you do ‘revere Christ’s bravery and courage because the Christian religion is so import for you to rely on in your own mind’ then yeah… kind of makes you a big dodo… an idolizing dodo.

  • cken, looks like you playing word choice again. Matthew 7 tells us how not to judge, hypocritically. What problem do you have with that? The fact you you did by taking it out of context? Jesus confirms that in John 7:24 “Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.” If you have a problem with God telling Christians to judge righteously then you have a problem with the authority of Christ. Jesus tells us how to spot a false converts. Paul tells us too. Pick it up and read it. You are defending your opinion over the Word of God!

  • My point is who among us can remove the beam from thy brothers eye. We are all hypocrites lacking the righteousness to judge.
    The problem with commentaries is they are just another persons opinion. You just go through a few until you find one you agree with.

  • Jesus,

    I pray that you will help our world , you will humble me and the rest of this world and allow us to know your peace, your love and your grace and mercy as we try to make the right decisions by the prompting of your Holy Spirit. Please bring us to our knees and help us to pray.

    In Jesus Name

    Amen

    “If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land.” 2 Chronicles 7:14

  • I am so sorry this happened to your friend and her family. Prayers are with you folks. I think it’s easy for a lot of us to get full of ourselves and make generalizing comments. I don’t think that’s what Mike Feehan intended, but people seem to think there’s a black and white answer to everything. In some things there really is — such as the Gospel truth. But in this case, I have to agree with you and know there is not always a “black and white” answer for cases such as this. You’re totally right; God alone shall judge. And what you said is the amazing mystery of God’s abounding love — how Jesus the Son was conceived by the Holy Spirit and at the end of his perfect, innocent life was spat upon and beaten mercilessly until he finally breathed his last crying breath saying “Father, forgive them for they know not what they do.” He still loved and cared more for us wretched sinners than for Himself even then. He took on all of every wickedness on himself, becoming sin and paying the price for it so we can be without sin and have a relationship with him forever. Sorry for the length of this comment. But, while I am very fortunate that this didn’t happen to my friend or someone in my family, I can understand enough to know I would be thinking that I would have made the same decision: everyone goes straight to Hell. Thank goodness I’m not God, haha. But seriously, I’m sorry about that awful tragedy that took place. God bless your day! (:

  • Although a bit late but you are right on the money Walt. This was a huge red flag to anyone supporting trump. You can not declare yourself a Christian and NOT know the answer to this question. Then, to declare yourself sinless, that should have drove that red flag home. Anyone calling themselves a Christian and following this false prophet, is taking a big chance with their soul. How do they answer a big question during judgement “Why did you support someone who denied me”??? There are big challenges coming to Christians and the Lord will be testing us, i’m afraid that quite a lot of them failed this one.

  • Behold that firework did not confess that Jesus is the Son of God, but instead only preached his own imagined doctrine that a person need not always confess that Jesus is the Son of God…

    Let no man deceive you by any means (2 Thess. 2:3)

    For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. (2 John 7)

    Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. (1 John 4:15)

    Praise be to the name of Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God

  • every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God (1 John 4:3)
    ^
    firework: “you have managed to judge where someone’s relationship to Christ is because they did not mention specific words in their comment”
    .
    .
    Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. (1 John 4:15)
    ^
    firework: “Wow….really? Jesus is Lord…you happy?”
    .
    .
    this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another (1 John 3:23)

    Praise be to the name of God’s Son Jesus Christ, who shed his blood and died for our sins, was buried, and rose again the third day

  • firework: “This servant can vouch for surrendering [partners, children, friends, food, water, shelter and even own life] for the love of their God…can you?”
    ^
    He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory (John 7:18)

    Let another man praise thee, and not thine own mouth (Prov. 27:2)

    Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them (Matt. 6:1)

    all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags (Isa. 64:6)

    ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. (Gal. 3:26)
    .
    .
    firework: “how well do you carry that cross?”
    ^
    I have told you already, and ye did not hear: wherefore would ye hear it again? (John 9:27)

    Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe (Rom. 3:22)
    .
    .
    firework: “Do you think throwing scripture at people to attack and disprove their standing in Christ is what He would want?”
    ^
    Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine. (2 Tim. 4:2)

    because many false prophets are gone out into the world. (1 John 4:1)

    My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge (Hos. 4:6)
    .
    .
    every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God (1 John 4:3)
    ^
    firework: “Do you think it is honest to use scripture in such twisted ways?”
    ^
    the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine (2 Tim. 4:3)
    .
    .
    firework: “a servant of God does NOT have to say Jesus is the Son of God….everytime that they post something…it is ludacris.”
    ^
    You did not confess that Jesus is the Son of God until your 4th post, after it was pointed out to you. And then you did so begrudgingly and mockingly (i.e. firework: “Wow….really? Jesus is Lord…you happy?”).

    And you actually did not confess that Jesus is the Son of God until your 5th post. In your 4th post, you referred to Jesus by many capitalized titles (some of which you invented such as “Good Shepherd” and “Love” in caps) including “Son of God”, but not “the Son of God”.
    .
    .
    firework: “A couple praise words will not save you…This servant can vouch for surrendering [partners, children, friends, food, water, shelter and even own life] for the love of their God…can you?”
    ^
    Let no man deceive you (2 Thess. 2:3)

    That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. (Rom. 10:9)

    For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. (Eph. 2:8-9)

    These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. (1 John 5:13)

    Blessed be the name of God’s Son Jesus Christ

  • What big question about Jesus is a secret. The boarders of this country have nothing to do with any faith. Remember give unto Cesar what is Cesar’s, and Give unto god what belong to him the most high. How does that address illegal immigration. The law and Authority on Earth is Earth’s That does no mean god will not intercede. The quote is very nice but it does not address the impact on the US. If Jesus wanted it would be manifested. Church really has no place in government. Jesis loved the people, and for that matter never had a church even after he ascended. Like John 1o:15, and 10:16. You know that the Native Americans new God threw Jesus be Europeans came. .As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my
    life for the sheep. And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold:
    them.

    Knowing Jesus is easy, but you have to understand that the middle East was not the only place he preached.

  • firework: “Will leave this up for edifying…”
    ^
    But I suffer not a woman to teach (1 Tim. 2:12)
    ,
    .
    firework: “leaving the internet world of Christianity”
    ^
    Let the lying lips be put to silence (Ps. 31:18)

    Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. (1 Tim. 2:11)

    The tongue of the wise useth knowledge aright: but the mouth of fools poureth out foolishness. (Prov. 15:2)

    Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the Lord, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon. (Isa. 55:7)
    .
    .
    Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. (1 John 4:15)

    And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God (1 John 4:3)
    ^
    firework: “do not dispute over little things only to lose focus on what truly matters…What one speaks can say much about their faith without these exact words”
    ^
    A foolish woman is clamorous: she is simple, and knoweth nothing. For she sitteth at the door of her house, on a seat in the high places of the city, To call passengers who go right on their ways (Prov. 9:13-15)
    .
    .
    firework: “never would mock Christ”
    ^
    The will of Jesus is for man to believe on, call upon, and confess before others the name of his Son Jesus Christ, which commandment you diminish, mock and pervert…

    this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another (1 John 3:23)
    ^
    firework: “Wow….really? Jesus is Lord…you happy?…You are Twisting this to mean one must always proclaim exact words everywhere they go…you seem to be a literalist and are overlooking deeper meanings…What one speaks can say much about their faith without these exact words”
    ^
    Behold, I am against them that prophesy false dreams, saith the Lord, and do tell them, and cause my people to err by their lies, and by their lightness (Jer. 23:32)
    .
    .
    firework: “The Good Shepherd and Love are NOT made up names for God…He has many names”
    ^
    I suffer not a woman to teach (1 Tim. 2:12)

    Neither “The Good Shepherd” nor “Love” are Jesus’s names. Jesus reveals that he is the good shepherd and love, but commands us to believe only on the name of his Son Jesus Christ and not any other name (Acts 4:12).
    .
    .
    firework: “[I] do WHATEVER He asks of me no matter how difficult”
    ^
    this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another (1 John 3:23)
    ^
    firework: “Wow….really? Jesus is Lord…you happy?”
    ^
    why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say? (Luke 6:46)
    ^
    firework: “you seem to be a literalist and are overlooking deeper meanings”
    ^
    behold, ye walk every one after the imagination of his evil heart, that they may not hearken unto me (Jer. 16:12)
    .
    .
    firework: “You hurt me deeply with your [preaching of scripture]…the way you project Him…His words are for edifying and building up His people NOT breaking them”
    ^
    Is not my word like as a fire? saith the Lord; and like a hammer that breaketh the rock in pieces? (Jer. 23:29)

    the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. (Heb. 4:12)

    rebuke a wise man, and he will love thee. (Prov. 9:8)

    He that getteth wisdom loveth his own soul (Prov. 19:8)

    but fools despise wisdom and instruction. (Prov. 1:7)

    For every one that doeth evil hateth the light (John 3:20)
    .
    .
    many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. (2 John 7)
    ^
    firework: “using His beautiful and uplifting words to call me things like antichrist”
    ^
    I did not call you anything. I posted 2 John 7, and you are offended by the inspired word of Jesus…

    For every one that doeth evil hateth the light (John 3:20)
    .
    .
    firework: “I know people that hate Jesus because of how people present Him with so much unrighteous judgement, hatred and haughtiness. They believe He is like His ‘followers’.”
    ^
    Jesus is the Word of God (in the King James Bible) made flesh…

    The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether. (Ps. 19:9)

    Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. (John 3:3)

    whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my words, of him shall the Son of man be ashamed (Luke 9:26)

    He that believeth on him is not condemned (John 3:18)

    but he that believeth not shall be damned. (Mark 16:16)

    the wrath of God abideth on him. (John 3:36)

    because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. (John 3:18)

    And these shall go away into everlasting punishment (Matt. 25:46)
    ^
    firework: “A true follower speaks truth and is generally hated for it”
    .
    .
    Blessed be the name of Jesus Christ, the Son of God

    this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another (1 John 3:23)

    Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it (Deut. 4:2)

    He that refuseth instruction despiseth his own soul: but he that heareth reproof getteth understanding. (Prov. 15:32)

  • Your post is notably devoid of the name of God’s Son Jesus Christ.

    Instead of hearing reproof and receiving correction, you deleted your comments and then reposted only some of them (4 days later) in craftiness to confuse others and bear false witness by concealing all that you actually wrote…

    Such is the way of an adulterous woman; she eateth, and wipeth her mouth, and saith, I have done no wickedness. (Prov. 30:20)
    .
    .
    You simply claim you did not mean what you said, scripture does not mean what scripture says (and you refer to the preaching of scripture as “my message” and “squabbling and hen picking”), and your own private imaginations should instead be regarded for doctrine…

    For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple. (Rom. 16:18)

    The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that hearkeneth unto counsel is wise. (Prov. 12:15)

    Praise be to the name of Jesus Christ, the Son of God

  • no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost. (1 Cor. 12:3)
    ^
    firework: “‘Jesus is Lord’…just saying this means nothing”
    ^
    A foolish woman is clamorous: she is simple, and knoweth nothing. (Prov. 9:13)
    .
    .
    Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. (1 John 4:15)
    ^
    firework: “must be walked to mean anything…not just have to say it….live it.”
    ^
    they speak a vision of their own heart, and not out of the mouth of the Lord. (Jer. 23:16)

    yea, they are prophets of the deceit of their own heart (Jer. 23:26)
    .
    .
    firework: “even demons can say ‘Jesus is Lord’ or ‘Jesus is the Son of God'”
    ^
    try the spirits whether they are of God (1 John 4:1)

    this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another (1 John 3:23)

    He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar (1 John 2:4)

    hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. (1 John 2:3)

    Blessed be the name of God’s Son Jesus Christ

  • It is not about judging Trump, yet, anyone who personally proclaims Jesus as LORD and SAVIOR MUST ALSO PROCLAIM HIS NAME. Jesus said that even the stones. if they spoke would shout HIS Name. Jesus said if we are ashamed of HIM He would be ashamed of US. There is no other NAME GIVEN by which we are saved. There is NO other NAME authorized by JESUS HIMSELF to GO TO THE FATHER.

  • However can we not see that TRUMP is close enough to the truth that our prayers can bring him all the way to the truth. I also believe the holy spirit has a plan to bring TRUMP all the way to a born again experience,. Surely all the prayers of the saints of the most high GOD can accomplish this. We must not be cynical and unbelieving when it comes to TRUMP. I am remind that JESUS said they that are not against us are for us and CHRIST can definitely work with that. Can we not let love convince us that our prayers and support for a man who is not against the christian community just also may be a man the holy spirit can bring all the way unto himself through the prayers of the saint. Men are brought to Christ in such ways as this.JESUS took his time with Nicodemus who did not understand the born again experience but he only understood religion. i am convinced that TRUMP is a Nicodemus waiting in the wings….. possibly for a man just like yourself who sees he doesn’t get it but can get it …… when the teachable moment we pray for as corporate body comes to meet TRUMP in that hour. I believe TRUMP has the same appointment with Christ that NICODEMUS had.

  • Although your very correct we can lose the greater agenda of CHRIST by being right in our correction of others that are missing the truth while avoiding teaching them a greater truth. I have no problem whatsoever with what your saying Monanny . Its what is not being said that makes a correct rebuke but also a cold rebuke. Why?? Because I believe that the prayers of the saints can bring TRUMP to CHRIST…… but that takes sacrifice and love and faith for us to believe this. NO body has mentioned how much our savior loves mister DONALD TRUMP and wants us to believe by the wooing of the holy spirits love can bring TRUMP unto JESUS CHRSIT. I love DONALD TRUMP. I know JESUS Christ loves him also, and that if GODS people pray for TRUMP GOD will answer our prayers for TRUMP. Can we not tell people we love DONALD TRUMP and will we will pray for him in that spirit of love for him and that out concern and love and faith in intercessions for mister TRUMP can and will bring him to CHRIST. MEN are brought to CHRIST in such ways when our love puts us on our knees and get us to believe well because we live well. In this way our rebuke no longer seems so cold and so harsh and correction is m now blended in with love and faith for the people we know and see lack truth. I person lay believe that TRUMP is a Nicodemus waiting in the wings . If we believe and pray that TRUMP comes into a teachable moment….. surely CHRSIT WILL ANSWER THOSE PRAYERS AND BRING TRUMP UNTO HIMSELF!!! Should Not we tell people that we love TRUMP enough to believe for his salvation. GODS love inserted in a conversation changes so many things. People will actually be more willing to take correction when they see it. my dear precious sister in CHRIST JESUS , your zeal for the truth is surely very admired by myself. I just discern that it need to balanced with some warmth and some love. We at many times need to be be the pusher and the puller at the same time. We can woo many people to the truth as we are bringing correction by also being tender in love for them. PRECIOUS this is something I myself have not perfected in my own walk with CHRIST…. because i am still a work in progress as we all are. GOD bless your heart precious , you have a great day.

  • This is the problem that I have as well in completely vilifying abortion even in cases such as the one described here could we be ignoring the bigger picture?

  • To be honest I don’t necessarily think of Trump as a Christian but I have been a believer since I was nine as a kid this would have been how I described my understanding of Jesus. He is our security and our strength.

  • I read Carl Rodgers for a living. Lol. But I’ve also heard the testimony of fellow Christians. Personally I could talk about Jesus all day. If you are a Christian telling someone, anyone, who you believe Jesus to be is the simplest thing in the world. But the one thing Trump couldn’t do. Wonder why?

  • But a twice-divorced, thrice-married, serial liar who has publicly boasted of assaulting women; routinely cheats employees, contractors, investors, and our government (Caesar) of moneys due them; proudly proclaims he has never asked the Lord for forgiveness; and who is a professional gambler (casino owners do not just host gamblers; they earn their profits by wagering the house money); is?
    Funny definition you have there.

  • Part of being a practicing Christian is saying the name of Jesus, not once have I as a Republican, and a Christian herd Donald John Trump utter Jesus’s name in a speech, maybe when asked a question about the Christ, will he say his name. What does Jesus tell us? you will be persecuted for my names sake, and you will be put into the situation of having to proclaim Jesus is Lord, and King, for If you are ashamed of me, so will I be ashamed of you when it comes to the Book Of Life, and I will know you not. ✝✝✝

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